VP and P Chemistry: an analysis

[mizzou]

Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

 

[nageov3t]

I have a feeling you'll judge perceived chemistry based on preexisting biases.

 

[Rainsford]

Considering Palin was chosen most for marketing reasons, this seems like an even stranger choice for the McCain campaign. Palin was clearly a choice to bring in the people who aren't (or don't think like) 140 year old white men, but the problem is that Palin just draws MORE attention to McCain's issues in that regard.

On the other hand, I think Palin was also picked to draw in the far right that McCain seems to be having trouble with, and those folks are so easy to manipulate I wouldn't be surprised if it worked.

 

[pstylesss]

Originally posted by: loki8481
I have a feeling you'll judge perceived chemistry based on preexisting biases.

I have a feeling loki is correct.

I also have a feeling this thread is stupid.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

 

[mizzou]

Originally posted by: loki8481
I have a feeling you'll judge perceived chemistry based on preexisting biases.

lol, show me a picture of the two standing next to each other and post the other one right next to it with the other candidates and tell me I'm biased

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: mizzou

Originally posted by: loki8481
I have a feeling you'll judge perceived chemistry based on preexisting biases.

lol, show me a picture of the two standing next to each other and post the other one right next to it with the other candidates and tell me I'm biased

they've been photographed together on one occasion and they were standing apart?

and what does chemistry even matter?

Reagan and Bush hated each other, and there was never much love between Clinton and Gore... and maybe Bush and Cheney are too close.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: mizzou

Originally posted by: loki8481
I have a feeling you'll judge perceived chemistry based on preexisting biases.

lol, show me a picture of the two standing next to each other and post the other one right next to it with the other candidates and tell me I'm biased

they've been photographed together on one occasion and they were standing apart?

and what does chemistry even matter?

Reagan and Bush hated each other, and there was never much love between Clinton and Gore... and maybe Bush and Cheney are too close.

They don't have to be drinking buddies, but I think a good working relationship is probably a good thing.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

what were you, born in the 1800's?

who was the last VP *not* chosen to balance the ticket, win a state, or appeal to a demographic?

 

[QED]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

I hear the LBJ was picked because JFK really, really loved him and thought he would make a great President. It had absolutely nothing to do with JFK needing to win Texas, I'm sure. I also hear LBJ thought the world of JFK as well. Yep, those were the good ol' days... when the President and his VP really respected and admired each other.



I hate to break it to you, but that "old fashioned sense" is just another bit of false nostalgia...

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

what were you, born in the 1800's?

who was the last VP *not* chosen to balance the ticket, win a state, or appeal to a demographic?

What part of chosen not JUST to win a certain demographic do you find confusing?

I'm absolutely fine with a VP candidate balancing the ticket in some way, it's just when they are so obviously picked for that skill and that skill ALONE, as Palin was, that I have a little bit of a problem. VP may not be a major position of power in this country, but it's not a throwaway job...I'm fine if the VP candidate was chosen to bring in religious conservatives (or whatever), but not if that's ALL they bring to the table.

 

[tvarad]

For McCain's sake, I sure hope she knows how to spell "potato".

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: QED

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

I hear the LBJ was picked because JFK really, really loved him and thought he would make a great President. I hear LBJ thought the world of JFK as well. Yep, those were the good ol' days... when the President and his VP really respected and admired each other.



I hate to break it to you, but that "old fashioned sense" is just another bit of false nostalgia...

So maybe "old fashioned" is the wrong description, but for all your smart-ass responses, is what I'm talking about so unreasonable? You guys aren't professional political operatives, aren't you supposed to care about the country rather than party strategy?

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: Rainsford
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

I'm not feeling you on this one. It's certainly possible they have worst chemistry than Obama-Biden, but I doubt this will hurt their campaign.

 

[QED]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: QED

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

I hear the LBJ was picked because JFK really, really loved him and thought he would make a great President. I hear LBJ thought the world of JFK as well. Yep, those were the good ol' days... when the President and his VP really respected and admired each other.



I hate to break it to you, but that "old fashioned sense" is just another bit of false nostalgia...

So maybe "old fashioned" is the wrong description, but for all your smart-ass responses, is what I'm talking about so unreasonable? You guys aren't professional political operatives, aren't you supposed to care about the country rather than party strategy?

Yes, there are a lot of things I wish were different about how we elect our politicians at all levels. But condeming McCain for making a pick to appeal to a certain demographic when in reality, all VP picks are chosen for just a reason strikes me as disengenous.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: Rainsford
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

I'm not feeling you on this one. It's certainly possible they have worst chemistry than Obama-Biden, but I doubt this will hurt their campaign.

