What happens to nvidia?

[SolMiester]

Whatever troll, PhysX on AMD hardware is runnin on the CPU and uses nVidias GPU for acceleration, talk about apples/orange comparison, but with it off, look at these results with PhysX Off and enjoy the show.


The HD 5870 is a match for the far more expensive and power hungry GTX 480 and the HD 5970 obliterates the GTX 480, heck, even the HD 5850 is close to it, hard to swallow right? An old ass GTX 285 outperforming the GTX 460 1GB :awe: Need a beer?

And what is your point?, previous post, you were lying about performance hit, now your waffling on about a $600 card obliterating a $400 dollar card?

Lets see what the performance is with it on shall we...

http://www.techspot.com/review/312-mafia2-performance/page6.html

I'm a troll because i disagree with you?, or because I laughed when you starting on with the e-penis, or because like many think ATi\AMD has a 2nd rate software team?

 

[evolucion8]

And what is your point?, previous post, you were lying about performance hit, now your waffling on about a $600 card obliterating a $400 dollar card?

Lets see what the performance is with it on shall we...

http://www.techspot.com/review/312-mafia2-performance/page6.html

I'm a troll because i disagree with you?, or because I laughed when you starting on with the e-penis, or because like many think ATi\AMD has a 2nd rate software team?

LOL that's the best that you could do? An GTX 260 beating the HD 5970, man you wish, obviously PhysX is running on the CPU bottlenecking severely all AMD cards, seems that some AMD employee tried to force you to do something unnatural like using your X1950 PRO as a face scrubber and that's where your trauma comes from. Get help :biggrin:


--------------------------
Do you not understand previous comments about NO PERSONAL ATTACKS

Common Courtesy
AT Administrator

 

[Kenmitch]

Nerd Fight!...No pun intended

 

[BenSkywalker]

Are they gonna survive this or could nvidia become what amd CPU division have become?

This quarter outside of the defective chip charge they profited ~$40Million. I think a company that profits ~$13 Million dollars a month can survive. This is in the climate of them 'failing', not being competitive, not having parts out to the market, and prior to them making a major push into a far larger market then consumer graphics and chipsets combined. By comparison, AMD loses hundreds of millions of dollars on a regular basis, can't vaguely compete with nV's cash or liquidity. On a business basis, right now, AMD is far closer to failing then nVidia(not that I think that is going to happen in the least, but strictly on a business level AMD isn't close).

Mercury research is far more realistic than such ghost link that looks like one of these dodgy stock-picking investment spam operations.

JPR has been the top research oranization for the PC graphics market for many, many years. Their reports run ~$4.5K each and they have been around a lot longer then AT. You can think of them as you will, but they do the same thing Mercury does.

Well, it will impact nVidia's bottom line for sure in the graphic card market overall, AMD releasing a new lineup of cards when nVidia hasn't finished yet their Fermi based cards will impact nVidia and its market share, but in the professional and HPC, we will have to wait and see, I doubt that we will see significant strides from AMD's part. nVidia will hold tight such market.

Depending on how good their yields are and how fast they ramp, launching the 6x00 parts could help nV out considerably. I'm not saying that will happen, but if AMD focuses their 40nm capacity on the 6x00 parts and it forces them to scale back 5x00 production and yields don't go as smoothly, nV is going to end up picking up business by default. People may think that sounds absurd but try and keep in mind nV has a bunch of G92 based parts that are still selling very well- just because a new generation comes out doesn't mean the old ones stop selling in an instant. Obviously that is a risk every company normally faces, the interesting situation in this scenario is that AMD is still selling parts higher then launch MSRP and is plannin on replace them. In the tech industry that would be considerd 'shockingly stupid business 101'- of course we benefit from it so it's not like I'm complaining, it's just very, very poor business.

nvidia's roadmap is ok for now, but they'll be in trouble when/if amd and/or intel decide to really target the hpc market.

So you don't consider a few billion dollars a real effort? Between Itanic and Larrabee, I'd say Intel has put in 'real' effort at the HPC market, they have just been abject failures at it. That isn't to say nV is going to auto succeed, but Intel has certainly proven, twice now, they have what it takes to fail horribly.

