Very slow WinXP boot after changing domain

[Fardringle]

I'll try to make this as short as possible while still providing the important information. There's a lot of relevant info, so please bear with me!

One of the office networks I manage recently had me upgrade their domain controller. They were previously using NT 4.0 on a P3 933 system with 768 MB of PC133 RAM and two 8 GB slow SCSI drives, and it was virtually flawless in every respect. (Personally, I don't think they even needed to upgrade but the boss's idiot contractor friend said he should and the boss wrote the check so it happened, but that's another story entirely... 😉)

Anyway, the new server is a dual P4 Xeon 3.2Ghz running Server 2003 Small Business with 1 GB of DDR (PC 3200 I believe) ECC RAM and two 79GB 15K RPM SCSI drives in Raid 1. In order to simplify things with the agency management software they use (it is EXTREMELY picky about PC and domain names and drive mappings) I named the domain on the new server with the same name as the old domain. After copying all relevant files to the new server, disconnecting the old server, and migrating the PCs to the new domain controller, all programs appear to be working normally as should be expected.

However, the Windows XP workstations take anywhere from 3 to 5 minutes or more to complete the "Loading your personal settings" step of the boot process where they used to take 10-15 seconds or less on the faster machines. The Windows 2000 workstations still boot as fast as they did before the change.

Roaming profiles are not enabled, all users' domain accounts are administrators on their local machines, there are no group policies or restrictions on the server except for what is installed as defaults on the OS. All XP machines are running SP2 and all 2000 machines have SP4.

This is not a workstation issue as far as I can tell since the problem is consistent with all XP machines, and does not happen on any of the 2000 machines. I also don't think it is a physical problem with the server since all benchmarks (CPU, RAM, file system, network, etc.) exceed expected results for the system specs

I have done as much searching as I can stand on Google and Microsoft's TechNet but the few possible resolutions I can find (install SP2, eliminate entries from the login scripts, and check DNS entries for the domain controller on the local DNS server) don't apply since they already have SP2, the only items in the login script are drive mappings (and the login script doesn't even load until long after this step in the boot process is completed, and we don't have a local DNS server.


I'm hoping there is a simple fix for this somewhere since the users have been complaining - and I don't blame them - about the amount of time they have to wait when they restart their computers.

I'd really appreciate any advice or suggestions you can give me to resolve the problem!


Thanks in advance,
Fardringle

 

[crobusa]

Have you checked the Event Log? Are the DNS settings the same?
Can it access network resouces like shares?
It sounds like it might be logging in with cached user information after being unable to connect to the server.

 

[GeekDrew]

Originally posted by: Fardringle
and we don't have a local DNS server.

What are you using for DNS?

 

[Fardringle]

Have you checked the Event Log? Are the DNS settings the same?
Can it access network resouces like shares?
It sounds like it might be logging in with cached user information after being unable to connect to the server.

There isn't anything unusual in the event logs on any of the workstations or on the server that I can see.

All workstations run perfectly (fast, can access all network resources including those restricted by NTFS restrictions on the server, etc) after they finally get to the Windows desktop. They just take far too long to get to that point.

What are you using for DNS?

Except for the few PCs that have static IP addresses assigned, all stations get their IP and DNS information from the firewall/router, which gets that information from the DSL ISP provider. The stations with static IP addresses have the same DNS server information as the ones that are configured automatically by DHCP. The static IPs don't appear to be the problem either, since there are a couple that run Windows XP and a couple that run Windows 2000, and they are consistent with my original post in that the XP machines boot slowly and the 2000 machines boot quickly. There has never been any reason or need for local DNS in the office, so the only DNS information used on the network is for Internet access.

Just out of curiosity and to see if it might be a DNS issue, I put an entry for the server's IP address in the Hosts file of one of the XP machines and it did not make any difference at all in the length of time it took to load Windows on that computer.

 

[nweaver]

in my experience, slow booting (actually, slow logging in, not really to get to the login prompt as much) in XP w/domain is DNS. you SHOULD RUN DNS on your domain controller, so that it's easy to resolve the domain. Your ISP will not resolve your domain controller (most likely). Put DNS on your DC and change the client to point to your DC and see if that fixes it. You should be able to setup dns lookup forwarding, so that it will hit your ISP for stuff outside (such as MSN, google, etc)

 

[doc2345]

Originally posted by: nweaver
in my experience, slow booting (actually, slow logging in, not really to get to the login prompt as much) in XP w/domain is DNS. you SHOULD RUN DNS on your domain controller, so that it's easy to resolve the domain. Your ISP will not resolve your domain controller (most likely). Put DNS on your DC and change the client to point to your DC and see if that fixes it. You should be able to setup dns lookup forwarding, so that it will hit your ISP for stuff outside (such as MSN, google, etc)

nweaver is absolutley correct on this......... :thumbsup:

 

[GeekDrew]

Originally posted by: doc2345

Originally posted by: nweaver
in my experience, slow booting (actually, slow logging in, not really to get to the login prompt as much) in XP w/domain is DNS. you SHOULD RUN DNS on your domain controller, so that it's easy to resolve the domain. Your ISP will not resolve your domain controller (most likely). Put DNS on your DC and change the client to point to your DC and see if that fixes it. You should be able to setup dns lookup forwarding, so that it will hit your ISP for stuff outside (such as MSN, google, etc)

nweaver is absolutley correct on this......... :thumbsup:

I usually don't post just to agree with something... but in this case, I must. DNS is vital, and you DO need to be running it locally.

