What would I need to record a band on a PC?

[CKDragon]

My younger brother is not terribly computer literate but he can find his way around well enough. He told me today that he was considering buying an iMac for the purposes of recording his band's music. He said he used it before and it was easy.

Although I've never done this myself, I recommended that he do his research and I'm sure there's a cheaper option to do this on his existing mid-range powered PC. I asked him what he thought he would need and someone mentioned to him a sound card with a 1/4 input.

Is there a special prosumer or professional line that I should be looking for, considering the desired usage? Also, does anyone have a recommendation on recording software or a software suite that is used for this kind of thing?

I'm sure there's professional hardware/software that ranges into the thousands. But seeing as my goal is to save him from the cost of the iMac, the ideal total wouldn't be more than a couple hundred dollars. The cheaper the better. Please feel free to advise me on anything else we should know.

Thanks!

 

[dclive]

...but will he use it and enjoy it?

If he's familiar with the iMac, you can pick up last-gen iMacs for cheap, and even the new ones, very well equipped, are $1099 or so with 20" LCD...it's not cheap, but if it does what he wants, and it has the software he wants (Garage Band?) that alone could save him $75-$300...

What software would he need on a PC vs. the Mac?

 

[Schadenfroh]

Audacity

 

[PurdueRy]

I own the E-mu 1212m. You could get its little brother the 0404 for $100. It's not easy to use however.

There is also M-audio's offerings. Such as the 2496 and the 192. I don't know how easy they are to use buy stats wise the E-mu cards are better for the money.

 

[Modelworks]

I've used the maudio 1010LT in recording music and sermons for a church and it does a great job.

# 10x10 24-bit/96khz full-duplex recording interface. PCI host card with 2 external, color-coded breakout cables.
# 8x8 analog I/O, balanced on female XLR and unbalanced on gold-plated RCA connectors, with signal level adjustments selectable within the Delta Control Panel.
# S/PDIF digital I/O supports a variety of modes, including AC3 or DTS surround (PC only) and copy protection schemes can be set via the Delta Control Panel.
# 1x1 MIDI I/O on standard DIN jacks.
# External synchronization via word Clock I/O on BNC connectors.
# The two balanced XLR analog inputs can be set via hardware jumpers to accept microphone level or line level signals.

I highly recommend getting pro tools to go with it.
Both the software and the card will also work on an intel mac as well as a pc.
So if he ever does go to apple hardware you can still use it all.
Theres a company at www.americanmusical.com that will break up high cost purchases like pro tools into smaller payments.
http://www.americanmusical.com...m--i-MII-MPOWERED.html
http://www.americanmusical.com/item--i-MII-D1010LT.html

The card is 200.00 and pro tools for maudio is 249.00

So for 449.00 you can have studio quality results.

 

[CKDragon]

Wow, this is a lot of good information. I'll research it all and see if I have any follow-up questions but thanks a lot!

 

[coaster831]

Originally posted by: Modelworks
I've used the maudio 1010LT in recording music and sermons for a church and it does a great job.

# 10x10 24-bit/96khz full-duplex recording interface. PCI host card with 2 external, color-coded breakout cables.
# 8x8 analog I/O, balanced on female XLR and unbalanced on gold-plated RCA connectors, with signal level adjustments selectable within the Delta Control Panel.
# S/PDIF digital I/O supports a variety of modes, including AC3 or DTS surround (PC only) and copy protection schemes can be set via the Delta Control Panel.
# 1x1 MIDI I/O on standard DIN jacks.
# External synchronization via word Clock I/O on BNC connectors.
# The two balanced XLR analog inputs can be set via hardware jumpers to accept microphone level or line level signals.

I highly recommend getting pro tools to go with it.
Both the software and the card will also work on an intel mac as well as a pc.
So if he ever does go to apple hardware you can still use it all.
Theres a company at www.americanmusical.com that will break up high cost purchases like pro tools into smaller payments.
http://www.americanmusical.com...m--i-MII-MPOWERED.html
http://www.americanmusical.com/item--i-MII-D1010LT.html

The card is 200.00 and pro tools for maudio is 249.00

So for 449.00 you can have studio quality results.

There is no reason to use pro tools in this scenario (and note the version you are pointing to is not even a full version of pro tools). Using pro tools has nothing to do with studio quality recordings- and the m-audio devices, while perfect for home use, are never going to be used in a pro studio.