 

[busydude]

LOL, thats actually a 18% hit for 460 from AA to Med, not 40% or 50%..The 5850 is a 55% hit for the same however!

A 460 is useless at that resolution. 18% of zero is still zero.

 

[SolMiester]

LOL that's the best that you could do? An GTX 260 beating the HD 5970, man you wish, obviously PhysX is running on the CPU bottlenecking severely all AMD cards, seems that some AMD employee tried to force you to do something unnatural like using your X1950 PRO as a face scrubber and that's where your trauma comes from. Get help :biggrin:

Best I could do?...good on you for being able to use the search function, well done! I dont understand what your joke is with old card, i certainly dont have a trauma about it, and I'm not the one lying in the posts (I will accept a mathematically challenged excuse though)...

I dont understand the troll shit, because you are obliviously just as much a fan as I, just different team?!

 

[evolucion8]

Best I could do?...good on you for being able to use the search function, well done! I dont understand what your joke is with old card, i certainly dont have a trauma about it, and I'm not the one lying in the posts (I will accept a mathematically challenged excuse though)...

I dont understand the troll shit, because you are obliviously just as much a fan as I, just different team?!

I post link with fair results, you are just a troll, and I don't have problems recommending nVidia hardware, you do have problems recommending AMD hardware. Is obvious that a game that uses GPU PhysX will run faster on nVidia hardware, PhysX will run the CPU for AMD hardware, that's obvious that they can't be compared directly in such scenarios, we all know this here. But Don't worry, the X1950PRO AGP won't bother you no more :'(

 

[Seero]

LOL that's the best that you c<SNIP!!!>

Lol I love that, thank you for teaching me the secret of SnipFu.

As to the Mafia2 case, physX is ran on CPU because it can't be ran on ATI's GPU. While you may argue it is Nvidia's dirty proprietary tricks, it is a trick where Nvidia user can have it for free and isn't a gimmick as you wanted it to be.

Lets guess what the near future will be. My guess is 6xxx will OMG tops every game chart with every eye candy turned off. But if you turn them on, it will be below a single 460 without a PhysX card. This strengthen my points in my first reply, an outdated nvidia card can still serves as a physX card, while an outdated ATI card does nothing. This is the key to success. It is actually business 101, where you want your customer to stay with you. Those who brought a GTX460 may buy another high end card in the future from Nvidia as they can use their old card as a PhysX card.

While you can say PhysX, 3D and CUDA are nothing but gimmicks or dirty proprietary tricks from Nvidia, the simple fact is, nvidia user can be benefited by them, and games and other softwares are using/utilizing them. Yes, you may argue cypress or 6xxx has more raw computing power, but that also strengthen the other point that I made, you can't use those raw power from an ATI card because user simply don't have the medium to use it.

It is the matter of business decisions. Both companies are using the same bricks to build their toys, they even get the same bricks from the same manufacturer, TSMC, the differences are on how they build it. Nvidia build it in a way that people will purchase from them again even if their product is a little bit more expensive, and that is what matters.

The master of Snip Fu, is Seero, where I <snip> you back to where you <snip> me at the first place.

In reality, I am a married guy. You can not possibly flirt me with your 195 pound muscle, I am simply not attracted by it. You are definitely not my cup of tea. If you are a beautiful girl, then my wife would have chop my hands off by now.

<snip> on brother!
(I'm starting to worry that this <snip> joke got too far. If it is, I am sorry, but I just can't stop myself today. May be I am attracted by the 195 pound of muscle...)

 

[evolucion8]

<snip>

Well, if that's the case, you don't ever need to upgrade, you can hold on to the 8800GTX for something useful for the rest of your life if you care! (I don't). If you call eyecandy PhysX that's fine, but is obvious that since it uses the CPU with its crippled x87 code, will slowdown the AMD solutions to a crawl. The HD 6x00 series is around the corner so it makes the current nVidia cards quite irrelevant more than already is, and PhysX and 3D isn't enough to justify their hot and underperforming cards. Talk about playability here LOL :awe:

AFAIK, AMD's involvement on the gaming community helps both GPU vendors and the gamers overall like helping port Dirt 2 to DX11.

PS: Sorry, I'm not gay, so please stay on topic and here nobody cares whatever you do with your personal life or whom you are married with (Regardless if its your wife or husband).

