What to look for in Krav Maga training

[Jeff7181]

Not looking for a debate on which martial art is the best for whatever reason, I've decided I'd like to start learning Krav Maga and now I'm trying to find some quality instruction.

The problem is I don't know what makes a good Krav Maga instructor and what makes a bad one. I've heard/read random tips and opinions on the Internet and even gotten the opinion of a few people who are proficient in other martial arts. However, I've heard statements such as:

"If the school asks you to wear anything other than plain clothes, including whatever shoes or boots you walk in with, they're less about self defense and more about show/competition."

"If the instructor has you doing general physical fitness/exercise drills, they're wasting your time and money."

How true are those two specific statements?

What should I be looking for? Obviously I'll end up just having to try one at some point, but I'd like not to have to bounce between schools to find a good one. I'm most interested in Krav Maga for self defense training.


I found a few places that are within the distance I'm willing to travel:

http://www.kravmaganovi.com/
http://kravmagadetroit.com/cms/

 

[z1ggy]

I've only done a tiny bit of krav maga. Most of my experience is in jiu jitsu and muy thai, and a bit of wrestling and judo.

I would agree with what you've said. There shouldn't be "competition" or contests really, if that makes sense. It should be your instructor showing you a certain thing a few times on a volunteer, then you partnering up and practicing many times.

Although, many of my BJJ and muy thai classes had "optional" physical fitness parts when the main instruction was over. I always did them.

I always wanted to get more into krav maga because I feel it really helps you out in "real world" application. Yeah sure, BJJ is fun, but there are strict rules and guidelines to follow and it's always 1 v 1. A great BJJ competitor would probably have a much harder time out and about in the real world than a person who has little BJJ much heavy krav maga training.

Testicle/eye/throat jabs are very effective out on the street, but totally illegal and not allowed in BJJ.

 

[Jeff7181]

I've only done a tiny bit of krav maga. Most of my experience is in jiu jitsu and muy thai, and a bit of wrestling and judo.

I would agree with what you've said. There shouldn't be "competition" or contests really, if that makes sense. It should be your instructor showing you a certain thing a few times on a volunteer, then you partnering up and practicing many times.

Although, many of my BJJ and muy thai classes had "optional" physical fitness parts when the main instruction was over. I always did them.

Yeah, I think the thought behind it was that you don't have to be in great shape to learn to defend yourself and spending time in a Krav Maga class trying to get rid of your love handles is a waste of time and money. If you're out of shape, you can do some other sort of training to improve general physical fitness.

 

[z1ggy]

Yeah, I think the thought behind it was that you don't have to be in great shape to learn to defend yourself and spending time in a Krav Maga class trying to get rid of your love handles is a waste of time and money. If you're out of shape, you can do some other sort of training to improve general physical fitness.

I agree.

 

[smackababy]

The first test of the qualifications of any martial arts instructor is whether or not you can defeat them in a fight. If you can, they don't have a lot to teach you.


Also, on a more serious note, just Yelp the places and google the instructors.

 

[Jeff7181]

The first test of the qualifications of any martial arts instructor is whether or not you can defeat them in a fight. If you can, they don't have a lot to teach you.


Also, on a more serious note, just Yelp the places and google the instructors.

Thanks for the tips.

I'm hoping someone who's actually practiced Krav Maga can comment on things good instructors do or bad instructors do... or don't do.

 

[Jeff7181]

Looks like this one is actually run by an Israeli who served in the IDF Special Forces. Maybe I'll give them a call...

http://ikmmichigan.com

 

[Charlie98]

I have trained in both Krav Maga and it's predecessor, the Israeli 'FIGHT' System (Haganah.) I'm lucky, my Krav Maga instructor is also my TaeKwon-Do instructor. Both my daughter and I train together.

The way our classes go, a 60-minute session is split into 3 20-minute segments... 1) warm up (shadow boxing/cardio, ) 2) specific instruction and partner/3 or 4-way drills (specific to Krav Maga, ) and 3) continuation of general KM drills.

Contrary to what you may think, the 'warm up/cardio' is not necessarily to get rid of your love handles, it's to teach muscle memory. When you are presented with a threat and you have an adrenaline dump, you lose your fine motor skills and your default 'survival' instinct takes over... relying on basic, simple muscle memory.

