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W10 is old news... what's next?

Charlie98

Charlie98

Diamond Member
I had planned on upgrading my W8.1 game machine to W10 once they worked the major bugs out of it, but after reading some of the stuff about W10, I've decided to just leave W8.1 installed... and before you get up on your high horse, I don't really care about the data mining on my gamer... there isn't really anything else on there that I would be concerned about (as opposed to my business machine that has my business and customer information on it.)

So, everyone waited for W10 to fix the user demands of W8/8.1, and, for some at least, W10 didn't quite get there. And then there is that pesky opted in telemetry thing... EOL for W7, which is where I'm staying, is 5 short years away! Because MS likes to make money, certainly they aren't going to set back content with W10...

Where do you think MS is going to go with Windows '11'? And what can we expect as a replacement when W7 EOL's? By then it's likely we will have Windows '12' or greater... I'm also of the mind that when W7 EOL's, Microsoft will deal it a death blow of some sort... not wanting the OS to live on like XP did. IMHO, they are trying to get rid of W7/8 right now... and get everyone on to W10.

Are they going to continue to leave the traditional UI behind for the touchscreen stuff (a big complaint with W8, but easily overcome with 3rd party applications like Classic Shell.)

What is the future of telemetry/data mining in a mainstream OS? (I only see it getting worse, not better.)

Are they ever going to split the OS into a 'touch' or tablet OS vs PC or desktop OS? (Which is what I think they should do.)
 
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AFAIK the versioning for consumer Windows is gone, 11 will still be known as just "Windows" so it will suddenly be downloaded and upgrade the PC. With Home, the user has no choice in the matter (WU forces the updates). Who knows what they are going to do but none of it is optimized with the desktop as a central focus. Unification is their focus now and you will either find hubris (adapt or GTFO) or disgust. Who knows what they are going to do but the desktop is obviously not a concern for them any longer which could be a fatal error.
 
You might want to read up about Win10 before talking about 'Win11':

http://www.theverge.com/2015/5/7/8568473/windows-10-last-version-of-windows

I personally find the timing of a decision like this to be a bit odd considering the radical overhaul of the UI that occurred with Win8x, and then another overhaul in Win10 UI-wise, it just doesn't seem like MS is ready to pick a particular UI design and stick to it. It seems likely to me that there will be some more radical overhauls to how Windows looks, and these will be forced upon users (the only alternative being that their OS will EOL far sooner, like a version of Windows without the latest service pack, IMO).

At face value it seems like this is a golden opportunity to shell out for a retail version of Win10 Pro so that people who build their own PCs won't have to pay out for Windows ever again, yet on the other hand, terms like "supported lifetime of the device" serve to muddy the waters nicely. Also, if a user has an OEM Win10 licence and a machine that lasts for say 15 years, will they continue to receive security updates the entire time? Is the whole concept of a version of Windows being supported for ten years after its release now an outdated one as far as Win10 is concerned?

PliotronX said:
Who knows what they are going to do but the desktop is obviously not a concern for them any longer which could be a fatal error.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure where you got that idea from, a comparison of Win8 RTM versus Win10 RTM shows quite a bit of acknowledgement of the continued existence of the desktop.
 
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Although MS seems to still be on the idea of 10 being the last OS, the update system they are going to means that there can still be radical changes, they just won't change the name of it (maybe they'll do a build name change, such as the one Android employs). There was a pretty substantial gui change during the testing phase, going from a full screen start menu for everyone, to a simpler one unless you are in tablet mode.

So I don't think we should all succumb to the "it's out now, might as well upgrade" mentality. I personally don't think the "life of the device" means that this OS is going to work until hardware failure, so there is some merit to not paying for the new OS if one doesn't intend to employ it now. But I did use an extra drive to run the upgrade and reserve my "free" version on one of my computers, so it will be there if I decide to use it.

So if you don't want it now, that's fine. It will change over time, even though the name may not. And who knows. It's MS, so maybe in a couple years they will scrap the whole idea.
 
ninaholic37 said:
Linux. Tons of distros to keep you entertained, or you can make your own.
Click to expand...

I can hardly program my coffee maker...


You might want to read up about Win10 before talking about 'Win11'
Click to expand...

