Welfare costs are killing America.

[techs]

http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

 

[EagleKeeper]

You also need to look at the state costs and unre-embursed costs to localities and businesses.

 

[rudder]

GM just laid off about 1/2 of their Saturn plant in Spring Hill, TN. They will be paid 80% of thier salary for the 18 months till the plant reopens. Plus they will receive UNEMPLOYMENT benefits from the State!!!! A big WTF to them.

 

[XZeroII]

In fact, all government payments to individuals amount to about 58 percent of the budget. That's twice the share of the budget such payments claimed 40 years ago. And the percentage continues to climb -- giving those pushing reform of such entitlement programs a powerful argument.

The bolded part is what people are talking about when they talk about Welfare. It's not just the Welfare program, it's all the benefit spending that we do. So basically, approximately 58% of every dollar that you pay in taxes go to other people as a form of wealth redistribution.

 

[Genx87]

Add up the costs of all these social services at the federal level. Then add in the costs at the state and county level.

Then you will know why I have said the military industrial complex has lost its pedestal to the social industrial complex.

According to this article about 60% of our budget is used up by this bloc of voters, lobbyists, and corporations, or about 1.6 Trillion a year.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

HaHaHa. According to your brother the cop? Hahahaha!

 

[sierrita]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

It's always most accurate to get U.S. Social Security Administration statistical information from someone's "brother in law, who is a cop".
:laugh:

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: sierrita

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

It's always most accurate to get U.S. Social Security Administration statistical information from someone's "brother in law, who is a cop".
:laugh:

:laugh: :laugh:

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: sierrita

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

It's always most accurate to get U.S. Social Security Administration statistical information from someone's "brother in law, who is a cop".
:laugh:

And what would your method be? Why dont you go to the hood and ask random people if they are cheating social security disability benefits. Or how bout we have the media do a random telephone survey and ask them. The government sure as hell wont get accurate statistics on who is cheating it's own programs, so my "brother in law who is a cop" is probably the best information your going to get.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: sierrita

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

It's always most accurate to get U.S. Social Security Administration statistical information from someone's "brother in law, who is a cop".
:laugh:

And what would your method be? Why dont you go to the hood and ask random people if they are cheating social security disability benefits. Or how bout we have the media do a random telephone survey and ask them. The government sure as hell wont get accurate statistics on who is cheating it's own programs, so my "brother in law who is a cop" is probably the best information your going to get.

How about asking me? I used to be a Social Security Disabilities Analyst. So I actually made the determination, under law, as to whether an individual is disabled.
The standards for disablility are very high and it is almost impossible for a healthy person to get disability. Even your doctor can't get you disablity. That determination is made based on objective medical evidence, not your doctors "opinion" as to whether you are disabled.
I can tell you its so difficult to get disability that many people who are disabled can't get it.
And the way the system is set up it is far easier for middle and upper class people to get disability than the poor.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: rudder
GM just laid off about 1/2 of their Saturn plant in Spring Hill, TN. They will be paid 80% of thier salary for the 18 months till the plant reopens. Plus they will receive UNEMPLOYMENT benefits from the State!!!! A big WTF to them.

Sounds like it would be cheaper to ship the employees and their families to India.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: sierrita

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: techs
http://finance.yahoo.com/taxes/article/...our-Tax-Dollars-Are-Spent?mod=oneclick

All types of aid to the needy -- Medicaid, housing subsidies, aid to poor families with children (welfare, which accounts for about 1 percent of the budget), food stamps, school lunches and so on, plus unemployment benefits -- account for about 16 percent of the budget.

Interest on the debt claims about 10 percent of the budget. When President Bush took office, the national debt was $5.6 trillion, but deficits have pushed that number closer to $9 trillion today.



So basically Bush increased the national debt cost over 4 times the total cost of welfare?
Hmmm.

You failed to included the mother all Welfare programs SS, along with Medicare, Medicaid, and SSI. So your one percent is really

20% for SS, 15% for Medicare, 1.3% for SSI, and 16 for other aid.
For a grand total of 52.3. That is right over half the budget goes to welfare. Of course a good portion of the federal debt also went to welfare so if you want add another few percentage points.

According to my brother in law who is a cop in a low income minority area, pretty much everyone, young and old, is receiving SS disability payments for their "bad back". That is welfare.

It's always most accurate to get U.S. Social Security Administration statistical information from someone's "brother in law, who is a cop".
:laugh:

And what would your method be? Why dont you go to the hood and ask random people if they are cheating social security disability benefits. Or how bout we have the media do a random telephone survey and ask them. The government sure as hell wont get accurate statistics on who is cheating it's own programs, so my "brother in law who is a cop" is probably the best information your going to get.

How about asking me? I used to be a Social Security Disabilities Analyst. So I actually made the determination, under law, as to whether an individual is disabled.
The standards for disablility are very high and it is almost impossible for a healthy person to get disability. Even your doctor can't get you disablity. That determination is made based on objective medical evidence, not your doctors "opinion" as to whether you are disabled.
I can tell you its so difficult to get disability that many people who are disabled can't get it.
And the way the system is set up it is far easier for middle and upper class people to get disability than the poor.

objective medical evidence provided by who? Anybody can fake a bad back, and get a doctor to sign off on it, especially if you know the right doctor to go to. The federal government isnt capable of verifying an "objective" opinion, which is why every program is riddled with fraud.