I would recommend an m-audio or emu usb device (the emu 1212m and m-audio audiophile series are both fine for beginner/semi-pro). Your choice will probably be based on how many inputs you want to record at once. Between the two, I would say the 1212m has better converters, but given the rest of the hardware in a beginner audio chain, it's not going to make a huge difference. Audacity, as mentioned above, is perfect software to get you started (and it's free!).

The platform (Apple/PC) and software you use has ZERO to do with the quality of the recording, although obviously user comfort with either platform has its benefits.

The most important things, in order:

- source
- room
- mic positioning/engineer skill
- microphone
- mic preamp (in your case, built into the interface card)
- D/A (in your case, the interface card)

Personally, I would start with buying a decent mic and mic preamp, then use a converter with the 1/8" line in on your current setup. With less than $200, you can get either a Studio Projects B-1 mic or a Shure SM-57 (lots of choices depending on your application) microphone, and a Studio Projects VTB-1 or a M-Audio DMP-3 preamp. Then you can work your way to better mics/pres/DAC's as your ear progresses. Also, this route doesn't tie you to a specific platform.

 

[CKDragon]

Originally posted by: coaster831
I would recommend an m-audio or emu usb device (the emu 1212m and m-audio audiophile series are both fine for beginner/semi-pro). Your choice will probably be based on how many inputs you want to record at once. Between the two, I would say the 1212m has better converters, but given the rest of the hardware in a beginner audio chain, it's not going to make a huge difference. Audacity, as mentioned above, is perfect software to get you started (and it's free!).

You mention a USB device, which I agree would actually be ideal so that he can move it from computer to computer easily. It appears that the emu 1212m PCI-based. Is there a USB version or are one of these (I was looking at the 0202 or 0404) acceptable since they seem to be in the same product line? Thanks again for your time and knowledge.

 

[coaster831]

Originally posted by: CKDragon

Originally posted by: coaster831
I would recommend an m-audio or emu usb device (the emu 1212m and m-audio audiophile series are both fine for beginner/semi-pro). Your choice will probably be based on how many inputs you want to record at once. Between the two, I would say the 1212m has better converters, but given the rest of the hardware in a beginner audio chain, it's not going to make a huge difference. Audacity, as mentioned above, is perfect software to get you started (and it's free!).

You mention a USB device, which I agree would actually be ideal so that he can move it from computer to computer easily. It appears that the emu 1212m PCI-based. Is there a USB version or are one of these (I was looking at the 0202 or 0404) acceptable since they seem to be in the same product line? Thanks again for your time and knowledge.

Sorry, I misspoke. The 1212m is not available as a USB device (the 1616m is, but it's more money than you need to spend). The 0404 is also available as USB and is mac compatible, as are the m-audio audiophile or the m-audio fast track pro. If you're settled on a PC solution, you can consider the PCI cards- you'll get a little more for your money. If you get the audiophile, you need to get an outboard preamp or mixer. The fast track and 0404 usb have preamps included. Good luck.

 

[Chapbass]

Originally posted by: coaster831

Originally posted by: CKDragon

Originally posted by: coaster831
I would recommend an m-audio or emu usb device (the emu 1212m and m-audio audiophile series are both fine for beginner/semi-pro). Your choice will probably be based on how many inputs you want to record at once. Between the two, I would say the 1212m has better converters, but given the rest of the hardware in a beginner audio chain, it's not going to make a huge difference. Audacity, as mentioned above, is perfect software to get you started (and it's free!).

You mention a USB device, which I agree would actually be ideal so that he can move it from computer to computer easily. It appears that the emu 1212m PCI-based. Is there a USB version or are one of these (I was looking at the 0202 or 0404) acceptable since they seem to be in the same product line? Thanks again for your time and knowledge.

Sorry, I misspoke. The 1212m is not available as a USB device (the 1616m is, but it's more money than you need to spend). The 0404 is also available as USB and is mac compatible, as are the m-audio audiophile or the m-audio fast track pro. If you're settled on a PC solution, you can consider the PCI cards- you'll get a little more for your money. If you get the audiophile, you need to get an outboard preamp or mixer. The fast track and 0404 usb have preamps included. Good luck.

+1 for just about everything Coaster has said in this thread. Getting a decent one or two mics and a dedicated preamp will do WONDERS for overall sound quality, and with better gear you *generally* have a little bit more room for error and still make it sound pretty listenable. Lesser quality stuff can still sound great in the right hands, but your margin of error is awfully small.


