Wells Fargo drops most employee healthcare insurance options, cites Obamacare *update

[Craig234]

Yep and many of us said it at the time this is what would happen. Just a way to back door to a single payer system. If people think the 1.6 trillion defit is big wait till we do a single payer system. All it will take is 1 activist liberal judge to rule illegals get full healthcare and everyone around the world who is sick comes here and drains the system dry.

And then one commie judge will rule illegals can have sex with your wife! Oh no!

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Considering how important it is to present and prospective employees that the company (or union) they work for/at provide some semblance of a decent health care plan, it seems suicidal for Wells Fargo to drop a very important incentive to work there.

I guess in these difficult times, Wells Fargo is banking on the idea that dumping $350-$800/month added cost on all employees to work there is not going to drive off any of their valued employees to the competition.

obviously they crunched the numbers and determined it wasn't beneficial for them to offer medical anymore.

 

[her209]

obviously they crunched the numbers and determined it wasn't beneficial for them to offer medical anymore.

They are still offering health insurance options.

 

[KGB]

obviously they crunched the numbers and determined it wasn't beneficial for them to offer medical anymore.

Don't worry, I'm sure the executives get to keep theirs.

 

[momeNt]

Don't worry, I'm sure the executives get to keep theirs.

Of course they do, you have to compete for talent, healthcare being one of the metrics that the talent will measure before signing on.

When all your other jobs require no talent and you have 9% involuntarily unemployed, the employer is in control and can cut whatever they want, because if one quits because they don't like it, there are others waiting to fill their place.

 

[KlokWyze]

I'd take any statements from Wells Fargo, about anything, with a huge grain of salt.

 

[werepossum]

Employers shouldn't be providing health care. It doesn't make sense in a modern economy where people change jobs so often.

Quite true. I for one love my Health Savings Account - it allows me to manage my health care costs while also benefiting from a catastrophic protection insurance policy and the bargaining power of a major insurance company. Unfortunately, most people want Cadillac health care on someone else's dime. That's going to lead us into a government single-payer system where each person will have every motivation to demand the best and no motivation to control costs. Since even the best government does not have unlimited resources, our health care will have to get worse. On the bright side, once health care costs are decoupled from the individual and shifted to the collective tax payer, the wealthy will once again be able to afford servants. (Yes, the quality of the bright side has declined severely.)

No, they cited the “Durbin Amendment” under the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act for that one.

This.

If you're a restaurant and government tells you that you can't charge for the soda, you're going to charge more for the burger.

And here's why. There are no free lunches.

 

[pcgeek11]

Employers shouldn't be providing health care. It doesn't make sense in a modern economy where people change jobs so often.

Why would people change jobs so often? I never have.

Military 20+ years.
Go between job 2 years.
Current job 16+ years.

 

[novasatori]

Why would people change jobs so often? I never have.

Military 20+ years.
Go between job 2 years.
Current job 16+ years.

because the economy is nothing like what it was 16 years ago, and even farther from what it was 38 years ago

 

[pcgeek11]

because the economy is nothing like what it was 16 years ago, and even farther from what it was 38 years ago

And ?

If you have a job why would you change jobs very often?

 

[YoungGun21]

Last I heard finance was something like 58% of what America does these days. That is the the big money maker for this country and we all know its a facade. But that doesn't mean this isn't a big deal. Despite the bailouts, the bribes, and the corruption these banks still compete for one reason...greed. Wellsfargo is looking to get an upperhand in our cartel banking system. Other banks will have to follow.

So...wait? You think half of this country works in finance?