 

[Seero]

Well, if that's the case, you don't ever need to upgrade, you can hold on to the 8800GTX for something useful for the rest of your life if you care! (I don't). If you call eyecandy PhysX that's fine, but is obvious that since it uses the CPU with its crippled x87 code, will slowdown the AMD solutions to a crawl. AFAIK, AMD's involvement on the gaming community helps both GPU vendors and the gamers overall.

You are missing the point. Let say I get a GTX 460 today. A year later I may buy a new whatever Nvidia fastest ball. What am I going to do with the GTX 460? Well, stay in my PC as a PhysX card. If I buy a 5870 today, I probably won't buy another video card next year. If I do, I will either buy another 5870 and go crossfire, or put the 5870 into the hardware box. By the way, you will have no idea how many ATI cards are in my hardware box.

As to the x87 code, it is a FUD people tries to feed into the public. AMD solutions don't get slowed down as if you run PhysX with CPU along with a Nvidia card, it will be as slow. PhysX simply doesn't run on ATI cards. There is no "If it runs on ATI cards it will beat Nvidia." It simply won't run. This again goes back to why I say Nvidia can get back up, but ATI may not.

You can't blame game producer on this. AMD simply never give tools to developers. They expect other people to figure that out, to create tools to make their product works. Time will tell if it works.

PS: Sorry, I'm not gay, so please stay on topic and here nobody cares whatever you do in your personal life or whom you are married with (Regardless if its your wife or husband).

but but but you are you one you told me about the 195 pound of muscle and likes to go to the gym....

 

[Grooveriding]

The master of Snip Fu, is Seero, where I <snip> you back to where you <snip> me at the first place.

In reality, I am a married guy. You can not possibly flirt me with your 195 pound muscle, I am simply not attracted by it. You are definitely not my cup of tea. If you are a beautiful girl, then my wife would have chop my hands off by now.

<snip> on brother!
(I'm starting to worry that this <snip> joke got too far. If it is, I am sorry, but I just can't stop myself today. May be I am attracted by the 195 pound of muscle...)

This is just bizarre what you posted here. Perhaps alcohol induced.

 

[evolucion8]

As to the x87 code, it is a FUD people tries to feed into the public. AMD solutions don't get slowed down as if you run PhysX with CPU along with a Nvidia card, it will be as slow. PhysX simply doesn't run on ATI cards. There is no "If it runs on ATI cards it will beat Nvidia." It simply won't run. This again goes back to why I say Nvidia can get back up, but ATI may not.

PhysX simply doesn't run on ATI card, hence runs on the CPU, simply as that, it isn't even multi threaded, only taxes one core, talk about performance crippling. I used my AGEIA card in tandem with my CF setup and worked like a champ, so it does run on AMD hardware, through the AGEIA card or CPU or a hacked driver for the nVidia GPU.

but but but you are you one you told me about the 195 pound of muscle and likes to go to the gym....

Are you gonna keep this going? You told me that you hated me and that it was personal, which means that if you see me walking close by, you will look for a fight with me, and please keep your little secrets to yourself D:

 

[Outrage]

Nvidia build it in a way that people will purchase from them again even if their product is a little bit more expensive, and that is what matters.

Nvidia is slashing there prices almost daily now. Ati is still above the msrp from a year ago. guess ppl aint ready to pay for the extras nvidia offers.

 

[lopri]

Windows Home Premium Service Pack 4? ^_^

 

[SolMiester]

Well, if that's the case, you don't ever need to upgrade, you can hold on to the 8800GTX for something useful for the rest of your life if you care! (I don't). If you call eyecandy PhysX that's fine, but is obvious that since it uses the CPU with its crippled x87 code, will slowdown the AMD solutions to a crawl. The HD 6x00 series is around the corner so it makes the current nVidia cards quite irrelevant more than already is, and PhysX and 3D isn't enough to justify their hot and underperforming cards. Talk about playability here LOL :awe:

<snip>.

low-mid range 6xxx is around the corner! NV hot and underperforming?, and you call me a troll...LOL.
So because AMD cant do PhysX its just a gimmick!.....since when does ability preclude desirably?