So if you don't want it now, that's fine. It will change over time, even though the name may not. And who knows. It's MS, so maybe in a couple years they will scrap the whole idea.
Click to expand...


I just don't see it. Setting on one OS and updating it into oblivion simply is not a smart business model... although I kind of wonder if MS isn't going to eventually switch Windows to subscription model (which would probably be Utopia for them, much like they did with Office 365.)

Eventually there will be substantial enough changes that they will want to call it something else.
 
The way I see it, and this is probably not the way MS sees it... its similar to the naming of OS X....

Windows 10 is the last windows to be releases but there will 10.something, 10.something-something most likely

The current future for windows is a big "pack" for a lack of a better word coming late October that is going to add some of the missing stuff as the late October was the initial target date
 
mikeymikec said:
You might want to read up about Win10 before talking about 'Win11':

http://www.theverge.com/2015/5/7/8568473/windows-10-last-version-of-windows

I personally find the timing of a decision like this to be a bit odd considering the radical overhaul of the UI that occurred with Win8x, and then another overhaul in Win10 UI-wise, it just doesn't seem like MS is ready to pick a particular UI design and stick to it. It seems likely to me that there will be some more radical overhauls to how Windows looks, and these will be forced upon users (the only alternative being that their OS will EOL far sooner, like a version of Windows without the latest service pack, IMO).

At face value it seems like this is a golden opportunity to shell out for a retail version of Win10 Pro so that people who build their own PCs won't have to pay out for Windows ever again, yet on the other hand, terms like "supported lifetime of the device" serve to muddy the waters nicely. Also, if a user has an OEM Win10 licence and a machine that lasts for say 15 years, will they continue to receive security updates the entire time? Is the whole concept of a version of Windows being supported for ten years after its release now an outdated one as far as Win10 is concerned?



I'm not sure where you got that idea from, a comparison of Win8 RTM versus Win10 RTM shows quite a bit of acknowledgement of the continued existence of the desktop.
Click to expand...

Also after so many updates, will the refresh they boxed product and allow new download ISO's? Or will we need to reinstall base Win10 and a huge amount of patches and updates?
 
JimKiler said:
Also after so many updates, will the refresh they boxed product and allow new download ISO's? Or will we need to reinstall base Win10 and a huge amount of patches and updates?
Click to expand...

Going from past experience, it will be unlike they will be updating the isos, but who knows maybe this time they will update them
 
JimKiler said:
Also after so many updates, will the refresh they boxed product and allow new download ISO's? Or will we need to reinstall base Win10 and a huge amount of patches and updates?
Click to expand...

Right now that's the least of my concerns 🙂

Speaking of updates though, I'm wondering how Win10 Home will eventually handle the ~150 or so Windows updates that it will have to install shortly after it has been clean-installed, as each previous version of Windows has a tendency to sometimes burp (in my experience, more often that not) when installing a multitude of updates, spend an hour "reverting after failed update install", then unless its hand is held it tries to do the same thing, over and over again...
 
i am still waiting for something better than windows xp because i have not used anything better yet. yes i have used windows vista, windows 7 (close to being something great) and windows 8.
 
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nemesismk2 said:
i am still waiting for something better than windows xp because i have not used anything better yet. yes i have used windows vista, windows 7 (close to being something great) and windows 8.
Click to expand...


I can't stand using XP now, at least you have Linux distros out there to try 😉 .
 
Dahak said:
The way I see it, and this is probably not the way MS sees it... its similar to the naming of OS X....

Windows 10 is the last windows to be releases but there will 10.something, 10.something-something most likely

The current future for windows is a big "pack" for a lack of a better word coming late October that is going to add some of the missing stuff as the late October was the initial target date
Click to expand...


I'm not sure how or what Microsoft is going to do next, but Win10 has EOL of October 2025, http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/lifecycle .

Regardless should be interesting to see what they do down the road.
 
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Mem said:
I can't stand using XP now, at least you have Linux distros out there to try 😉 .
Click to expand...

I can stand it, but there are too many things I miss going to an XP VM: searching is a pain, network and sharing options are here and there, file renaming is more difficult (if you have show file types enabled), switching folders is not as easy (vs. clicking a folder in the path on the address bar), drivers for newer hardware are almost impossible, and the list goes on and on.