Trying to find a good instructor may be a chore. If any school/instructor won't let you try at least one or two lessons (preferably 1 week) to see if it's right for you, then they don't really care about you and just want your money. If you do attend a workout or two and it just doesn't seem right... move on. Yes, it can be time consuming. You also need to find out the instructor's credentials. How long has he been teaching KM? Other Martial Arts? How long in this location? Is he teaching all the classes, or does he use other instructors (in lieu of him or her being there, not as assistants)?

I have over 10 years in my Martial Arts training... I wouldn't want to waste 10 years by training somewhere I wasn't comfortable... It's worth the effort to find a school that fits you and your style and purpose.

 

[Jeff7181]

I have trained in both Krav Maga and it's predecessor, the Israeli 'FIGHT' System (Haganah.) I'm lucky, my Krav Maga instructor is also my TaeKwon-Do instructor. Both my daughter and I train together.

The way our classes go, a 60-minute session is split into 3 20-minute segments... 1) warm up (shadow boxing/cardio, ) 2) specific instruction and partner/3 or 4-way drills (specific to Krav Maga, ) and 3) continuation of general KM drills.

Contrary to what you may think, the 'warm up/cardio' is not necessarily to get rid of your love handles, it's to teach muscle memory. When you are presented with a threat and you have an adrenaline dump, you lose your fine motor skills and your default 'survival' instinct takes over... relying on basic, simple muscle memory.

Trying to find a good instructor may be a chore. If any school/instructor won't let you try at least one or two lessons (preferably 1 week) to see if it's right for you, then they don't really care about you and just want your money. If you do attend a workout or two and it just doesn't seem right... move on. Yes, it can be time consuming. You also need to find out the instructor's credentials. How long has he been teaching KM? Other Martial Arts? How long in this location? Is he teaching all the classes, or does he use other instructors (in lieu of him or her being there, not as assistants)?

I have over 10 years in my Martial Arts training... I wouldn't want to waste 10 years by training somewhere I wasn't comfortable... It's worth the effort to find a school that fits you and your style and purpose.

Thanks for your input, I really appreciate it.

I understand proper training includes a warmup - I'm not worried about that, especially as a beginner. I'll need to improve my conditioning to get beyond basics. I would be worried though if 40 minutes of the time was spent running laps and doing pushups and situps and pullups and burpees and only 20 minutes was spent on actual skills training.

In your experience, how aggressive will/should a beginner class get? Eventually, I would like to experience some (near) full contact training and know what it feels like to be punched in the face and then have to defend myself, but I don't want that to happen on day 1 or week 1. I've got a lot to learn before that... or at least that's what I think. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe that should happen early in training so you get used to it from the very start and it's not such a shock to be hit. That last school I sent a link to says MMA-style gloves and a mouth guard are the only protective gear required to take the beginner class so I suspect there's not going to be any full contact sparring until Level 2 where they require full protective gear.

 

[Jeff7181]

I signed up for a trial class at this place: http://ikmmichigan.com

I'm excited. Never done anything like this before. Never even had a gym membership.

 

[Charlie98]

I signed up for a trial class at this place: http://ikmmichigan.com

I'm excited. Never done anything like this before. Never even had a gym membership.

Good luck... keep an open mind. Please update this thread on how it is going and your impressions.

Here's the thing... In TaeKwon-Do, for example, you don't punch to the head at all until you are a Red belt and above (2 years minimum.) At a lower rank (rank = experience) you are assumed to not have enough control to be able to hit to the head and not, at least in our school, pop someone in the face or try to tear their head off. Biggest mistake a lower rank will make is to hit with too much power/not enough control.

In KM, there is a lot of bag work... hitting bags and paddles/mits as opposed to beating on each other. I would not expect at Level 1 to be sparring with direct contact, and I would be suspicious if they did. And, understand, unless they have a separate class for those that want to go hard, you probably won't see it much... but every school is different. I'm almost 49 years old, I have to get up every day and go to work... a job that is very physical. I don't want to bust myself up either in TKD or KM and not be able to work, so I'm very sensitive about stuff like that.

Here is something else... a little different. Research the FAST system and, if you think it might interest you, give it a try. It's a one-time deal, not a regular scheduled class, but I have found it invaluable... so much so I have been to 3 classes and have been the 'Bullet Man' twice (I'm 6'2" so I present a formidable opponent.) But you go on full force against 1, 2, 3 opponents after an as artificial adrenaline dump as we can produce. We even included a gun and knife module in our last class. Something worth considering.

 

[Jeff7181]

Good luck... keep an open mind. Please update this thread on how it is going and your impressions.

