Weird thing I noticed with Linux themes

[Red Squirrel]

Say I add a theme where colors of elements like text boxes are different, it even changes the color of elements within web pages. Even background colors of web pages. Is this how it's suppose to be? That kinda sucks... I want to be able to pick a theme but I still want web pages to look the same way the webmaster intended.

 

[lxskllr]

I haven't noticed background color changes, but text boxes and all change. I prefer it that way. It makes the system feel more unified.

 

[Nothinman]

Yea, text boxes and such should change because they're normal GTK controls.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Is there a way to disable that? If I choose a theme it makes lot of websites pretty much unusable if they have any controls. Sometimes the fonts get all messed up since they were set to assume a certain background color and now the OS is changing the background color on me so the fonts clash etc... Really stupid idea that they did it this way. Nothing should change the way a web page was intended to look.

 

[Nothinman]

This isn't something Linux-specific, Windows does the exact same thing. Both have for as long as I can remember.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I never noticed it in Windows. I can change my background to any color I want, and it wont affect web pages. TBH I have not tried with text boxes though.

 

[Nothinman]

Background has no affect in either OS, but if you change the text color, etc it affects all controls.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Is there a way to turn that off? The browser should follow the CSS template, not the OS theme. It only makes sense. It's rare I go on the internet through my server but when I do, it's pretty much unusable. I have a dark theme as I keep it open on my 2nd screen all the time so it's less hard on the eyes, but the internet is unusable since it turns all the controls black and I can't even read the text. Given some elements are affected and some arn't, the whole web page clashes badly.

 

[Nothinman]

No, it makes more sense the way it is so that the local client can override things like font size, color, etc for various reasons. For example the visually impaired may need to use a high contrast theme with large fonts to be able to read the screen. Without those adjustments the Internet would be unusable.

Themes affect other things like Office docs as well. I remember someone at my last job complaining that a spreadsheet printed incorrectly just for them. Turned out the reason was that Excel was respecting their dark theme when printing the colored parts of the sheet. It tries it's best to print what you literally see.

 

[Red Squirrel]

No, it makes more sense the way it is so that the local client can override things like font size, color, etc for various reasons. For example the visually impaired may need to use a high contrast theme with large fonts to be able to read the screen. Without those adjustments the Internet would be unusable.

Themes affect other things like Office docs as well. I remember someone at my last job complaining that a spreadsheet printed incorrectly just for them. Turned out the reason was that Excel was respecting their dark theme when printing the colored parts of the sheet. It tries it's best to print what you literally see.

Really it even effects office document printing!? That defeats the whole point of themes. Themes should not affect usability, they should only affect the actual interface. Guess it's best to just stick to default then. For some reason it's not letting me anymore though (nothing happens when I select a theme).

 

[Nothinman]

Really it even effects office document printing!? That defeats the whole point of themes. Themes should not affect usability, they should only affect the actual interface. Guess it's best to just stick to default then. For some reason it's not letting me anymore though (nothing happens when I select a theme).

At least it did with Office way back then, I haven't tried since and I don't know anyone who uses a dark theme these days. And I would say that I agree with the decision because most people expect the document to print just as they see it on the screen. If it cherry picked which aspects of the display to honor and which to ignore you'd have one helluva time figuring out what the hard copy would look like.

 

[Red Squirrel]

At least it did with Office way back then, I haven't tried since and I don't know anyone who uses a dark theme these days. And I would say that I agree with the decision because most people expect the document to print just as they see it on the screen. If it cherry picked which aspects of the display to honor and which to ignore you'd have one helluva time figuring out what the hard copy would look like.

No it should display the document the same no matter what, and print the same way. The theme should only affect the interface, not the actual contents of a document/program. It only makes sense, it's silly the way it is now. Even more true with web pages. A webmaster makes a CSS and sets the colors and layout, the browser should display it according to those settings, not the template settings! So with the way it works now it means web sites appear differently for everybody depending on what themes they have. That's pure stupid.

 

[Crusty]

No it should display the document the same no matter what, and print the same way. The theme should only affect the interface, not the actual contents of a document/program. It only makes sense, it's silly the way it is now. Even more true with web pages. A webmaster makes a CSS and sets the colors and layout, the browser should display it according to those settings, not the template settings! So with the way it works now it means web sites appear differently for everybody depending on what themes they have. That's pure stupid.

If you want your document to print the same everywhere save it as a postscript file, not a Word document.

If I have a hard time reading small print on a website I want the ability to adjust the colors and sizes so that I can read it. What you are suggesting removes all abilities to do that and renders web sites unusable for people with disabilities. What good does that do?

 

[lxskllr]

No it should display the document the same no matter what, and print the same way. The theme should only affect the interface, not the actual contents of a document/program. It only makes sense, it's silly the way it is now. Even more true with web pages. A webmaster makes a CSS and sets the colors and layout, the browser should display it according to those settings, not the template settings! So with the way it works now it means web sites appear differently for everybody depending on what themes they have. That's pure stupid.

What if I want all my spreadsheets to have a blue background? If I like a color selection enough to view it on my monitor, why wouldn't I want to see it printed? Nothinman made a good point about the visually impaired. Why should the end user be subject to the whims of color blind web devs? If I need a special setup to see, web pages overriding my choices would make the web unusable.