 

[her209]

No, they cited the “Durbin Amendment” under the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act for that one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodd–Frank_Wall_Street_Reform_and_Consumer_Protection_Act

The "Durbin Amendment"[21] is a provision in the final bill aimed at debit card interchange fees and increasing competition in payment processing. The provision was not in the House bill;[14] it began as an amendment to the Senate bill from Dick Durbin[22] and led to lobbying against it.[23] The law applies to banks with over $10 billion in assets, and these banks would have to charge debit card interchange fees that are "reasonable and proportional to the actual cost" [24] of processing the transaction. The bill aimed to restrict anti-competitive practices and encourage competition, and included provisions which allow retailers to refuse to use cards for small purchases and offer incentives for using cash or another type of card.[14]

The Durbin Amendment also gave the Federal Reserve the power to regulate debit card interchange fees, and on December 16, 2010 the Fed proposed a maximum interchange fee of 12 cents per debit card transaction,[25] which CardHub.com estimated would cost large banks $14 billion annually.[26] On June 29, 2011, the Fed issued its final rule, which holds that the maximum interchange fee an issuer can receive from a single debit card transaction is 21 cents plus 5 basis points multiplied by the amount of the transaction.[27] This rule also allows issuers to raise their interchange fees by as much as one cent if they implement certain fraud-prevention measures.[27] An issuer eligible for this adjustment, could therefore receive an interchange fee of as much as 24 cents for the average debit card transaction (valued at $38),[27] according to the Federal Reserve. This cap—which will take effect on October 1, 2011 rather than July 21, 2011 as was previously announced—will cost banks roughly $9.4 billion annually, according to CardHub.com.[26]

The horror! The horror!

 

[her209]

And ?

If you have a job why would you change jobs very often?

Company loyalty doesn't mean jack nowadays.

 

[Craig234]

So...wait? You think half of this country works in finance?

Last I checked, the finance sector was making about 40% of all profits, up from the historical norm of 10-15%.

 

[Rainsford]

And ?

If you have a job why would you change jobs very often?

Because companies are more reluctant to promote or retain employees than they were in the past. At the same time, employees are becoming more willing to look at other employers if they want to move up the ladder. These two things reinforce each other, to the point where employers and employees are frequently just willing to work together until some marginally better option comes along. Not everyone behaves this way, but enough do that it's hard to buck the trend.

 

[Rainsford]

Of course they do, you have to compete for talent, healthcare being one of the metrics that the talent will measure before signing on.

When all your other jobs require no talent and you have 9% involuntarily unemployed, the employer is in control and can cut whatever they want, because if one quits because they don't like it, there are others waiting to fill their place.

You think all the other jobs besides executive in a huge financial company require "no talent"?

 

[woolfe9999]

Last I checked, the finance sector was making about 40% of all profits, up from the historical norm of 10-15%.

You're probably thinking of this and not recalling the numbers exactly:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/30/financial-profits-percentage_n_841716.html

It's at 29% I think as of the last fiscal year. The record was 46% in 2001.

Also this is a percentage of "corporate profits." Presumably profits from many small business which aren't incorporated aren't tallied.

- wolf

 

[TheSlamma]

Where is the news for this posted at? Just internal?

 

[werepossum]

You're probably thinking of this and not recalling the numbers exactly:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/30/financial-profits-percentage_n_841716.html

It's at 29% I think as of the last fiscal year. The record was 46% in 2001.

Also this is a percentage of "corporate profits." Presumably profits from many small business which aren't incorporated aren't tallied.

- wolf

Wait - Craig was "probably thinking"? SHENS!

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Last I heard finance was something like 58% of what America does these days. That is the the big money maker for this country and we all know its a facade. But that doesn't mean this isn't a big deal. Despite the bailouts, the bribes, and the corruption these banks still compete for one reason...greed. Wellsfargo is looking to get an upperhand in our cartel banking system. Other banks will have to follow.

The mandate hasn't even been applied yet and employer based healthcare is about to go up in flames. The costs alone without healthcare reform would have led to this anyway. The reform legislation is just being used as a scapegoat.

The clamour for socialism will be deafening when fatfuck America realizes they have lost their healthcare. Some of these rubes literally work for the shoddy healthcare alone. These people are slaves to their employers just because of healthcare. Once that last bit is gone maybe people will start sticking up for themselves. Quit those terrible jobs and demand real freedom. A real wage, real healthcare, real freedom.

