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Vinyls > CDs??? Placebo effects.
- Thread starter SSSnail
- Start date
S
SlitheryDee
Someone told me once that vinyls actually reproduce sounds that are above the range of human hearing, where cds are limited to 20000khz. I asked them "What's the difference if it's above human hearing anyway"? They said that the extra range "does things" to the sounds that you can hear and overall improves the listening experience. I dunno if this is true or not though. *shrug*
SSSnail
Lifer
That "warmth" is artificial, it's NOISE or POLLUTION. I do have a tube amp and it's a PITA. To be honest I could NEVER tell the difference between its output and that of a quality class A/AB digital amp.
I think you're on to something. Is that why RCA has a dog listening to a record? :Q
Why is your tube amp a PITA? I've had my 5150 head since they first came out (early 90's) and I've never done anything to it other than change tubes. It runs great.
I can def tell the difference between a tube and solid state amp. I guess it's just based on how your ears hear things. Solid State amps have a more metal type sound to me and just seem sort of lifeless or artificial. It's like I always know when I'm listening to Pantera because his sound is just so solid state. Same with White Zombie back in the day. Their tones are similar because of those solid state amps.
I have no experience with vinyl though, so I can't tell you. But, reading Sound and Vision it seems like a lot of reputable musicians and studio people love vinyl. I mean they can't all be wrong cant they?
Vinyl vs CD WOULD have a difference in their sound because they are totally different physical medium. Stupid comparison to the Monster Cable type debate. A cable is a cable if it's essentially the same, but there is OBVIOUSLY a difference between an HDMI cable and an S-video cable.
SSSnail
Lifer
Well, it doesn't have a remote for one. Every time I want to turn it on or off, the volume goes to 0 and I STILL hear crackle on my speakers. I have to wait a bit before I can crank it. All the transistors that could be changed were "upgraded" by a friend with parts from Partsconnexion in an attempt to give me extended lower range. It put out too much heat, in my bedroom sometimes I use it as a space heater. It's freaking heavy...
Edit: about those guys on the magazine, this one time someone played a prank on them and told them A has such and such and therefore better than B blah blah, and they all agreed. Turned out just some BS. I'd go with the mass snob effects as well.
zerocool84
Lifer
I'd go with the snob effect as well.
ShotgunSteven
Lifer
I really need to put a shortcut on my desktop to the study where they played CD's for vinyl aficionados, and added hiss and background noise. The vinyl folks swore up and down that the "records" they were listening to sounded much better than the CD's they listened to afterwards. (It was the same CD's minus the added noise.)
The damned thing is probably here it the ATOT archives somewhere, I believe this is where I originally got the link from years ago.
The damned thing is probably here it the ATOT archives somewhere, I believe this is where I originally got the link from years ago.
ShotgunSteven
Lifer
I, for one, welcome our new vBulletin Overlords. 😛
lxskllr
No Lifer
Even if we go on the premise that vinyl is better than cd. That only applies to the first time you play it. Vinyl degrades every time the needle runs through the grooves, but a cd will sound exactly the same every time you play it, as long as it's properly cared for. I think that's enough of a reason to choose cd over vinyl.
Even in double blind test people can pick out vinyl as the more natural and accurate sound. There really isn't much debate about it - it sounds better and more real. There's a reason for SACD and DVD-A, it's because CDs can't compare to a good analog recording and playback. Nyquest was wrong.
Regarding frequency response of vinyl - the above 20Khz is what are known as overtones, variations in the waveform above the actual note. It's what make a trombone sound different than a trumpet.
So just stop it with the nonsense, it does sound better an that's a fact.
Regarding frequency response of vinyl - the above 20Khz is what are known as overtones, variations in the waveform above the actual note. It's what make a trombone sound different than a trumpet.
So just stop it with the nonsense, it does sound better an that's a fact.
S
SlitheryDee
That's funny, cuz the guy who told me this was a musician as well. He had been recorded with several bands and was easily the most badass guitar player I've known personally.
Squisher
Lifer
I bought my speakers a couple of years before cds came out. My speakers are a little on the shrill side, but sound great with vinyl, less so with cds. If I had to redo it, I'd probably not have gone with Klipsch if I had known a new format that sounded different was coming out. Although, I'm sure not going to throw them to curb. They've kinda grown on me.
I realize what I'm hearing is distortion, but it is the distortion that I love.
I realize what I'm hearing is distortion, but it is the distortion that I love.
CallMeJoe
Diamond Member
Because of the low sampling rate of CD audio (44.1 KHz), there are phasing errors in their audio reproduction; i.e. the higher frequencies in the music are "time shifted" slightly relative to the lower frequencies. Some people may be more sensitive than others to this phenomenon, giving purely analog vinyl recordings a more "natural" sound. This idea, of course, disregards the fact that most electronic circuits do not have a truly linear phase vs. frequency response, and introduce phase errors in all music, including that from vinyl. Speakers are also notorious for non-linear phase response.
Compression is not limited to CD audio. Recording engineers have been limiting low frequency excursions and compressing dynamic range in recordings for decades, including for vinyl recordings.
Tube amplifiers do indeed sound different than do solid state amplifiers, when they distort. Solid amplifiers "clip" the peaks of the signal, generating primarily odd-number harmonics of the primary frequencies; tube amplifiers have a "softer" response at saturation, generating more even-numbered harmonics. Since even-numbered harmonics occur naturally in all musical instruments, these spurious harmonics blend more subtly with the normal harmonic tones of the instruments and give the tube amplifier's distortion a warmer, more natural sound - when the amplifier is over-driven into distortion.
Finally, the overtones that make different instruments sound different are well within the normal audible range. One can easily distinguish between a trumpet and a trombone entirely from frequencies below 20 KHz. If this were not so, the instruments would sound identical on CD recordings which cannot possibly exceed 22.05 KHz due to the nature of the CDAD digital recording/reproduction process.
Compression is not limited to CD audio. Recording engineers have been limiting low frequency excursions and compressing dynamic range in recordings for decades, including for vinyl recordings.
Tube amplifiers do indeed sound different than do solid state amplifiers, when they distort. Solid amplifiers "clip" the peaks of the signal, generating primarily odd-number harmonics of the primary frequencies; tube amplifiers have a "softer" response at saturation, generating more even-numbered harmonics. Since even-numbered harmonics occur naturally in all musical instruments, these spurious harmonics blend more subtly with the normal harmonic tones of the instruments and give the tube amplifier's distortion a warmer, more natural sound - when the amplifier is over-driven into distortion.
Finally, the overtones that make different instruments sound different are well within the normal audible range. One can easily distinguish between a trumpet and a trombone entirely from frequencies below 20 KHz. If this were not so, the instruments would sound identical on CD recordings which cannot possibly exceed 22.05 KHz due to the nature of the CDAD digital recording/reproduction process.