 

[spittledip]

Originally posted by: rudder
GM just laid off about 1/2 of their Saturn plant in Spring Hill, TN. They will be paid 80% of thier salary for the 18 months till the plant reopens. Plus they will receive UNEMPLOYMENT benefits from the State!!!! A big WTF to them.

So what? It's not like they chose to get laid off. It sucks to lose your job. Hopefully they can find another one with as good pay. I see nothing wrong with this.

 

[OutHouse]

[/quote]
How about asking me? I used to be a Social Security Disabilities Analyst. So I actually made the determination, under law, as to whether an individual is disabled.
The standards for disablility are very high and it is almost impossible for a healthy person to get disability. Even your doctor can't get you disablity. That determination is made based on objective medical evidence, not your doctors "opinion" as to whether you are disabled.
I can tell you its so difficult to get disability that many people who are disabled can't get it.
And the way the system is set up it is far easier for middle and upper class people to get disability than the poor.
[/quote]

I need more info on that.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: spittledip

Originally posted by: rudder
GM just laid off about 1/2 of their Saturn plant in Spring Hill, TN. They will be paid 80% of thier salary for the 18 months till the plant reopens. Plus they will receive UNEMPLOYMENT benefits from the State!!!! A big WTF to them.

So what? It's not like they chose to get laid off. It sucks to lose your job. Hopefully they can find another one with as good pay. I see nothing wrong with this.

the problem is that they are collecting the equivalent of a salary plus drawing unemployment benefits.

80% of your salary for a year w/ a guarentee of a job is fine.

Unemploymnent while looking for another job is fine.

Double dipping is not.

 

[Arcex]

It's a double-edged sword, on the one side a lot of people feel we should provide for those who cannot provide for themselves, and I agree with that, but in any society where you have a system that provides that service you will get people who choose not to provide for themselves and live off the government tit. In a bureaucracy as massive as ours we will never be able to stop that completely but there has to be a better way to minimize it. Unfortuately I don't know how, anyone have any ideas on it?

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Citrix

How about asking me? I used to be a Social Security Disabilities Analyst. So I actually made the determination, under law, as to whether an individual is disabled.
The standards for disablility are very high and it is almost impossible for a healthy person to get disability. Even your doctor can't get you disablity. That determination is made based on objective medical evidence, not your doctors "opinion" as to whether you are disabled.
I can tell you its so difficult to get disability that many people who are disabled can't get it.
And the way the system is set up it is far easier for middle and upper class people to get disability than the poor.
[/quote]

I need more info on that.[/quote]

In order to be get disability you need to present evidence. It is your responsibility to do so. The more information that gets to Social Security the more chance you will be approved.
Clinics and low cost medical providers are the least likely to take the time to fill out a disabilty request for medical info. Middle and upper class people have doctors who routinely submit far more detailed info.
For instance. To qualify under a hematological (blood) disease you may have to show persistent hematocrit of below 30 over at least a 3 month period. A clinic doctor may just scribble hematocrit 28 on a certain date. A more well paid doctor may open the chart and actually give three dates and the hematocrit on that date.
So the poor person doesn't get disability, and the middle upper class person does.
btw poor people actually apply for disability more often than the more well off. But they are denied in far greater numbers. The number one reason is they fail to supply enough evidence they are disabled.
Poor, less educated do have one advantage in the medical/vocational allowance area as they are more likely to have performed "long term arduous physical labor" and are over 50, with a low educational level, which may get them disability because based on their age, education and experience they can't reasonably be expected to do sedentary work that routinely requires at least a high school education (the phrases I have used are the actual ones that appeared in the SS Disability P.O.M.- Program and Operations Manual)

 

[sierrita]

Originally posted by: Arcex
It's a double-edged sword, on the one side a lot of people feel we should provide for those who cannot provide for themselves, and I agree with that, but in any society where you have a system that provides that service you will get people who choose not to provide for themselves and live off the government tit. In a bureaucracy as massive as ours we will never be able to stop that completely but there has to be a better way to minimize it. Unfortuately I don't know how, anyone have any ideas on it?

Ask my brother in law, who is a cop.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: spittledip

Originally posted by: rudder
GM just laid off about 1/2 of their Saturn plant in Spring Hill, TN. They will be paid 80% of thier salary for the 18 months till the plant reopens. Plus they will receive UNEMPLOYMENT benefits from the State!!!! A big WTF to them.

So what? It's not like they chose to get laid off. It sucks to lose your job. Hopefully they can find another one with as good pay. I see nothing wrong with this.

You see nothing wrong with GM paying Union employees 80% and then getting the State to agree to offer unemployment payments on top of that? That is taxpayer funded unemployement which is meant for people who have ZERO income, not 80% of the average $29 per hour.

 

[Arcex]

Originally posted by: sierrita

Originally posted by: Arcex
It's a double-edged sword, on the one side a lot of people feel we should provide for those who cannot provide for themselves, and I agree with that, but in any society where you have a system that provides that service you will get people who choose not to provide for themselves and live off the government tit. In a bureaucracy as massive as ours we will never be able to stop that completely but there has to be a better way to minimize it. Unfortuately I don't know how, anyone have any ideas on it?

Ask my brother in law, who is a cop.

Well my uncle's a cop and my dad is a firefighter an EMT and they don't know how to solve this epidemic, what's your brother-in-laws point of view?

 

[tomywishbone]

"....It's always most accurate to get U.S. Social Security Administration statistical information from someone's "brother in law, who is a cop."


With all due respect, that source is most likely as valid, as 99% of any Civil Service agency you'd encounter.