The studio projects mics are absolutely phenomenal for how much your spending. I havent even used their newer mics (I semi-sorta left the industry when they had just released their original C series mics), but ive heard even the entry level B series ones are awesome sounding.

SM57 isnt too bad either...i dont prefer it for vocals as much as some others do, but you can throw it up on pretty much any instrument and it sounds pretty darn good

Either way, get some of that foundation stuff in there, youll use that stuff no matter what.

 

[lamere]

If your brother has worked on a mac before, thought it was easy, and liked it and it gave him good results, let him get the mac.
There's a reason macs come with garageband and PC's dont. They are just better at music recording, and built to be.
i'd say dump the PC thought and get the mac. No new learning curve, and it'll be more stable anyway. My friend has all kinds of issues when recording on a PC, always locking up and giving him problems, right in the middle of recording.
He's ready to bite the bullet and get a mac also.

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: lamere
If your brother has worked on a mac before, thought it was easy, and liked it and it gave him good results, let him get the mac.
There's a reason macs come with garageband and PC's dont. They are just better at music recording, and built to be.
i'd say dump the PC thought and get the mac. No new learning curve, and it'll be more stable anyway. My friend has all kinds of issues when recording on a PC, always locking up and giving him problems, right in the middle of recording.
He's ready to bite the bullet and get a mac also.

There is no reason a PC can't be just as good at music recording as a mac. Especially considering the only real difference now is the OS. If your brother has a problem with a program locking up that may or may not be windows fault. However, it is most likely the program which is to blame.

 

[mshan]

Refurb Mac Mini from Apple Store?: http://www.fatwallet.com/forum...msgid=11195784&start=0

 

[Oyeve]

A good mic. Any computer. Mic is key.

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: CKDragon
He said he used it before and it was easy.

Exactly. Cheaper does not always equal better. You may be able to find him a cheaper PC and software combo, but then he may have to deal with a steeper learning curve or software that he doesn't like to use, or whatever else. If he's comfortable with the iMac, then that might actually be the best choice for him.

 

[KAZANI]

Originally posted by: Oyeve
A good mic. Any computer. Mic is key.

After :music: talent of course. Wherever there is too much worrying about the equipment you know people's music is worthless and they only aim to make it sellable. Does this band have a demo somewhere on the web to see? Maybe CKDragon can save his brother the cost of all equipment afterall.

 

[CKDragon]

I know this thread is pretty darn old by this point, but I wanted to thank everyone. He decided on the M-Audio 1010LT and I installed it for him. It appears we got it set up properly with Audacity and a few other recording apps for him to try.

It looks like the learning curve is a bit more than he expected but hopefully it will be a good, educational experience for him. If he tries it for the next month or so and doesn't like it, I'll eBay the card for him. He got a good deal, so from the looks of current auction prices he wouldn't lose much in the process. In my opinion, it is worth risking a ~$20-30 net loss doing it with a PC before he spends a hefty chunk more going the iMac route.

So thanks again, I appreciate all your advice!

Originally posted by: KAZANI

Originally posted by: Oyeve
A good mic. Any computer. Mic is key.

After :music: talent of course. Wherever there is too much worrying about the equipment you know people's music is worthless and they only aim to make it sellable. Does this band have a demo somewhere on the web to see? Maybe CKDragon can save his brother the cost of all equipment afterall.

Heh, well I've never heard the rest of the band play live, but we don't really have similar tastes in music so I probably won't like their final product.

However, it is obvious he has guitar skill from hearing him play mainstream songs that I do know. It's just that their original music probably isn't my thing.

 

[T9D]

If he goes through a PC make sure he has Windows Vista. XP runs through the kernal and it drasticly affects the sound. Vista is Substantially better sounding. (I've done a lot of A/B comparing, with a good system it's like night and day).

There is no need to get a mac for recording. The PC has everything he'd need.

 

[coaster831]

Originally posted by: v1001
If he goes through a PC make sure he has Windows Vista. XP runs through the kernal and it drasticly affects the sound. Vista is Substantially better sounding. (I've done a lot of A/B comparing, with a good system it's like night and day).

There is no need to get a mac for recording. The PC has everything he'd need.

Please explain further why Vista is better than XP for recording. There should be zero difference in the sound quality between two otherwise equivalent systems. If you can cite some sources, all the better.