Its going to be very exciting times because I honestly believe the biggest endgame is universal healthcare. That is the finish line and the fight against Republicans and their slave rubes must be vigilant! Have no doubt there will millions of morons who will fight to die in the piss and shit of the hopeless nightmare that is the Republican's wetdream. These people are serfs and love their lords more than themselves.

People like you are fools. You think the European system is some great example of how to run healthcare? Ask anyone that actually lived over there and moved here and they will all tell you the same thing. It's much better over hear. You can see specialists in a week, 2 tops. OVer there you'll wait months, and sometimes you will die waiting.
The biggest joke is that people like you think it's universal or free. It most certainly is not. Why do you think the tax rate is so high in Europe? Why does a beer cost $2-$3 here, but $7-$8 there? The only thing this system of healthcare does is centralize power to the government so it can decide literally who lives and who dies.
If there is a doctor that speaks up about something and the overlords in the healthcare ministry don't like it, they simply stop paying him.

If you want freedom let freedom be. IF you want to be a socialist go to Europe or try the old Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and let me know how that all ended.
Healthcare costs money, just like housing. Just like vehicles. Just like food. Why aren't you so high and mighty and saying we should abandon mortgage based home purchases, liquidate all mortgage companies, and have the government give out loans to everyon or in your wet dream, just give out homes to people.
It doesn't work, it will never work. The only way to fairly and impartially treat people is to let them make their own choices and their own purchases.
I can't wait for the day for this issue to go to the SCOTUS and be shot down.
How can the Federal government require me to purchase anything?
If you support this then you should support them forcing you and your family to buy whatever I decide you should buy. I think every person should be forced to purchase a firearm, ammunition and training to use said weapon, because having a gun and being able to protect yourself from others with guns and knives is in the public interest. Dead citizens can't pay taxes, oh wait, yes they do.

So to put it simply,
Dem wet dream = not treating people as equals or as capable of running their own life, so THEY know what's best for you and will tell you how to live.
Repub wet dream = let people make decisions, make a profit.
Have I got that right?

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Quite true. I for one love my Health Savings Account - it allows me to manage my health care costs while also benefiting from a catastrophic protection insurance policy and the bargaining power of a major insurance company. Unfortunately, most people want Cadillac health care on someone else's dime. That's going to lead us into a government single-payer system where each person will have every motivation to demand the best and no motivation to control costs. Since even the best government does not have unlimited resources, our health care will have to get worse. On the bright side, once health care costs are decoupled from the individual and shifted to the collective tax payer, the wealthy will once again be able to afford servants. (Yes, the quality of the bright side has declined severely.)


This.


And here's why. There are no free lunches.

It's great isn't it.
The lemmings of the left think that the "poor" will just magically be able to afford healthcare? What are those "poor" people going to do when they are crushed by taxes? Or as the left continually wants to do, are they only going to raise taxes on one group? When you force one group to pay for another through taxes and if you don't pay those taxes you go to jail, that's not taxation, that's extortion.

 

[BarneyFife]

From 1999 to 2009, health insurance premiums went up 131%. This is before Obamacare. Wells Fargo can cite whatever they want, the face is they and other companies are using Obamacare as a crutch. Their will be a single payer system within the next 20 years. Rising 13% a year going to price EVERYONE out except the guy making $1m a year.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

And then one commie judge will rule illegals can have sex with your wife! Oh no!

Don't need a commie judge, just a inept, retarded liberal President to grant amnesty to all illegals
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/08/22/obama’s-backdoor-amnesty/
Like $4.00 gas. Try $15 gas.

 

[BarneyFife]

People like you are fools. You think the European system is some great example of how to run healthcare? Ask anyone that actually lived over there and moved here and they will all tell you the same thing. It's much better over hear. You can see specialists in a week, 2 tops. OVer there you'll wait months, and sometimes you will die waiting.
The biggest joke is that people like you think it's universal or free. It most certainly is not. Why do you think the tax rate is so high in Europe? Why does a beer cost $2-$3 here, but $7-$8 there? The only thing this system of healthcare does is centralize power to the government so it can decide literally who lives and who dies.
If there is a doctor that speaks up about something and the overlords in the healthcare ministry don't like it, they simply stop paying him.

