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Volkswagen & Audi

Knavish

Knavish

Senior member
While I'm sure most people in this forum are in the know, it seems like a lot of people don't realize that Volkswagen and Audi are the same company. Do you guys notice this too?

Not to mention that the VW / Audi corporation is almost 50% owned by Porche...

 
Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
no wai! So that's why half my VW parts says Audi 😉😉

Audi > VW either way ^_^ interior's are world ahead I M O.
Click to expand...

It's been that way for decades. All three companies are run by members of the Porsche family.

A good number of the interior bits on my 944 are stamped with the Audi symbol. Hell, almost every 944 was assembled in Audi's Neckarsulm plant. Most of the parts in a 356 have some connection to VW as well. 🙂

ZV
 
I'm sure that one of our crappy company cars way back, a Plymouth Horizon, had an engine with the 4 rings on it...
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
no wai! So that's why half my VW parts says Audi 😉😉

Audi > VW either way ^_^ interior's are world ahead I M O.
Click to expand...

It's been that way for decades. All three companies are run by members of the Porsche family.

A good number of the interior bits on my 944 are stamped with the Audi symbol. Hell, almost every 944 was assembled in Audi's Neckarsulm plant. Most of the parts in a 356 have some connection to VW as well. 🙂

ZV
Click to expand...

Except now Porsche actually owns them (it is final, right?). Porsche and VW Group have always had a close working relationship. I hope Porsche fixes VW though. Besides the reliability, even though VW is still profitable, they're going through similar problems GM and Ford are going through.
 
Originally posted by: Strk
Except now Porsche actually owns them (it is final, right?). Porsche and VW Group have always had a close working relationship. I hope Porsche fixes VW though. Besides the reliability, even though VW is still profitable, they're going through similar problems GM and Ford are going through.
Click to expand...

Yeah it's a bit strange. I think the EU finally overruled that German state law that forbade anyone from exceeding a 20% controlling interest in VW. Last I read, Porche owned between 40 and 50% of VW stock. Isn't it weird how a specialty car company can make enough profit to buy a controlling interest in one of the world's biggest auto manufacturers?

...well I suppose it wouldn't be too hard to buy GM at this point, if you didn't mind taking over their obligations. What are they worth, something like $12 billion now?
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I'm sure that one of our crappy company cars way back, a Plymouth Horizon, had an engine with the 4 rings on it...
Click to expand...

Close. The 1.7 litre in the Omni/Horizon was sourced from VW, though Chrysler modified it significantly. It's basically a VW short block with Chrysler-designed intake, exhaust, mounts, and fuel delivery. Even the belts and sprockets were added by Chrysler and were not VW parts.

ZV
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
I'm sure that one of our crappy company cars way back, a Plymouth Horizon, had an engine with the 4 rings on it...
Click to expand...

Close. The 1.7 litre in the Omni/Horizon was sourced from VW, though Chrysler modified it significantly. It's basically a VW short block with Chrysler-designed intake, exhaust, mounts, and fuel delivery. Even the belts and sprockets were added by Chrysler and were not VW parts.

ZV
Click to expand...

Damn, that'd be a tough poll :

What would you rather have? A '70s/80s-era Chrysler motor, or a '70s/'80s-era VW motor? Or how about some bastardization with influence from both?

Win/win? heh.
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
The block was definitely from Audi. It had the 4 rings on it.

My brothers remember it as well.
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It may well have had Audi markings on it, but it was a VW part. VW and Audi have been one company for a long time.

ZV
 
Only mention of it being an Audi block that I could find on short notice...