I think I expressed my viewpoint there very poorly. I just get this overwhelming feeling from Palin that politics trumped common sense even more than usual. Maybe it's not the chemistry with McCain, but while I'm sure it was great party strategy, I think it was a TERRIBLE VP choice.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: QED

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: QED

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

I hear the LBJ was picked because JFK really, really loved him and thought he would make a great President. I hear LBJ thought the world of JFK as well. Yep, those were the good ol' days... when the President and his VP really respected and admired each other.



I hate to break it to you, but that "old fashioned sense" is just another bit of false nostalgia...

So maybe "old fashioned" is the wrong description, but for all your smart-ass responses, is what I'm talking about so unreasonable? You guys aren't professional political operatives, aren't you supposed to care about the country rather than party strategy?

Yes, there are a lot of things I wish were different about how we elect our politicians at all levels. But condeming McCain for making a pick to appeal to a certain demographic when in reality, all VP picks are chosen for just a reason strikes me as disengenous.

I don't think that word (disingenuous) means what you think it means...

Mostly because I'm NOT condemning McCain, I'm saying I don't like this kind of politics, period. I realize the Democrats made their VP choice for the same reason, and I believe I said so in another thread, but I think that at least HE'D be a good VP.

 

[winnar111]

Kind of odd how inexperienced Obama can count on Biden to provide experience for his Presidency, but Palin cannot count on insertGOPVPreplacementhere to provide experience in the rare event she is forced to assume the Presidency.

 

[nageov3t]

if McCain were to die, the democrats would probably force one of their own picks on her.

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: loki8481
if McCain were to die, the democrats would probably force one of their own picks on her.

Probably. That happened with Gerald Ford.

Either way the person would likely be a Congressional veteran.

 

[QED]

Originally posted by: Rainsford
I don't think that word (disingenuous) means what you think it means...

Mostly because I'm NOT condemning McCain, I'm saying I don't like this kind of politics, period. I realize the Democrats made their VP choice for the same reason, and I believe I said so in another thread, but I think that at least HE'D be a good VP.

No, disingenuous means exactly what I thought it means-- "not straight-forward or candid".

You posed a question in which you waxed poetic about how noble it was in days of old for a President to select a Vice President based soley on his (or her) capability and qualifactions to be President, and round-aboutly criticized McCain for not doing so. Yet your posts in other threads indicate you are an Obama supporter and hence would (or should) have no concern over the methods or reasonings behind John McCain's selection, and you conveniently left out the political considerations of your own candidate when he selected his VP.

Hence, your innocent looking questions appears to be nothing more than an attempted subtle jab at McCain for doing the very thing that Obama, and every other Presidential candidate in the past, has done.

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: mizzou
Obama and Biden look smooth together, they 'jive'. Sort of like good cop bad copy I guess? It's just a first impression


McCain and Palin? Lol, they look SO awkward, it's like McCain trying to act hip with the "kids". Massive FAIL in a media driven election environment. I see them way off the same page.



I have a feeling the chemistry will make a huge difference in the coming weeks.

Is chemistry really that important? Frequently the P and VP are separated or at different rallys. Generally Ps choose VPs that compliment them or have somethingthe P lacks (Gore is somewhat of an exception)

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I remember that the VP is chosen not just to win a certain demographic, but because we want someone there in case the President can't serve for whatever reason. If you have a VP who was picked to win religious conservatives or to make McCain more appealing to people who can't remember the great depression, you run the risk of having someone who's a crummy choice for actually meeting the responsibilities of the office. And if the VP can't interact well with the President, that doesn't speak well towards being able to take over if necessary.

Hi, John Edwards, nice to meet you!

 

[Lemon law]

On another thread there was some mumblings about some conservative rage against Palin. I doubt Palin is all that popular with oil companies and by extension other business interests. And if the Palin pick will evolve into another Miers like flap where McCain faces some opposition for not consulting prior with parts of his own base, it could take quite a while to coalesce. But other than that speculation, I see little evidence
to conclude the McCain Palin "Chemistry" will clash.

In some ways, the Palin pick somewhat reminds me of McKinley picking Teddy Roosevelt 1900. The most horrified GOP figure was a fellow by Mark Hanna, but the bulk of GOP pro business types knew they could live with McKinley and were oblivious to that one heart beat away from the Presidency threat of TR. And in fact, TR proved the threat was real, TR actually might have lost the nomination of his own party in 1904 to Mark Hanna. But when Mark Hanna died of natural causes before the serious run could be made, TR got his second term.

And in some ways loki8481 could have a point, if she is elevated to the Presidency by the death of McCain, I do not think she will be happy with most of the former GWB advisers as she would be forced to put together her own team. She could make some very good choices or some very bad ones, but any VP the dems might force on her would have no real power, unless once gain, she might make that veep into a one heart beat away elevation.