Here's the thing... In TaeKwon-Do, for example, you don't punch to the head at all until you are a Red belt and above (2 years minimum.) At a lower rank (rank = experience) you are assumed to not have enough control to be able to hit to the head and not, at least in our school, pop someone in the face or try to tear their head off. Biggest mistake a lower rank will make is to hit with too much power/not enough control.

In KM, there is a lot of bag work... hitting bags and paddles/mits as opposed to beating on each other. I would not expect at Level 1 to be sparring with direct contact, and I would be suspicious if they did. And, understand, unless they have a separate class for those that want to go hard, you probably won't see it much... but every school is different. I'm almost 49 years old, I have to get up every day and go to work... a job that is very physical. I don't want to bust myself up either in TKD or KM and not be able to work, so I'm very sensitive about stuff like that.

Here is something else... a little different. Research the FAST system and, if you think it might interest you, give it a try. It's a one-time deal, not a regular scheduled class, but I have found it invaluable... so much so I have been to 3 classes and have been the 'Bullet Man' twice (I'm 6'2" so I present a formidable opponent.) But you go on full force against 1, 2, 3 opponents after an as artificial adrenaline dump as we can produce. We even included a gun and knife module in our last class. Something worth considering.

This school is new, and as a result they say all they have is a beginner class, no intermediate or advanced yet. However, they do offer private instruction. Once I have the trial class I'll know more about the membership and how classes are organized. My fear is that the majority of people there might be there for the exercise. Once I learn the basics, I want to get punched, kicked, pushed around, knocked down, thrown... I want to be familiar with what all that is like so I'm not shocked and stunned if it ever happened to me on the street. Seems like this instructor can take it there when his students are ready.

 

[smackababy]

This school is new, and as a result they say all they have is a beginner class, no intermediate or advanced yet. However, they do offer private instruction. Once I have the trial class I'll know more about the membership and how classes are organized. My fear is that the majority of people there might be there for the exercise. Once I learn the basics, I want to get punched, kicked, pushed around, knocked down, thrown... I want to be familiar with what all that is like so I'm not shocked and stunned if it ever happened to me on the street. Seems like this instructor can take it there when his students are ready.

From everything I've learned doing martial arts, if they aren't using contact, it isn't worth it, especially for self defense. One of my instructors once said "If you don't know what it feels like to be punched in the face, in a real fight, getting punched in the face will stop you." And, that seems true.

 

[Jeff7181]

From everything I've learned doing martial arts, if they aren't using contact, it isn't worth it, especially for self defense. One of my instructors once said "If you don't know what it feels like to be punched in the face, in a real fight, getting punched in the face will stop you." And, that seems true.

When I inquired about the trial class, they said no gear (even a mouth guard) is required for the trial class. However, when becoming a member, the following gear is required: mouth guard, groin guard, MMA training gloves, and shin guards. While they don't have a gi, it looks like they may require that one of their t-shirts be purchased and worn for class.

*EDIT* It also sounds like due to the school only having been open for 6 months in this location, they're still fine tuning their classes based on what students want to get out of them. I'm really excited to see what it's like. I wish I had signed up for a class sooner than Monday now.

 

[Jeff7181]

Had my first class last night. Monday was a bust because I got stuck dealing with an emergency at work.

It was a good class, I enjoyed it. If I needed any confirmation that I need to work on my conditioning, I got it last night. I was basically put right into class with the others, there were 4 of us total. We spent 15-20 minutes doing warmup drills and then got into the technical lesson for the day, which was defending against basically a bear-hug from behind, which involved the attacker lifting the defender off the ground. That was a problem for me having a bad knee - it feels unstable with much more than my own bodyweight on it, so the instructor stepped in to lift my partner for that part. The rest of the class was basically just building on that.

I'm happy with how it went. I started a membership and bought the gear and plan to go a couple times a week for the next month or so. If I still like it, I might bump my subscription up to the unlimited level so I can go more often.

The instructor seems really good. He was able to demonstrate the techniques well and explain them well so everyone understood.

 

[smackababy]

Don't you think Jeff7181's a little old to be taking karate? - Rick James

 

[Charlie98]

The instructor seems really good. He was able to demonstrate the techniques well and explain them well so everyone understood.

Rock on! :biggrin:

 

[Jeff7181]

Rock on! :biggrin:

Wish I could, I've only made it to 1 of 3 classes I signed up for. Work and personal life getting in the way. Didn't think it would be this difficult to get to the classes since they're right on my way home from work.