The new "1100" based car would be sold alongside the 1100 and its' descendants. It would be slightly larger, better equipped, and more powerful (depending on the model) than the 1100. During the late planning stages, it was decided to try the car in North America. This time, though, it would be sold under the "familiar family" names Dodge and Plymouth, not as an "imported Simca". The only problem was that no engine had been developed specifically to meet U.S. emissions. The last Chrysler engine from Europe had been in the Plymouth Cricket (U.K. Chrysler Avenger) that was phased out in 1973 before the "new for 1975 model year" regulations, such as unleaded fuel, had been enacted. Chrysler used their connection with VW to obtain a 1.7l Audi block to which they mounted their own head and carburetor so that they could meet U.S. emissions and still introduce the car in time. The Simca 1.6 would soon be ready for the U.S. and planned 1.8 and 2.2 litre engines using the same block would become the top of the line engines for the model in the U.S. The 1.6 was supplied to Chrysler in North America as part of the Peugeot deal in Europe through 1985. The 1.8 was never built, but the 2.2 became the main Chrysler four cylinder and spawned several turbo versions and the 2.5.


http://sev2maryann.severnschoo...t/hobbies/yostcars.htm
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Only mention of it being an Audi block that I could find on short notice...


The new "1100" based car would be sold alongside the 1100 and its' descendants. It would be slightly larger, better equipped, and more powerful (depending on the model) than the 1100. During the late planning stages, it was decided to try the car in North America. This time, though, it would be sold under the "familiar family" names Dodge and Plymouth, not as an "imported Simca". The only problem was that no engine had been developed specifically to meet U.S. emissions. The last Chrysler engine from Europe had been in the Plymouth Cricket (U.K. Chrysler Avenger) that was phased out in 1973 before the "new for 1975 model year" regulations, such as unleaded fuel, had been enacted. Chrysler used their connection with VW to obtain a 1.7l Audi block to which they mounted their own head and carburetor so that they could meet U.S. emissions and still introduce the car in time. The Simca 1.6 would soon be ready for the U.S. and planned 1.8 and 2.2 litre engines using the same block would become the top of the line engines for the model in the U.S. The 1.6 was supplied to Chrysler in North America as part of the Peugeot deal in Europe through 1985. The 1.8 was never built, but the 2.2 became the main Chrysler four cylinder and spawned several turbo versions and the 2.5.


http://sev2maryann.severnschoo...t/hobbies/yostcars.htm
Click to expand...

From Allpar:

Originally, a 2.0 liter four-cylinder was created by Chrysler for use in the new car; and while this was being engineered, negotiations were started with Volkswagen to adapt their existing Rabbit engine to Chrysler?s needs. This involved a power boost, handled by expanding from 1.5 to 1.7 liters, and modifications to fit in the engine bay; minor changes were made to the block to accommodate the longer stroke and to attach the A404 automatic transmission. Engine dressing was very different from the Rabbit due to differences in the engine compartment; Chrysler used its own intake and exhaust manifolds, engine mounts, and fuel delivery. As a result, Volkswagen merely shipped ?short engines? to the Trenton Assembly plant, which dressed the engines, adding even timing belts and sprockets. The engines produced 75 hp at launch, backed up by 90 lb-ft of torque (in California both numbers were lower), for sprightly acceleration with a manual transmission and acceptable automatic performance.

The 1.7 liter engine used an iron block with aluminum heads; valves were powered by a single overhead cam that used shims to adjust valve lash. There were five main journals on the forged-steel crankshaft; the timing belt drove the cam and an auxiliary shaft for the oil pump and distributor. A two-barrel carburetor was used, as was an electric fan. Emissions were aided by an air pump. The Omni and Horizon launched in the United States in January 1978 and were instant sales successes, despite the failure of prior European imports, due to the Americanization efforts and local manufacturing. Based on their success, Chrysler created the TC3 and O24 models, both using the 1.7 liter engine at first.
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The engine was a derivative of the unit in the VW Rabbit (Golf). I'm certain that any water-cooled, inline VW engine of that era would have Audi markings on it though. That just illustrates how closely the companies are tied.

ZV
 
You forgot Seat and ?koda.


Originally posted by: Strk


Except now Porsche actually owns them (it is final, right?). Porsche and VW Group have always had a close working relationship. I hope Porsche fixes VW though. Besides the reliability, even though VW is still profitable, they're going through similar problems GM and Ford are going through.
Click to expand...

I fail to see how VW's situation is in any way related to the big 3's situation. At all.
 
