WD Raptor 74GB

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
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I've decided to try to take advantage of this forum.

Situation is this. I'm putting together a new system for work (I may build one for private too).
I'm going to be a bit tight lipped here, but I'm working with a very demanding app. As demanding as a 32-bit app can be. Meaning, the cpu crunches at 100% almost continually all day, and I have to consistently fiddle with models, in order to fit into the 32-bit space. With 1GB-1.5GB RAM, swapping during computing is not bad at all though. It swaps, but the time spent swapping is very, very small compared to total computing time.
What is worse is loading/saving work and libraries for various 'tools' during interactive work. This has started to annoy me.

Our hardware budget is rather small, and we are using it to upgrade often, like every year at least, with rather 'value' PC systems. From what we've seen sofar, more ambitious systems, like multi CPU, would not have done as well. (a competitor, only recently was able to replace rather old and slow R6000 workstations. I also suspect their software cost 4 times as much, and we're speaking 6 figure numbers here.) The key is that age defines the performance of a PC much more than cost.

Our current machines are XP3000+, which were found to be much better than Intel on this app, about a year ago. Recent versions, however, have seen some SSE2 optimization of libraries. We are going to try A64 3400+ and socket 478 3.2GHz P4E this time. My money is on the 3400+, because I think the code still suits AMD better (and we may see a 64-bit version, we have requested it.), but we do use 2.8P4Cs for other apps, and HT is slightly tempting.

Anyway, because I've found waiting on HD-activity annoying lately, I'm tempted to put 74GB Raptors in the machines. Drawbacks, as I see it, are noise - 32dBA is abit too much for us, I suspect. And economy, we don't get many GB for our money here :( . I'm busting the budget a bit, we already have other HDs we could use instead, and I'm not sure we'll have enough space...)

We will not consider SCSI, and I don't think we'll consider RAID0.
So, those of you that have experience with the Raptor, do you think it's worth it?
How likely are problems with the SATA150 interface? (nForce3 250, I865PE)
I invite any comments about the Raptors.
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
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81
Its not noisy, is extremely quiet due to Western Digitals use of Fluid Bearings. Look at the latest round up of HDD's and they give you a .wav file to listen to how loud the hdd is.

-Kevin
 

JBT

Lifer
Nov 28, 2001
12,094
1
81
If its just sitting there mine is very quite I can't even hear her. When its seeking it is a little noisey but I like the noise it makes for some reason.
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
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Originally posted by: JBT
If its just sitting there mine is very quite I can't even hear her. When its seeking it is a little noisey but I like the noise it makes for some reason.

Ah, of course... That 32dBA spec is when working :light:. Ok that's better.
 

MDE

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
13,199
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My 36GB ball bearing Raptors are pretty quiet, the 74GB ones must be almost dead silent.
 

iwantanewcomputer

Diamond Member
Apr 4, 2004
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if you don't mind waiting a few extra seconds when you save something big stick with big slow drives. if you do a lot of saving and loading big files, it might be worth it. I suspect that they will get cheaper when seagate launches a bunch of new drives this fall. best bet is to get one and try it to see if it's worth it to you. then get a bunch if it is
 

sunase

Senior member
Nov 28, 2002
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Make sure you're doing what you can to split disk activity among multiple disks. I switched to SCSI for my most active drives a long time ago and the best thing was that their performance doesn't slow to a crawl when you ask them to do multiple things (due to command queuing which lets requests be reordered).

A poor man's version of this is to just have several drives and try to split up what's putting them to use. From your description this may help a lot more than just one fast drive. It might also let them make better use of their caches (hd caches do read ahead, so it's not just accessing stuff you've used before either).

HT and/or SMP is nice for keeping things smooth too. ^^
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
689
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Originally posted by: sunase
A poor man's version of this is to just have several drives and try to split up what's putting them to use. From your description this may help a lot more than just one fast drive. It might also let them make better use of their caches (hd caches do read ahead, so it's not just accessing stuff you've used before either).

Hmm. I have almost decided to try the Raptor, but like this?:

hd0: Windows + tools & libraries.
hd1: swap + (lighter auxiliary tools and their projects. not normally in use).
hd2: projects.

I'm not sure, but I think you may have hit the button, maybe we should try SCSI anyway...
What about one small affordable SCSI for OS, swap and tools, and large cheap IDE for projects?
 

n7

Elite Member
Jan 4, 2004
21,281
4
81
I'm one if those people who thinks spending the extra $$ on a raptor was worth it.

Just for game loading times alone, to me it's worth it.

Installing large programs also seems to be faster, to me anyway.
 

GnomeCop

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2002
3,863
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76
I have one in my PC which overall is very quiet. I wanted it even quieter so I put it in a zalman heatpipe cooler that uses rubber standoffs to suspend it in a 5 1/4 bay. Its pretty much inaudible right now
 

DJFuji

Diamond Member
Oct 18, 1999
3,643
1
76
i was trying to decide last week whether i should just use a 160gig cache maxtor for my boot drive or if i should buy a 74g raptor. Decided on the raptor and speed increases are VERY noticable. It was a little pricey but worth it IMO. About as quiet as my other 7200 drives, too, if not quieter.
 

oldfart

Lifer
Dec 2, 1999
10,207
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Originally posted by: GnomeCop
I have one in my PC which overall is very quiet. I wanted it even quieter so I put it in a zalman heatpipe cooler that uses rubber standoffs to suspend it in a 5 1/4 bay. Its pretty much inaudible right now
Yup. Mine made my whole case buzz, and the seeks were very loud. The Zalman took care of the problem. Can't hear it now.
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
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Thankyou all, guys
rose.gif
We'll be going with Raptors.
(I still think noise might be an issue, but there's probably solutions to that.)
 