 

[Fardringle]

Is this a new 'requirement' with Server 2003? (This office is my first experience dealing directly with 2003.) It has never been an issue with any office I have worked with using NT4 and Windows 2000 servers.

I'll try it to see what happens, but if it was a DNS issue, placing an entry for the server in the PC's HOSTS file should have resolved the problem, and it did not have any effect whatsoever...

 

[nweaver]

The PC's may not hit the hosts file, they are sending requests to DNS first, and getting a reply about no such domain. not sure about NT, but 2K requred proper DNS setup. DNS doesn't hAVE to be on the DC, it's just easiest that way.

 

[GeekDrew]

Originally posted by: nweaver
The PC's may not hit the hosts file, they are sending requests to DNS first, and getting a reply about no such domain. not sure about NT, but 2K requred proper DNS setup. DNS doesn't hAVE to be on the DC, it's just easiest that way.

Right... I've got no idea about how 2k could possibly be working properly... perhaps DNS was 'misconfigured', and it is was actually working properly? 😉

I've set up quite a few 2000 networks, and one 2003 network, and in my experience, DNS *must* be served locally in order for it to work properly. IIRC, there is plenty of documentation in the MSKB to back that up.

 

[Rapidskies]

Along with pointing to the DC for DNS have you tried logging in as a different user on a pc (a user that has never logged on to the domain from that pc before)? That would create a new profile and if there was something profile/sid related that would rule it out.

 

[nweaver]

In my experience, 2k (client) is much more forgiving then XP when you have DNS/Domain issues.

 

[ND40oz]

Run DNS on the domain controller if it's your only one. Also, in your router, it should be handing out your DNS Servers, have it hand out the IP address of your domain controller as the 1st DNS server (you need to make your DC a DNS server also, step 1). This will fix your slow logon.

 

[imported_Phil]

Originally posted by: GeekDrew

Originally posted by: doc2345

Originally posted by: nweaver
in my experience, slow booting (actually, slow logging in, not really to get to the login prompt as much) in XP w/domain is DNS. you SHOULD RUN DNS on your domain controller, so that it's easy to resolve the domain. Your ISP will not resolve your domain controller (most likely). Put DNS on your DC and change the client to point to your DC and see if that fixes it. You should be able to setup dns lookup forwarding, so that it will hit your ISP for stuff outside (such as MSN, google, etc)

nweaver is absolutley correct on this......... :thumbsup:

I usually don't post just to agree with something... but in this case, I must. DNS is vital, and you DO need to be running it locally.

Agreed. We had this problem at work, where certain servers could not resolve some server names because the request was being passed to the ISP and that, obviously, wasn't working 😉

Because the network is antiquated, HOSTS lines were added to help, and certain functions were changed to use IP addresses instead of names.

I too suspect that the domain request is being passed to the ISP, which is failing and causing the problems. Thus, the machines are likely relying on their cached DNS information to contact the server.

 

[Fardringle]

I have to admit that I'm surprised at the results since entries in the HOSTS file did not fix the problem, but I went ahead and set the domain controller to point to itself for DNS and I pointed the stations to the server as well and all of the machines seem to be booting normally again. Thanks for the help! 😀


Changing the DNS info on the stations did cause a few small problems with their proprietary software but that's because the software is stupid and I'm going to make the developer fix it. 😉

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: doc2345

Originally posted by: nweaver
in my experience, slow booting (actually, slow logging in, not really to get to the login prompt as much) in XP w/domain is DNS. you SHOULD RUN DNS on your domain controller, so that it's easy to resolve the domain. Your ISP will not resolve your domain controller (most likely). Put DNS on your DC and change the client to point to your DC and see if that fixes it. You should be able to setup dns lookup forwarding, so that it will hit your ISP for stuff outside (such as MSN, google, etc)

nweaver is absolutley correct on this......... :thumbsup:

yup, i had this exact problem recently and it was resolved by redirecting DNS on the workstation.

also, your assumption that it's not at the workstation is wrong, XP and 2000 are very different beasts. 2000 is pretty simple, XP is not, there are a lot of things i find difficult to explain with xp that are very simple with 2000.

if you are not using dns on your domain controller, then there is a strong possibility that local name resolution was handled by WINS or Netbios. server 2003 (and it's variants) and xp are not WINS friendly.