If you want freedom let freedom be. IF you want to be a socialist go to Europe or try the old Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and let me know how that all ended.
Healthcare costs money, just like housing. Just like vehicles. Just like food. Why aren't you so high and mighty and saying we should abandon mortgage based home purchases, liquidate all mortgage companies, and have the government give out loans to everyon or in your wet dream, just give out homes to people.
It doesn't work, it will never work. The only way to fairly and impartially treat people is to let them make their own choices and their own purchases.
I can't wait for the day for this issue to go to the SCOTUS and be shot down.
How can the Federal government require me to purchase anything?
If you support this then you should support them forcing you and your family to buy whatever I decide you should buy. I think every person should be forced to purchase a firearm, ammunition and training to use said weapon, because having a gun and being able to protect yourself from others with guns and knives is in the public interest. Dead citizens can't pay taxes, oh wait, yes they do.

So to put it simply,
Dem wet dream = not treating people as equals or as capable of running their own life, so THEY know what's best for you and will tell you how to live.
Repub wet dream = let people make decisions, make a profit.
Have I got that right?

Just face it. You're poor and will never be one of them. Wake up and realize that you won't be able to afford health care in a couple years either. You can rattle on about beer taxes, guns, freedom etc... but you're nothing but an American idiot ready to serve those old rich guys who laugh at you.

 

[Rainsford]

People like you are fools. You think the European system is some great example of how to run healthcare? Ask anyone that actually lived over there and moved here and they will all tell you the same thing. It's much better over hear. You can see specialists in a week, 2 tops. OVer there you'll wait months, and sometimes you will die waiting.
The biggest joke is that people like you think it's universal or free. It most certainly is not. Why do you think the tax rate is so high in Europe? Why does a beer cost $2-$3 here, but $7-$8 there? The only thing this system of healthcare does is centralize power to the government so it can decide literally who lives and who dies.
If there is a doctor that speaks up about something and the overlords in the healthcare ministry don't like it, they simply stop paying him.

If you want freedom let freedom be. IF you want to be a socialist go to Europe or try the old Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and let me know how that all ended.
Healthcare costs money, just like housing. Just like vehicles. Just like food. Why aren't you so high and mighty and saying we should abandon mortgage based home purchases, liquidate all mortgage companies, and have the government give out loans to everyon or in your wet dream, just give out homes to people.
It doesn't work, it will never work. The only way to fairly and impartially treat people is to let them make their own choices and their own purchases.
I can't wait for the day for this issue to go to the SCOTUS and be shot down.
How can the Federal government require me to purchase anything?
If you support this then you should support them forcing you and your family to buy whatever I decide you should buy. I think every person should be forced to purchase a firearm, ammunition and training to use said weapon, because having a gun and being able to protect yourself from others with guns and knives is in the public interest. Dead citizens can't pay taxes, oh wait, yes they do.

So to put it simply,
Dem wet dream = not treating people as equals or as capable of running their own life, so THEY know what's best for you and will tell you how to live.
Repub wet dream = let people make decisions, make a profit.
Have I got that right?

No, I don't think you have that right. The Republican vision is OK, in a perfect world. But that's the world Karl Marx communism works in too, and I don't believe in that either.

You want to "let people make decisions" about healthcare? The whole point of the debate now is that for many people there is no choice. They can't afford insurance, and their employer doesn't help provide it, so they can't afford healthcare. They can get access to a specialist in weeks instead of months? More likely they can't get access to a specialist at all, ever, so they die of something that could have been prevented.

Don't get me wrong, our health care system is top notch...as long as you're well off enough to get health care. If you're NOT in that segment of the population, you'd be much better off with the worst examples of socialized health care around the world. You can lecture everyone about personal responsibility all you want, but I'll be honest, I don't think that's going to help all the uninsured we have now.

I don't think we should decrease health care quality for those who can afford top notch care. But I'm also not sure we should ignore the people who have a hard time getting health care at all. I think we can do both...and nothing I've heard from the people opposed to "socialized medicine" have made a convincing argument otherwise.