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
8,808
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Originally posted by: Vee
Thankyou all, guys
rose.gif
We'll be going with Raptors.
(I still think noise might be an issue, but there's probably solutions to that.)

If your limitation is raw read/write speed (ie, loading and saving extremely large files), a RAID0 or RAID5 configuration would be FAR faster than a Raptor drive, and still probably better in terms of $/GB (unless your stuff can fit onto a single Raptor per workstation). If you only need store, say, 30GB of data, the single Raptor drive (or switching over to 15KRPM SCSI) makes more sense.
 

MDE

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
13,199
1
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Originally posted by: Vee
Thankyou all, guys
rose.gif
We'll be going with Raptors.
(I still think noise might be an issue, but there's probably solutions to that.)
Do yourself a favor and get one or two and test them out on one workstation before you buy enough for every PC and find out it wasn't really worth it.
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
689
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Originally posted by: Matthias99
If your limitation is raw read/write speed (ie, loading and saving extremely large files), a RAID0 or RAID5 configuration would be FAR faster than a Raptor drive,
Huh?? Not from what I've seen? RAID5 is slow, and RAID0 has never convinced me. I hope the Raptor is better than that. But I think the problem is more the myriads of smaller object/library files, than the large files.
,and still probably better in terms of $/GB (unless your stuff can fit onto a single Raptor per workstation). If you only need store, say, 30GB of data, the single Raptor drive (or switching over to 15KRPM SCSI) makes more sense.
Oh much better GB/$. We *don't want to* afford the space we need on SCSIs or Raptors. But I think an earlier poster hit home with his suggestion to split disc activity. That's what I'll try too.
 

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
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Originally posted by: Vee
Originally posted by: Matthias99
If your limitation is raw read/write speed (ie, loading and saving extremely large files), a RAID0 or RAID5 configuration would be FAR faster than a Raptor drive,
Huh?? Not from what I've seen? RAID5 is slow, and RAID0 has never convinced me. I hope the Raptor is better than that. But I think the problem is more the myriads of smaller object/library files, than the large files.

A RAID5 offers very similar read performance (although somewhat worse write performance) than a RAID0, and both would blow the doors off of a single Raptor disk in terms of STR. From this quote of yours:

What is worse is loading/saving work and libraries for various 'tools' during interactive work.

it sounded like the issue was one of transfer rate. However, if the 'work' and 'libraries' you're referring to are actually many small files, a Raptor (with its significantly lower seek times) will probably outperfom a RAID configuration, unless the files are so small that they fit within a single disk stripe (which would allow multiple reads or writes in parallel on the RAID).

,and still probably better in terms of $/GB (unless your stuff can fit onto a single Raptor per workstation). If you only need store, say, 30GB of data, the single Raptor drive (or switching over to 15KRPM SCSI) makes more sense.
Oh much better GB/$. We *don't want to* afford the space we need on SCSIs or Raptors. But I think an earlier poster hit home with his suggestion to split disc activity. That's what I'll try too.

That may indeed help quite a bit. It's all dependent on the workload, though, and if you're trying to do things in parallel or sequentially. More information would be helpful. :)
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
689
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Originally posted by: Matthias99
Oh much better GB/$. We *don't want to* afford the space we need on SCSIs or Raptors. But I think an earlier poster hit home with his suggestion to split disc activity. That's what I'll try too.

That may indeed help quite a bit. It's all dependent on the workload, though, and if you're trying to do things in parallel or sequentially. More information would be helpful. :)
It's OO and associative.
 

SickBeast

Lifer
Jul 21, 2000
14,377
19
81
Originally posted by: MDE
Originally posted by: Vee
Thankyou all, guys
rose.gif
We'll be going with Raptors.
(I still think noise might be an issue, but there's probably solutions to that.)
Do yourself a favor and get one or two and test them out on one workstation before you buy enough for every PC and find out it wasn't really worth it.

I agree. I felt extremely ripped off when I bought my 36GB Raptor. What a waste. It loads Far Cry one second faster than my 120GB/7200RPM/8MB Maxtor. :roll:
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
689
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Originally posted by: SickBeast
Originally posted by: MDE
Originally posted by: Vee
Thankyou all, guys
rose.gif
We'll be going with Raptors.
(I still think noise might be an issue, but there's probably solutions to that.)
Do yourself a favor and get one or two and test them out on one workstation before you buy enough for every PC and find out it wasn't really worth it.

I agree. I felt extremely ripped off when I bought my 36GB Raptor. What a waste. It loads Far Cry one second faster than my 120GB/7200RPM/8MB Maxtor. :roll:

- Ooops! Ok, I have ordered only one, to test. Thanks again.
 

oldman420

Platinum Member
May 22, 2004
2,179
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if you have a promise controller siig is buggy
but to be honest most 7200 8 meg cach drives will pretty much keep up