watching 720p videos on the pc (x264 mkv's)

Funyuns101

Platinum Member
Jun 15, 2002
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Hi,
I have two older computers one with a P4 3ghz HT and 2gb of ram and ATi 9600 pro: everything runs fine.

My other machine: AMD Athlon 2500+ (OC to 2ghz) with 2gb of ram and nVidia XFX 6200: struggles on them (100% load on the cpu)... would upgrading to a slightly faster 3000+ barton enable me to run them a little faster?
This is in an SFF so I probably can't overclock too much~

(didn't know if i should post on gen. hardware or cpu forum - mods can move it necessary)

edited to include video cards in each system.
 

erwos

Diamond Member
Apr 7, 2005
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Ick, not a pleasant situation to be in. Is there any way of getting a GPU to accelerate it? I'm guessing you're using AGP, unfortunately.
 

Funyuns101

Platinum Member
Jun 15, 2002
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definitely AGP with these... would a faster video card would make a bigger difference?
the system was inherited, and i'm not used to AMD's
 

tw1164

Diamond Member
Dec 8, 1999
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what decoder are you using for h264? You may want to try the CoreAVC, it's one of the faster ones.
 

Funyuns101

Platinum Member
Jun 15, 2002
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definitely using coreAVC. it helps quite a bit already - that's why i was asking about hardware now =\
 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
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Originally posted by: Funyuns101
definitely using coreAVC. it helps quite a bit already - that's why i was asking about hardware now =\

Does your vid card/subsystem provide hardware acceleration? Older dx vid cards 'emulate' dx9 in software mode and fook-up hardware acceleration ...

 

Funyuns101

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Jun 15, 2002
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if it helps, i have a nvidia 6200 in there (AGP)
being an SFF, i don't know how good it would be to stick a power sucking video card like an x800 or something.
it only has a 250 watt power supply
 

MegaVovaN

Diamond Member
May 20, 2005
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I have:
WinXP
2x512 mb DDR 400 ram
AMD Athlon 3200+ (2.21 ghz)

nVidia 6800GT and now 7600GS, AGP
both cards play 720p just fine (apple's quick time does NOT play...their codec sucks)


7600GS is a very weak card in terms of power sucking

another card that would play HD content even better is nvidia 8500 and 8600 series.
 

Funyuns101

Platinum Member
Jun 15, 2002
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i'll take a look into those...
is the consensus the GPU is more important the CPU then?
 

MegaVovaN

Diamond Member
May 20, 2005
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Originally posted by: Funyuns101
i'll take a look into those...
is the consensus the GPU is more important the CPU then?

if GPU itself can decode HD stream, then yes.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
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i've run 720p on xp2000 cpu:p coreavc works fine. course thats like at 1~gb per show type bitrate, any higher would rape it of course. esp apple trailer type stuff.
that being said, dual core cpu makes the process much smoother, you can still multtitask and have plenty left forvideo. single core = suxors for such stuff.
as for gpu, only if you can garrantee it will accelerate that process will it be worth it:p cpu upgrade is a better garrantee. even low end dual core can pull of h264. xp cpus sucked at video decode.
 

heyheybooboo

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Jun 29, 2007
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Originally posted by: Funyuns101
if it helps, i have a nvidia 6200 in there (AGP)
being an SFF, i don't know how good it would be to stick a power sucking video card like an x800 or something.
it only has a 250 watt power supply


My, goodness. Aren't there like a dozen different geforce 6200's ?? :D

Some were 64-bit, others were 128-bit. I think some were 32-bit that 'shared' system ram.

nVidia was really crappy on some of these cards, too. They would say that the card had 128mb of ram when it had 16mb and 'shared' 112mb of sys ram. They were also a little 'loose' with the facts on gpu video hardware acceleration.

I'd venture a guess you got an official 'nvidiot' card in your rig. If one of you other systems has an agp card I'd switch 'em out and compare the difference.

Or I'd drop that suckah for a new card - your rig should not be holding you back with proper codecs and hardware acceleration.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,862
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hm, well that xp system i had ran a 9000pro ati radeon 64mb.
thats OLD.
it still ran 720p ok.
i'm sure it wasn't doing all the video processing possible, but it ran just barely. i don't know how badly nerfed your geforce was but damn
i guess you are paying the sff tax.
 

Funyuns101

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Jun 15, 2002
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Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Funyuns101
if it helps, i have a nvidia 6200 in there (AGP)
being an SFF, i don't know how good it would be to stick a power sucking video card like an x800 or something.
it only has a 250 watt power supply


My, goodness. Aren't there like a dozen different geforce 6200's ?? :D

Some were 64-bit, others were 128-bit. I think some were 32-bit that 'shared' system ram.

nVidia was really crappy on some of these cards, too. They would say that the card had 128mb of ram when it had 16mb and 'shared' 112mb of sys ram. They were also a little 'loose' with the facts on gpu video hardware acceleration.

I'd venture a guess you got an official 'nvidiot' card in your rig. If one of you other systems has an agp card I'd switch 'em out and compare the difference.

Or I'd drop that suckah for a new card - your rig should not be holding you back with proper codecs and hardware acceleration.

It took me awhile to find the video card in there:
link to buy.com w/specs
you think that a 7600GS would fix the issue?
 