 

[evolucion8]

low-mid range 6xxx is around the corner! NV hot and underperforming?, and you call me a troll...LOL.
So because AMD cant do PhysX its just a gimmick!.....since when does ability preclude desirably?

Oh yeah, Fermi was so sucessful that it has the 88&#37; of the DX11 marketshare and its MSRP dropped tiwce in a month, hooray nVIDIA!!! :awe:

 

[Kenmitch]

You are missing the point. Let say I get a GTX 460 today. A year later I may buy a new whatever Nvidia fastest ball. What am I going to do with the GTX 460? Well, stay in my PC as a PhysX card. If I buy a 5870 today, I probably won't buy another video card next year. If I do, I will either buy another 5870 and go crossfire, or put the 5870 into the hardware box. By the way, you will have no idea how many ATI cards are in my hardware box

There you go the perfect use for the GTX 460 in your senario

The saddest part is that nvidia won't let you do that if you choose to buy a ATI/AMD card. You paid for it and it's an advertized feature of the card....But nvidia say's no you can't do that it won't work! So go ahead and praise nvidia if you like

 

[evolucion8]

There you go the perfect use for the GTX 460 in your senario

The saddest part is that nvidia won't let you do that if you choose to buy a ATI/AMD card. You paid for it and it's an advertized feature of the card....But nvidia say's no you can't do that it won't work! So go ahead and praise nvidia if you like

nVidia is the Apple of the graphic cards, they tell you what to do and when, AGEIA cards support anyone?

 

[SolMiester]

Oh yeah, Fermi was so sucessful that it has the 88% of the DX11 marketshare and its MSRP dropped tiwce in a month, hooray nVIDIA!!! :awe:

?....oh, hot and under performing has everything to do with .......... successful? I agree the card is hot, but under performing? Come on! current fastest GPU on the planet...under performing....LMAO!

Oh and market share % are nothing unless you clarify periods!..Hello!

 

[SlowSpyder]

?....oh, hot and under performing has everything to do with .......... successful? I agree the card is hot, but under performing? Come on! current fastest GPU on the planet...under performing....LMAO!

Oh and market share % are nothing unless you clarify periods!..Hello!

Well, you could say the GTX480 is under performing based on it's power use and how long it took to get to market compared to the 5870.

For using as much power as it does (more than a 5970) you would think it should out perform the 5970, but it doesn't. It's not even close.

And while there's no rule that AMD or Nvidia must bring out part within x amount of time from one another, when one does bring out new hardware for a new DX version, and the other takes 6+ months to answer, you'd expect it to be a much faster part. The GTX480 is certainly faster, but I think most were a bit underwhelmed by it. And it's not faster than AMD's fastest card. All that waiting for a part that puts out more heat, more noise, and uses more power than AMD's fastest card but is slower. See? You could certainly argue that they are under performers.

Anyway, this thread has pretty much disintegrated, it should probably be closed. I think it's run it's course. Just my $.02

 

[SolMiester]

Well, you could say the GTX480 is under performing based on it's power use and how long it took to get to market compared to the 5870.

For using as much power as it does (more than a 5970) you would think it should out perform the 5970, but it doesn't. It's not even close.

And while there's no rule that AMD or Nvidia must bring out part within x amount of time from one another, when one does bring out new hardware for a new DX version, and the other takes 6+ months to answer, you'd expect it to be a much faster part. The GTX480 is certainly faster, but I think most were a bit underwhelmed by it. And it's not faster than AMD's fastest card. All that waiting for a part that puts out more heat, more noise, and uses more power than AMD's fastest card but is slower. See? You could certainly argue that they are under performers.

Anyway, this thread has pretty much disintegrated, it should probably be closed. I think it's run it's course. Just my $.02

NV has always used more power than ATi, but does that mean its previous cards under performed?, of course not. It only matters now because ATX standards are showing their age, and a little jealously from the red team.
Oh, funny how you couldnt help yourself commenting on the GTX480 and dual GPU 5970 card...even though my comment DID clearly state fastest GPU, not card.....but then again the fastest card isnt 50% faster than the fastest GPU but costs 50% more....is that under performing as well?

Oh and 6+ mths late for a card not fully spec'd but 20%+ faster isnt bad. ATi is at its 3rd gen series on this architecture so they should have it sorted by now...

