What was the greatest pre-missile age BATTLESHIP of all time?

[MadRat]

Please only consider ACTIVE battleships, not necessarily ones that ever fought, but at one time they should have been active and have excluded missile armaments.

Could it have been the USS Iowa, the USS Missouri, the USS New Jersey, or the USS Wisconsin?

Could it have been the IJN Musashi or IJN Yamato?

Perhaps it was the Richelieu, Jean Bart, HMS King James V, HMS Lord Nelson, or HMS Prince of Wales?

Maybe even the RN Vittorio Veneto, RN Littorio, RN Impero, or RN Roma?

Surely some will believe the DKM Bismarck, DKM Scharnhorst, or DKM Tirpitz?

 

[GasX]

very subjective, but I am going with Bismarck

 

[Mo0o]

goo bismarck, big mofo

 

[Orsorum]

I'd say the Bizmarck, but I don't remember enough about it other than it sank the Hood with a lucky shot to the Hood's magazine stores (I think) and was then crippled by a single torpedoe, then was eventually hunted down by the British Navy.

 

[notfred]

USS Missouri.

 

[FoBoT]

IJN Yamato

it had bigger guns i believe

 

[OokiiNeko]

Yamato - 18" guns.

Although the Italians WW2 BBs did have excellent and accurate guns, never used effectively.

 

[Ender]

Originally posted by: Orsorum
I'd say the Bizmarck, but I don't remember enough about it other than it sank the Hood with a lucky shot to the Hood's magazine stores (I think) and was then crippled by a single torpedoe, then was eventually hunted down by the British Navy.

The missle that hit the Bismarck's rudder was an extremely lucky shot. Bismarck took down Britain's flagship with ease and so the entire Britain navy ganged up on it because they knew no single ship could take down that goliath of a boat.

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: Ender

Originally posted by: Orsorum
I'd say the Bizmarck, but I don't remember enough about it other than it sank the Hood with a lucky shot to the Hood's magazine stores (I think) and was then crippled by a single torpedoe, then was eventually hunted down by the British Navy.

The missle that hit the Bismarck's rudder was an extremely lucky shot. Bismarck took down Britain's flagship with ease and so the entire Britain navy ganged up on it because they knew no single ship could take down that goliath of a boat.

I didn't mean to use the term "single torpedo" pejoratively, I realize that it was a lucky shot, by a lone aircraft, and that the navy did have to trap her to stop her.

 

[Rudee]

Yamoto was the biggest of them all.

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: Rudee
Yamoto was the biggest of them all.

Pics?

 

[TheBoyBlunder]

Originally posted by: Ender

Originally posted by: Orsorum
I'd say the Bizmarck, but I don't remember enough about it other than it sank the Hood with a lucky shot to the Hood's magazine stores (I think) and was then crippled by a single torpedoe, then was eventually hunted down by the British Navy.

The missle that hit the Bismarck's rudder was an extremely lucky shot. Bismarck took down Britain's flagship with ease and so the entire Britain navy ganged up on it because they knew no single ship could take down that goliath of a boat.

It was a torpedo that hit Bismarck, not a missile. The only reason Bismarck took down HMS Hood was because Hood's deck armor was thinner than it should have been. It was built as a heavy cruiser (I think as a consequence of the Washington Naval Treaty of 1926), not a battleship.

But yes, you're right. The British took out Bismarck only by ganging up on it. Well, that and a little bit of luck.

If you want to discuss British battleships, you should look at the first few ship classes listed here.

This guy thinks the USS Iowa was/is the best pre-missile battleship. I have to agree with him, he makes a pretty convincing argument.

edited for redundancy.
edited for redundancy.

 

[GasX]

Originally posted by: OokiiNeko
Yamato - 18" guns.



Although the Italians WW2 BBs did have excellent and accurate guns, never used effectively.

Do you know why the new Italian navy has glass botoom boats?


So they can see the old italian navy...

 

[samgau]

I vote for Yamato.... it took a lot to sink it... a whole lot...

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Rudee
Yamoto was the biggest of them all.

the yamato was so big that the japanese ambassador to whatever could truthfully deny that japan was building battleships in the largest class proscribed by treaty... the thing was like 10,000 tons more massive than any other battleship... iowa class could probably run circles around it, though, those things are super fast

 

[K1052]

USS Iowa

Fast 32+ knots sustained, the 16 inch guns mounted were more than enough to penetrate the armor of the period, and had a crapload of 5 inch and AAA guns.

Edit: edited to use name instead of class, though the important specs of the Iowa class dont really differ.