 

[MrColin]

There is a firefox plugin that lets you override these things, and specify what it shows for controls that would otherwise be from your system's theme. Its called "stylish"

You could also edit this file: /usr/share/firefox/res/forms.css

 

[earthman]

You are confusing page elements with system controls. Unless they are specified explicitly, things like standard inputs, text areas and dropdowns in web pages are styled by the system and it's widgets, NOT the CSS in the page. CSS doesn't do a good job with some of these elements anyway.

 

[Red Squirrel]

You are confusing page elements with system controls. Unless they are specified explicitly, things like standard inputs, text areas and dropdowns in web pages are styled by the system and it's widgets, NOT the CSS in the page. CSS doesn't do a good job with some of these elements anyway.

See that's the problem. It pisses me off to think that if I write a web page a certain way, it wont even have the same colors if someone is using a non default theme. It's also annoying as an end user as some form controls will clash really badly with the rest of the web page. For example lets say a web page form over a black background and the form elements are red according to the CSS template. Now if I put a black theme on my machine, those controls will be black, and be harder to even see. I then have to change my theme just so I can use that web page. Not to mention it just looks ugly. Google looks super ugly on my linux box since it screws with the way Google webmasters intended it to actually look.

It also seems to randomly affect text. I'm looking at certain web pages and text that should be black is actually gray like my theme, but if said text is on a light background it's very hard to even read.

Glad to see there's a plugin for that though, I will try it out. Does not fix the fact that millions of users out there who use themes may not even see my web pages as I intend. Is there a way to maybe force colors with javascript or something?

 

[Nothinman]

It pisses me off to think that if I write a web page a certain way, it wont even have the same colors if someone is using a non default theme.

Yea, because all of those people with visual disabilities are really just trying to make your web page look ugly...

Now if I put a black theme on my machine, those controls will be black, and be harder to even see. I then have to change my theme just so I can use that web page.

Then don't do that. That's like walking around with blue-tinted glasses and complaining about how all of the signs in your area look.

Does not fix the fact that millions of users out there who use themes may not even see my web pages as I intend. Is there a way to maybe force colors with javascript or something?

I fucking hope not. Hell, have you been listening at all?

 

[Crusty]

Yea, because all of those people with visual disabilities are really just trying to make your web page look ugly...



Then don't do that. That's like walking around with blue-tinted glasses and complaining about how all of the signs in your area look.



I fucking hope not. Hell, have you been listening at all?

I wonder that myself as well most of the time....

 

[Aluvus]

Glad to see there's a plugin for that though, I will try it out. Does not fix the fact that millions of users out there who use themes may not even see my web pages as I intend. Is there a way to maybe force colors with javascript or something?

If you want text to be a specific color, use CSS to explicitly make it that color. This has the advantage of working on all platforms, while also being possible for the end-user to over-ride (through Firefox extensions, or Opera built-in features).

 

[Red Squirrel]

If you want text to be a specific color, use CSS to explicitly make it that color. This has the advantage of working on all platforms, while also being possible for the end-user to over-ride (through Firefox extensions, or Opera built-in features).

That's the issue though, the theme just overrides the CSS.

Just because I buy a camera with a different skin on it, like blue or something instead of the standard black,does not mean I want my pictures to be that color. This is the argument I'm trying to get across here. I may want my OS elements to be themed, but I don't want the content to be affected. The content should remain the way the content creator intended. Or at least, if it's going to change it, it should do a better job at it. Apply a black theme and go to Google. You'll see what I'm talking about. Half the stuff is black, the other half is not. It makes it look super ugly. For certain sites it even makes the colors clash so bad that it's not readable.

 

[pdusen]

That's the issue though, the theme just overrides the CSS.

Just because I buy a camera with a different skin on it, like blue or something instead of the standard black,does not mean I want my pictures to be that color. This is the argument I'm trying to get across here. I may want my OS elements to be themed, but I don't want the content to be affected. The content should remain the way the content creator intended. Or at least, if it's going to change it, it should do a better job at it. Apply a black theme and go to Google. You'll see what I'm talking about. Half the stuff is black, the other half is not. It makes it look super ugly. For certain sites it even makes the colors clash so bad that it's not readable.

Not readable to YOU. And that's the entire point. It's great that web designers put so much thought into aesthetics, but there are a hundred reasons an end user might want to override those settings--not the least of which is VISUAL DISABILITY.

As far as I know, there is no web designer alive who would want to risk alienating a portion of their website's audience by strictly forcing a color scheme on them. With the possible exception of you.

 

[Nothinman]

Not readable to YOU. And that's the entire point. It's great that web designers put so much thought into aesthetics, but there are a hundred reasons an end user might want to override those settings--not the least of which is VISUAL DISABILITY.

As far as I know, there is no web designer alive who would want to risk alienating a portion of their website's audience by strictly forcing a color scheme on them. With the possible exception of you.

Oh they're out there, they're also in the same group that think designing an entire site in Flash is a good idea.

 

[xSauronx]

Oh they're out there, they're also in the same group that think designing an entire site in Flash is a good idea.

dont give him any ideas, those things are fucking horrible.

 

[Jovec]

It should be an option in the browser to render according to the current theme or retain the original web page's color scheme. How is this even debatable?