 

[Seero]

Nvidia is slashing there prices almost daily now. Ati is still above the msrp from a year ago. guess ppl aint ready to pay for the extras nvidia offers.

Is this cheap to you?

People are buying that. I will not recommend this for daily video gaming though.

It isn't a year ago, it is now my friend.

 

[JAG87]

moron flame baiter OP... lol


You really dont think AMD being a almost a full cycle ahead of Nvidia in putting out new grahic cards will do anything to Nvidias situation? Have you been awake since september/november 2009?

Pardon me for saying, but you could perhaps need a new processing unit. A logical one at that... har har

Why the favorism JAG? what does it give or take away from you whichever GPU producer leads the race?
As long as both GPU producers are IN the race, and there is competition, its all good for us, isnt it?


And also...what exactly is doable and what isnt? Can you blame people for calling you out on this stuff when you manage to contradict yourself to this degree?:







Peace

I have no favoritism. I buy whatever technology impresses me. I have always liked high end ATI cards, and have owned many in the past. Unfortunately I moved to a niche of clients that requires multi GPU, and for me Crossfire is simply not a competitor to SLI. I need control over my drivers, and I need to know exactly what is going on with each game, ATI does not allow me to do this. I also enjoy having CUDA and Physx, it's just something I can bank that I have in case I need it. Money is not really a concern. So you can see why I chose nvidia. Obviously if ATI had a product (let's say hypothetically the HD6870) that blew nvidia away in performance (lets say beat the GTX 480 by 50&#37; or more) I wouldn't re-consider all the above and I would purchase ATI.

What I meant to say (if it sounded contradictory) is that nvidia wasn't able to deliver a 512SP 800 Mhz air cooled GeForce card to the market. And the second problem would have been the power charts on review sites. The chip is capable of running stable with those specs, but it cannot be done for other reasons. Nothing contradictory.

So do we agree yet that AMD's Radeon can in fact put a dent in Nvidia's bottom line? And the 6000 series will likely do the same, but not for some time. Once they get the entire line up out, if Nvidia has nothing until late 2011, then the 6 series can indeed put a dent in Nvidia's bottom line.

And correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't the GF104 designed to be a GeForce? I thought it was pretty average in the CUDA/HPC world? I could be wrong on that, but I thought it was more GPU than the GF100 which was more HPC oriented?

You seem blind to a simple concept. This game works in rounds. One round goes to ATI, one round goes to NV. If NV has nothing until late 2011, most enthusiasts who purchased an HD6000 in early 2011, will be easily willing to sell and buy the new NV card if it delivers more performance. Remember we are enthusiasts, we want the latest and greatest. Average Joe that buys a GTX 460 and keeps it for 4 years is not an enthusiast, nor a significant source of profit in this segment.


I don't understand how you figure that NV is going to go bankrupt because the enthusiast gaming market (the smaller of their profit margin) is not buying their high end for a brief 2 to 3 quarter time span. It's like you think that "after HD6000 that's it, nobody will buy NV again, they are doomed". As long as they launch a new product that is better than the competitor's and price it accordingly, they will recap that small niche market of high-end GPU users.

Is this cheap to you?

People are buying that. I will not recommend this for daily video gaming though.

It isn't a year ago, it is now my friend.

Lol, thank you Seero, thank you for being the only one that puts any effort into their thinking.


And I just want to add that I'm sure this thread turned out exactly like the OP hoped for.
I'm not going to say anything else otherwise Dr Pizza will back hand me in the face.

 

[Seero]

There you go the perfect use for the GTX 460 in your senario

The saddest part is that nvidia won't let you do that if you choose to buy a ATI/AMD card. You paid for it and it's an advertized feature of the card....But nvidia say's no you can't do that it won't work! So go ahead and praise nvidia if you like

That is how they keep their fishes in their pool. You may not like the idea, but it isn't a bad idea if the pool is of good quality.

 

[RussianSensation]

Hmm....What does the GF in GF104 stand for anyways....Good Fart?

For clarity, the 'GF' letters used in the GF100 GPU name are not an abbreviation for 'GeForce'. They actually denote that this GPU is a Graphics solution based on the Fermi architecture. - Source