Originally posted by: Colt45
You forgot Seat and ?koda.


Originally posted by: Strk


Except now Porsche actually owns them (it is final, right?). Porsche and VW Group have always had a close working relationship. I hope Porsche fixes VW though. Besides the reliability, even though VW is still profitable, they're going through similar problems GM and Ford are going through.
Click to expand...

I fail to see how VW's situation is in any way related to the big 3's situation. At all.
Click to expand...

VW loses money on cars sold in the US. On top of that, VW has had serious efficency issues with its factories. You have some in Europe doing 32 hour weeks (I think one was even down to 28 in an attempt to reduce costs). As I said, while they've managed to remain profitable, VW has some serious financial issues that, hopefully, Porsche will fix. One of the reasons the German government fought so hard to keep Porsche from gaining control is that they will probably start to lay off a lot of people. I never said it was related to the big three (really two; Chrysler is rubbish), I just said they were facing similar issues, but they've managed to remain profitable.
 
People generally don't have a clue when it comes to cars. The ones that know generally know a lot. I find people don't know that Acura is Honda and Lexus is Toyota. People assume Land Rovers are amazing cars and not realize they have terrible realiability. Also people have no idea which countries the cars originate from. A VW Jetta is German sure, but it's made in Mexico, just like most Sony TV's are.

I only buy German, Japanese, and American/Canadian made, but even the last 2 are a bit iffy, especially Canada since most of this country is retarded.
 
Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
no wai! So that's why half my VW parts says Audi 😉😉

Audi > VW either way ^_^ interior's are world ahead I M O.
Click to expand...

I've had multiple people say that VWs use BMW parts and that's why they are so expensive. Even after I explain that it's probably Audi parts and that BMW is a completely different company they still insist that they were told by somebody who knows cars. Most people have no clue about the things they use.
 
If you think this is bad, consider this: the majority of Americans are unaware that Ford and GM sell cars overseas that they don't sell here. In fact, if you'd ask them what Holden, Vauxhall and Opel have in common, they'll tell you "they're all foriegn".

There's then the absolute madness of who owns who. Last I checked, GM actually owns about 10% of Ferrari, Mercedes-Benz owns almost all of Cosworth, and the Toyota-Subaru-Daihatsu mess is indecipherable by anyone but an obsessive-compulsive with an MBA.
 
Originally posted by: Cheesehead
If you think this is bad, consider this: the majority of Americans are unaware that Ford and GM sell cars overseas that they don't sell here. In fact, if you'd ask them what Holden, Vauxhall and Opel have in common, they'll tell you "they're all foriegn".

There's then the absolute madness of who owns who. Last I checked, GM actually owns about 10% of Ferrari, Mercedes-Benz owns almost all of Cosworth, and the Toyota-Subaru-Daihatsu mess is indecipherable by anyone but an obsessive-compulsive with an MBA.
Click to expand...

While I understand what you mean, it's worth pointing out that GM and Ford let their foreigh subsidiaries do a lot of their own thing. If anything, they're just realizing how much it's hurt them not having global platforms. It's especially bad now since they realized they were actually making decent cars overseas while giving us crap. I thinkt he prime example is Saturn. Other than the Outlook, they just replaced everything with an Opel.
 
Originally posted by: Cheesehead
If you think this is bad, consider this: the majority of Americans are unaware that Ford and GM sell cars overseas that they don't sell here. In fact, if you'd ask them what Holden, Vauxhall and Opel have in common, they'll tell you "they're all foriegn".

There's then the absolute madness of who owns who. Last I checked, GM actually owns about 10% of Ferrari, Mercedes-Benz owns almost all of Cosworth, and the Toyota-Subaru-Daihatsu mess is indecipherable by anyone but an obsessive-compulsive with an MBA.
Click to expand...

those brands you mention are actually wholly-owned subsidiaries. they operate rather independently from the rest of gm and ford.
 
not to mention the Ferrari-Fiat-Maserati-Alfa nonsense.

edit - Nissan+Renault seems to be one of the only ones I understand. Thank you Ghosn for saving them
 
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