Hopefully they don't think I'm a slacker.

 

[inachu]

I agree in not debating but to let you know you should go with the pure form and eldest.
Let youtube be the answer. kungfu vs krav maga or even kung fu vs marine or even kung fu VS UFC/MMA

 

[inachu]

From all the Krav Maga videos I ave seen it seems to be less of a style but used for quick take downs.

 

[Jeff7181]

From all the Krav Maga videos I ave seen it seems to be less of a style but used for quick take downs.

Sorta, it's relatively new and uses lots of basic, simple and natural movements. The idea being to inflict the most damage in the shortest amount of time with as little effort as possible. Hence the ubiquitous ball strikes, eye gouging, etc.

Depends what you mean by take downs, though. 99% of the Krav Maga instruction I've seen involves avoiding taking the fight to the ground. Putting someone on the ground quickly and preparing for other attackers, however, is one of the main goals in the more advanced teachings.

What I like about it is the practicality. I'm not real interested in the "art" or the "discipline" that a lot of other styles use. I'm more interested in learning techniques to defend myself if I'm ever in the situation where there's a threat too close for a pistol to be effective.

For the record, I don't care what anyone thinks YouTube videos prove. I have no desire to learn Kung Fu or Judo or Wing Chun. I have no desire to compete and I have no desire to seek out other martial artists and challenge them to a fight.

 

[Jeff7181]

Finally made it to a second class this morning. We learned another technique to defend an attack from behind. Basically look behind while protecting yourself, turn 180 degrees and throw a hammer punch to the head, step to the outside completing the turn and continue striking while moving around the attacker, eventually facing the same direction as you started.

Then we focused more on footwork and learned to turn to the inside. Then we practiced the technique on a heavy bag and did various drills with that, then basically chased each other around the room with a pad and the instructor would yell stop and the defender would have to then attack the pad and keep going.

Really fun, really tiring. The movements, especially the footwork, was a lot to think about and I got confused and stepped inside when I was supposed to step outside or whatever, but it's only my second class so I'm sure I did fine and will only get better with time and practice.

 

[Charlie98]

From all the Krav Maga videos I ave seen it seems to be less of a style but used for quick take downs.

Krav isn't really a martial art discipline, it's a self-defense technique.

Sorta, it's relatively new and uses lots of basic, simple and natural movements. The idea being to inflict the most damage in the shortest amount of time with as little effort as possible. Hence the ubiquitous ball strikes, eye gouging, etc.

Correct. If they ever explain about how your brain works after an adrenaline dump (when put in a situation where you are threatened,) you will understand why Krav is limited to basic gross motor skill moves. Further, the eye and ball strikes...? The only two places you can't 'up armor' your body is... your eyes and your crotch (unless you live with a cup on.)

Really fun, really tiring. The movements, especially the footwork, was a lot to think about and I got confused and stepped inside when I was supposed to step outside or whatever, but it's only my second class so I'm sure I did fine and will only get better with time and practice.

Sounds like me... turning the wrong direction. :whiste: One of the reasons I'm not very good at BJJ. If you are going once or twice a week, it will take about 2 months for you to get comfortable with the footwork, where you won't have to consciously think about what it is you are doing. Keep at it!

 

[Jeff7181]

Sounds like me... turning the wrong direction. :whiste: One of the reasons I'm not very good at BJJ. If you are going once or twice a week, it will take about 2 months for you to get comfortable with the footwork, where you won't have to consciously think about what it is you are doing. Keep at it!

Yeah... right now I've only been able to go once a week. Just the way my schedule and their schedule has worked out. I plan to at least do twice a week and if I find myself able to go more I'll probably bump my membership up to their unlimited level and go 3-4 times a week.

But, almost every night I've been practicing the footwork and the movements on my own.

 

[Jeff7181]

Figured I'd post an update now that I've been to 5 classes. (had to take a week off to go out of town for work)

So far I've learned defense against a bear hug from behind, defense against an attacker from behind (not necessarily a bear hug), kick to the groin defense, inside punch defense and a second groin kick defense.

I'm loving the class. I still can't get used to "fighting" against women. I can't help holding back. I've already punched someone in the chin and it was disturbing... for me, not her, she was fine and just kept going.

It's been a little difficult to go to classes, and will get more difficult as the Michigan winter sets in, but I'm going to keep my membership going and get to as many classes as I can.