Do yourself a favor nemesismk2 and at least move on to 7.
 
mikeymikec said:
Right now that's the least of my concerns 🙂

Speaking of updates though, I'm wondering how Win10 Home will eventually handle the ~150 or so Windows updates that it will have to install shortly after it has been clean-installed, as each previous version of Windows has a tendency to sometimes burp (in my experience, more often that not) when installing a multitude of updates, spend an hour "reverting after failed update install", then unless its hand is held it tries to do the same thing, over and over again...
Click to expand...
How do you "hold the hand" of a Windows machine that won't successfully install a slew of Windows Updates? That is exactly the state of this laptop I'm using right this moment. It's running Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit and for well over a year it's never succeeded in installing all updates. There are two in particular that seem to be indigestible: KB6828725 and KB2868626, security updates.

I would spend hours trying to do updates and endure hours as the machine would revert. I stopped trying and a week ago tried to update and there were 118 important and 47 optional. After 1/2 a day the machine spent 2+ hours reverting. Now there are about 87 important updates, I won't bother trying to install them.

If I do the Windows 10 upgrade is it possible that will do an end run around this update problem? Or should I just install Windows 7 from scratch? My backup of the computer was lost when the external HD died. I'm wondering, should I just ignore Win10 altogether at least with this machine and stick with 7, also. I have never even had a look at 8.x.
 
More marketing and cost to the consumer with loss of enmity to the feds.

If something doesn't incur with MS my next OS will be Linux - The only thing is I'm lazy, lousy compiler of the Linux Kernel and a great Win Hacker - LOL.

It's no big deal for me to go to WinX but I gotta hear more from my peers before I experiment with it

I'm cautious when it comes to New OS's and hold onto Systems that work.
 
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Muse said:
How do you "hold the hand" of a Windows machine that won't successfully install a slew of Windows Updates? That is exactly the state of this laptop I'm using right this moment. It's running Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit and for well over a year it's never succeeded in installing all updates. There are two in particular that seem to be indigestible: KB6828725 and KB2868626, security updates.

I would spend hours trying to do updates and endure hours as the machine would revert. I stopped trying and a week ago tried to update and there were 118 important and 47 optional. After 1/2 a day the machine spent 2+ hours reverting. Now there are about 87 important updates, I won't bother trying to install them.

If I do the Windows 10 upgrade is it possible that will do an end run around this update problem? Or should I just install Windows 7 from scratch? My backup of the computer was lost when the external HD died. I'm wondering, should I just ignore Win10 altogether at least with this machine and stick with 7, also. I have never even had a look at 8.x.
Click to expand...

Bear in mind what I'm talking about is with a new Windows install - simply tick a handful of updates at a time (I normally to 10-15), do the 'platform update' (listed under optional yet is required for IE11 - a non-optional update!) before IE11. Recently I've taken to doing all the .net 3.5.1 updates in one go as that seems to work.

What errors are you getting for the updates you're installing? Have you tried googling the errors? If you double-click on a failed update in the Windows Update history, it will give you the error number reported for that update. If you need further assistance I would suggest starting up another thread and if I see it, of course I'll help with it if I can.

You may also want to google for those KB numbers and see whether other people are having problems with them. There were two or three to do with the Win10 upgrade that caused loads of problems, for example.

I certainly wouldn't try to do a Win10 upgrade on a computer that could be having other issues and failed updates being a symptom of that.

In short, unless you like wasting time, don't ever try to have WU install ~100 updates in one go, I'd say there's a 75% chance that it will end negatively, and as you say, it takes ages to revert.
 
Muse said:
How do you "hold the hand" of a Windows machine that won't successfully install a slew of Windows Updates? That is exactly the state of this laptop I'm using right this moment. It's running Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit and for well over a year it's never succeeded in installing all updates. There are two in particular that seem to be indigestible: KB6828725 and KB2868626, security updates.
Click to expand...

I have my sister's notebook for some cleaning and it repeatedly refused to install an update (KB2570947) on Windows 7 Home Premium. I ended up downloading the update from Microsoft and installing it "manually" a few minutes ago. Worked fine like that. If it's just a few updates that are blocking you, it's a good way to do it.
 
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