 

[Mermaidman]

Iowa class was the best. It had the most modern electronics during WW2 and in most experts' opinions, would have beaten the other ships even with slightly smaller caliber guns and thinner armor.

edit: Yamato was the prettiest I still have a half-finished plastic model of it sitting in the garage--It's almost 3 feet long!

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: Mo0o
goo bismarck, big mofo

thats what i woudl have said

 

[Pastfinder]

The Yamato was by far the biggest ship with the largest guns. The Iowa, however, had more accurate main rifled cannon with greater velocity. The Bismarck was extremely well built and could take (IMO) a great deal of punishment. Hmmmm, I'll go with the Yamato out of sheer size and numbers.

 

[BDawg]

USS North Carolina!

At the time of her commissioning on 9 April 1941, she was considered the world?s greatest sea weapon. Armed with nine 16-inch/45 caliber guns in three turrets and twenty 5-inch/38 caliber guns in ten twin mounts, NORTH CAROLINA proved a formidable weapons platform. Her wartime complement consisted of 144 commissioned officers and 2,195 enlisted men, including about 100 Marines.

During World War II, NORTH CAROLINA participated in every major naval offensive in the Pacific area of operations and earned 15 battle stars. In the Battle of the Eastern Solomon?s Islands in August of 1942, the Battleship?s anti-aircraft barrage helped save the carrier ENTERPRISE, thereby establishing the primary role of the fast battleship as protector of aircraft carriers. One of her Kingfisher pilots performed heroically during the strike on Truk when he rescued ten downed Navy aviators on 30 April 1944. In all, NORTH CAROLINA carried out nine shore bombardments, sank an enemy troopship, destroyed at least 24 enemy aircraft, and assisted in shooting down many more. Her anti-aircraft guns helped to halt or frustrate scores of attacks on aircraft carriers. She steamed over 300,000 miles. Although Japanese radio announcements claimed six times that NORTH CAROLINA had been sunk, she survived many close calls and near misses - such as the Japanese torpedo which slammed into the Battleship?s hull on 15 September 1942. A quick response on the part of the crew allowed the mighty Ship to keep up with the fleet. By war?s end, the Ship lost ten men in action and had 67 wounded.

 

[UNCjigga]

Another vote for the Bismarck...that ship was insane!!!

That shot to her rudder left her running around in circles like an injured lamb as practically the entire British Atlantic fleet surrounded her.

 

[kage69]

Actually, there is still quite a bit of conjecture as to who really sank the Bismarck. Kreigsmarine sailors onboard during the Bismarck's final hours said the captain had them plant scuttling charges along the keel, and that the order was given to blow them once it was apparent the end was very close. That's not to say the Brits wouldn't have sunk her. She had no steering thanks to that torpedo to the rudder, and was seriously outnumbered. I'm inclined to believe the German accounts, der Fuhrer was touchy about his big toys getting sent to the bottom by the enemy (remember the Graf Spee?)

The Yamato was a serious ship, no doubt, but Japanese vessels of the period kinda irk me, what with so much wood being used in the construction. My favorite WW2 ship would be a Fletcher class destroyer, but as far as teh big boys go, I'd take the Iowa. Mobility keeps you alive, on any battlefield.

 

[adlep]

Bump,
My favorite would be the USS Iowa class, just because they have been in service up until the First Gulf War :Q

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Mwilding

Originally posted by: OokiiNeko
Yamato - 18" guns.



Although the Italians WW2 BBs did have excellent and accurate guns, never used effectively.

Do you know why the new Italian navy has glass botoom boats?


So they can see the old italian navy...

LOL!!! That's a good one.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: kage69
Actually, there is still quite a bit of conjecture as to who really sank the Bismarck. Kreigsmarine sailors onboard during the Bismarck's final hours said the captain had them plant scuttling charges along the keel, and that the order was given to blow them once it was apparent the end was very close. That's not to say the Brits wouldn't have sunk her. She had no steering thanks to that torpedo to the rudder, and was seriously outnumbered. I'm inclined to believe the German accounts, der Fuhrer was touchy about his big toys getting sent to the bottom by the enemy (remember the Graf Spee?)



The Yamato was a serious ship, no doubt, but Japanese vessels of the period kinda irk me, what with so much wood being used in the construction. My favorite WW2 ship would be a Fletcher class destroyer, but as far as teh big boys go, I'd take the Iowa. Mobility keeps you alive, on any battlefield.

The last survey done on the Bismark seemed to conclude that she was scuttled. The British torpedoes had failed to effectively cause serious damage to the hull. Though above the water line she is riddled with holes and the superstructure took a lot of damage.