What is the *REAL* size of the U.S. Military? Including contractors in Iraq..

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Deleted member 4644

Is it prudent to include the contractors -- truck drivers, security officers, construction workers -- in the size calculations of the U.S. Military?

In the 1940s and 1950s, those all jobs were UNQUESTIONABLY done by men in uniform: Army truck drivers, MPs and Navy Seabees.

Is it acceptable to say that our military is X number of men if we are absolutely, physically reliant on a huge force of for-profit contractors?

Does it not make sense to include them in our force size estimates?
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
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It might be prudent but we'd first have to know how many there were. I've not seen anything approaching a decent estimate as to the # of contractors in Iraq that are, essentially, privatized military (Blackwater types) or logistical support. Rumsfeld's vision of a leaner military has resulted in the privatization of many aspects which only fattens the wallets of the defense contractors.
 

imported_Aelius

Golden Member
Apr 25, 2004
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Originally posted by: conjur
It might be prudent but we'd first have to know how many there were. I've not seen anything approaching a decent estimate as to the # of contractors in Iraq that are, essentially, privatized military (Blackwater types) or logistical support. Rumsfeld's vision of a leaner military has resulted in the privatization of many aspects which only fattens the wallets of the defense contractors.

That's exactly how government works but they couldn't do it without popular support. I don't mean what we see now but the steps that were taken to start the whole process.

It's the same with anything. People are polled about what government suddenly considers a hot topic. Say size of government and its cost. Listen cause this is how you hoodwink tens of millions of people out of more money and have them re-elect you for it.

First you get a figure on how much it is. Polls usually don't contain this information because it would be an obvious plant. Instead you have the various parties fund marketing firms to mass market this information to the entire country. Once you have a couple of hundred articles and a few dozen TV spots and maybe a documentary or two you pull out the poll. Sometimes this isn't even needed but it happens.

So you get the poll and you fill out on how naive...erm I mean shocked you are about the cost of government and based on what you know (which has been jackhammered into your skull for who knows how long through the mass media) you put a big sloppy X next to Yes... government costs are out of control and need to be slashed drasticly.

You let the media take it from there. Once enough support is built up you pull out that big ax and start swinging. The more you cut the better you look. But you don't just stop at cutting temp jobs. You also cut the full time jobs too. Now you look like a hero to your supporters who pat you on the back for a job well done.

Of course now you have to fill those full time positions because they are neccessary for the continued function of government. Well that's what a contract is for. The fact that it can cost far more to contract then to have it in house is hardly any concern of yours. It's not your money. Besides nobody pays any attention to contracts that cost only a few million a year. Especially since you slashed the budget by how many billions? Even if they looked closely you likely cut deep enough to actually reduce the cost of government somewhat even with the massive contracts but perhaps not.

This is where hiding money comes in. If you aren't good at hiding money you probably shouldn't be in politics in any major party.

I mean how does a province, speaking of Canada as an example, misscalculate its budget by over 5 billion?

Sorry but I felt like ranting.
 

MadRat

Lifer
Oct 14, 1999
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Interesting. Could a large army of modern mercenaries overthrow a government, too? Would sure make attacking Iran much easier. /tongue in cheek

(Just-to-be-Clear Note: I think an invasion of Iran is totally unwarranted.)
 

imported_Aelius

Golden Member
Apr 25, 2004
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Originally posted by: MadRat
Interesting. Could a large army of modern mercenaries overthrow a government, too? Would sure make attacking Iran much easier. /tongue in cheek

(Just-to-be-Clear Note: I think an invasion of Iran is totally unwarranted.)

You don't need a large army of your own. All you need is money. Everything else goes with it.

Look at how the Taliban was beaten in Afghanistan. You had a few units from the regional SFG advise, train, assist and otherwise give aid/support and supply to the Northern Alliance.

It was done in Iraq as well but it wasn't followed through. The CIA botched that one because they were by no means equiped to handle an operation like that. I'm not sure why they did it. This was many years ago. I don't mean during the 2nd Gulf War.
 

tommywishbone

Platinum Member
May 11, 2005
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I'd guess there are between 250,000-300,000 total Americans in Iraq today, with another 100,000 Americans within 100 miles of the Iraq border, directly participating in the current Iraq debacle.

Edit: Because I can't spell to save my life.
 

zephyrprime

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
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I wish we would call some of those guys by their proper name - mercenaries - rather than use the term "contractors".
 

PELarson

Platinum Member
Mar 27, 2001
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Originally posted by: zephyrprime
I wish we would call some of those guys by their proper name - mercenaries - rather than use the term "contractors".

If not mercenaries how about Hessians!