MegaVovaN

Diamond Member
May 20, 2005
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NVIDIA® PureVideo? Technology
The combination of high-definition video processors and NVIDIA DVD decoder software delivers unprecedented picture clarity, smooth video, accurate color, and precise image scaling for all video content to turn your PC into a high-end home theater. (Feature requires supported video software.)

http://www.xfxforce.com/web/pr...tConfigurationId=79772




Yeah I'm thinking that would do it. What VGA do you have now?


rdit: damn it, it does not mention HD video though :(
 

Funyuns101

Platinum Member
Jun 15, 2002
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Originally posted by: MegaVovaN
NVIDIA® PureVideo? Technology
The combination of high-definition video processors and NVIDIA DVD decoder software delivers unprecedented picture clarity, smooth video, accurate color, and precise image scaling for all video content to turn your PC into a high-end home theater. (Feature requires supported video software.)

http://www.xfxforce.com/web/pr...tConfigurationId=79772




Yeah I'm thinking that would do it. What VGA do you have now?


rdit: damn it, it does not mention HD video though :(

by VGA, do you mean the video card that i have?

this is the card that's currently installed:
http://www.xfxforce.com/web/pr...tConfigurationId=79772
same thing as you listed, but AGP instead of PCI-e

that program should help is what you're saying?
 

MegaVovaN

Diamond Member
May 20, 2005
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Ahh I see. You have 6200 and videos don't play.

Yes I meant "video card" by "VGA".

I actually have 7600GS in my compy right now. (AMD 3200+ and 1 gb RAM) and it plays 720p fine but struggles on 1080p - that's because my CPU is slow for 1080.

here's quote about 7600GS:
High-Definition H.264, MPEG-2 and WMV Hardware Acceleration2
Smoothly playback H.264, MPEG-2, and WMV video?including WMV HD?with minimal CPU usage so the PC is free to do other work.

Integrated HDTV Encoder
Provides world-class TV-out functionality up to 1080i resolution.

http://www.xfxforce.com/web/pr...ConfigurationId=624732


btw - these functions aren't limited to XFX, you can get any brand...I currently have EVGA 7600GS.


bottom line, 7600GS should play HD even with 2500+
if you want card with more oomph for games, consider 7600GT or 8600GT/s (AGP parts are expensive though)
 

heyheybooboo

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Jun 29, 2007
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Originally posted by: Funyuns101
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Funyuns101
if it helps, i have a nvidia 6200 in there (AGP)
being an SFF, i don't know how good it would be to stick a power sucking video card like an x800 or something.
it only has a 250 watt power supply


My, goodness. Aren't there like a dozen different geforce 6200's ?? :D

Some were 64-bit, others were 128-bit. I think some were 32-bit that 'shared' system ram.

nVidia was really crappy on some of these cards, too. They would say that the card had 128mb of ram when it had 16mb and 'shared' 112mb of sys ram. They were also a little 'loose' with the facts on gpu video hardware acceleration.

I'd venture a guess you got an official 'nvidiot' card in your rig. If one of you other systems has an agp card I'd switch 'em out and compare the difference.

Or I'd drop that suckah for a new card - your rig should not be holding you back with proper codecs and hardware acceleration.

It took me awhile to find the video card in there:
link to buy.com w/specs
you think that a 7600GS would fix the issue?

When you look at the xfx 6200 specs note that that model lists a 64-bit memory bus and 256mb of ram.

720p playback success on this thread is with the 6800GT (256-bit) 7600GS (128-bit) 9000 Pro (128-bit). I've used a FX5500 on a socketA that had 128mb of memory and a 128-bit memory bus.

YMMV but it seems to me with proper codecs, hardware acceleration and a 128-bit memory bus you should be good to go :D
 

Funyuns101

Platinum Member
Jun 15, 2002
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how convenient that newegg is out of stock on the 7600gs.
i'll have to lurk around the for sale forums.
 

themisfit610

Golden Member
Apr 16, 2006
1,352
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NO!!! Don't upgrade your video card!!

You are lacking CPU power, no more.

CoreAVC is the decoder that is doing all the work, and it's purely CPU driven. 720p at even moderate bitrate on an AXP 2500+ is hard work.

Keep in mind that saying "my system doesn't play 720p" doesn't really mean anything. Video playback performance (which as I said depends mostly on the CPU) is affected by both the resolution (480p / 720p / 1080p), AND the bitrate!! Things like Apple HD trailers are moderate in bitrate - under 10 megabit usually. Same goes for most downloaded stuff. Now, HD-DVD and BluRay on the other hand can have incredibly high bitrates - approaching 40 megabit in some cases. This (honestly excessive) bitrate is difficult to decode in software, even for a fast running Core 2 Duo. Hence - GPU acceleration, which can do it real-time on even a meager CPU like yours.

GPU H.264 decode acceleration is tricky to get working, and is only guaranteed to work on HD-DVD / BluRay, with an 8500/8600/8800gt card. (or ATi equivalent). It also requires Cyberlink PowerDVD. It can in some cases work for self generated / downloaded content, but (partly because its implemented in hardware within strict accordance to certain H.264 profiles) it won't work with all content out there, due to varying encoding settings (profiles)

Without GPU acceleration, upgrading your video card will do nothing for you. You can talk until you're blue in the face about memory bus width, but with any reasonably modern card it just doesn't matter that much. All your video card does is take the video frames that are generated by the CPU, scale them to fit your display resolution, and push them out. That's not much more complicated than displaying the Windows desktop. It does make some difference, but it's minuscule.

Here's what you should do

1) Upgrade your CPU. The video card is not the bottleneck in this case!!! This probably means a platform shift, but don't waste your money on an AGP video card. Get one of those cool little boards that lets you use a Core 2 Duo with DDR1 memory and an AGP video card. Get a cheap Core 2 Duo.

2) Use Media Player Classic, and Core AVC. Use the "Overlay Mixer" output renderer in Core AVC. Try Haali's renderer also. This will provide some hardware acceleration for the easy bits like scaling the video to fit your screen resolution etc... Just this may make your Barton 2500+ happier!

Good luck!

~MiSfit