VERY INTERESTING QUOTE!!!! READ THIS!!!!

[swifty3]

?Why of course the people don?t want war. ... That is understood. But after all it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship ...Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.?

Who said that? Hitler?s accomplice, Hermann Goering (Field Marshall of the German Air Force (Luftwaffe) and president of the Reichstag), at the Nuremberg trials of Nazi war criminals in 1946.

 

[DanJ]

Prolly a repost but yes, its a nice quote. Describes our situation to a T.

 

[Morph]

And how fitting it is.

 

[Wheezer]

Originally posted by: swifty3
?Why of course the people don?t want war. ... That is understood. But after all it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship ...Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.?

Who said that? Hitler?s accomplice, Hermann Goering (Field Marshall of the German Air Force (Luftwaffe) and president of the Reichstag), at the Nuremberg trials of Nazi war criminals in 1946.

Ok so whats your point?

 

[DanJ]

Ok so whats your point?

His point was is that the same actions are being done now. Pre-emptive war popularity requires the people to believe Iraq is a threat to us; which is what the administartion tried to convince us of for about 6 months. Plus, anyone that seems to disagree is now called Un-American, Pro-Saddam and Anti-American. Its the same thing.

 

[Wheezer]

Yeah I figured that but I to make sure that was the meaning of the idiot post.

You see there is one big difference....We haven't baked millions of people in ovens in an attempt at genocide.

So again I ask wtf is the point?

 

[DanJ]

Originally posted by: Wheezer
Yeah I figured that but I to make sure that was the meaning of the idiot post.

You see there is one big difference....We haven't baked millions of people in ovens in an attempt at genocide.

So again I ask wtf is the point?

The Nazi regime was able to gain incredible popularity amongst its people using these tactics (convincing their people that someone else is a threat); thats the point. Bush has rallied US support but global support is horrible, correct? That's why it parallels.

How can we win the war on terrorism if a great majority of the world's population hates us? Hatred breeds terrorism, correct?

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: Wheezer
So again I ask wtf is the point?

Bush = Hitler

Same old disgruntled election losers. Nothing to do with Iraq. Nothing to see here. Move along.

 

[Wheezer]

Ok so all the countries that are behind us mean nothing?

gee i am sure they would love to hear that.

And no it wasn't just the fact that the Jews were a threat. They also convinced thier people that they were the "super race" and they wanted to dominate the world.

So tell me how have we shown that?


Sorry to shed light on your misinformation but that hatered was already there for this country.

 

[DanJ]

Originally posted by: Wheezer
Ok so all the countries that are behind us mean nothing?

You must be talking about the coalition of the willing. List them please, its quite an amusing read. Try to cross out the countries that require our support, those that aren't currently at war (yes, Afghanistan is on the list), and those that want future support; oh and for kicks cross out ones you've never heard of before (some of the *Name* Islands come to mind). Or just list those that are actual global leaders or global powers; and double check that willing list for some Arab nations, I mean we are removing a ruthless dictator from their region, they must surely support that? I mean some did in Desert Storm so they must be now!?

And to shed more light on your misinformation (as you put it), we had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

 

[LH]

Hell even Germany is coming on board at this point. Why do people say we dont have international support. We have political and moral support from over 50 countries now, plus a few countries that lent troops but dont "openly support" us.

We have PLENTY of international support. We just dont have the support of the UN. The UN is a farce anyways. Most are anti-american, but with out the US, there is no UN.

 

[swifty3]

Originally posted by: NightTrain

Originally posted by: Wheezer
So again I ask wtf is the point?

Bush = Hitler

Same old disgruntled election losers. Nothing to do with Iraq. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Wow, the simplicity of your thought process just floors me. If that is the only thing you can derive from that quote, then maybe you should try THINKING a bit before you post. Where was Bush mentioned at all? Why would you make a connection between Hitler and Bush? What the HELL does that quote have to do with elections being won or lost?

 

[Wheezer]

We had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

people wanna talk the talk...but they have no balls.

That is the truth. Of course we had support, as long as we had to take no action.

They are like the conscientious objector, it all sounds good until you have to either put out or get out and for many of these so called friends it was easier to get out.

 

[LH]

Well Germany said yesterday that Saddam needs removed. Jumping on the bandwagon? Maybe? Outright support? Maybe not, but we do have plenty of support. The four major economic powers = USA, UK, Japan, Germany. We have all them in our corner now, more or less. The four major military power, USA, China, UK, Russia.

You really cant play that card about the size of countries backing us. Look at the UN SC, the majority currently on it ARE third world countries.

 

[swifty3]

Originally posted by: Wheezer

We had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

people wanna talk the talk...but they have no balls.

That is the truth. Of course we had support, as long as we had to take no action.

They are like the conscientious objector, it all sounds good until you have to either put out or get out and for many of these so called friends it was easier to get out.

Or quite possibly its just not as simple as "your with us or againt us". Perhaps not everyone was convinced of the legitimacy of a pre-emptive strike on a soveriegn nation. Perhaps some people feel that war is a last resort, and a sign of failure of all other avenues and solutions. War is hell, and anyone who doesn't realize this is ignorant.

 

[Wheezer]

Originally posted by: swifty3

Originally posted by: Wheezer

We had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

people wanna talk the talk...but they have no balls.

That is the truth. Of course we had support, as long as we had to take no action.

They are like the conscientious objector, it all sounds good until you have to either put out or get out and for many of these so called friends it was easier to get out.

Or quite possibly its just not as simple as "your with us or againt us". Perhaps not everyone was convinced of the legitimacy of a pre-emptive strike on a soveriegn nation. Perhaps some people feel that war is a last resort, and a sign of failure of all other avenues and solutions. War is hell, and anyone who doesn't realize this is ignorant.

I do realize that war is hell.

I also realize that sometimes war is a nesscery evil.

So tell me how much time should they have had?

We gave Saddam 12 YEARS to comply. He did not. So explain to me how this is pre-emptive.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: swifty3

Originally posted by: NightTrain

Originally posted by: Wheezer
So again I ask wtf is the point?

Bush = Hitler

Same old disgruntled election losers. Nothing to do with Iraq. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Wow, the simplicity of your thought process just floors me. If that is the only thing you can derive from that quote, then maybe you should try THINKING a bit before you post. Where was Bush mentioned at all? Why would you make a connection between Hitler and Bush?

So what was your point again?

 

[B00ne]

Originally posted by: Wheezer

We had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

people wanna talk the talk...but they have no balls.

That is the truth. Of course we had support, as long as we had to take no action.

They are like the conscientious objector, it all sounds good until you have to either put out or get out and for many of these so called friends it was easier to get out.

BS - Afganisthan was no action or what? You had support as long Bush didnt act up as the "Führer" and regards anyone that doesnt agree totally as enemy - great way to have friends. Bush started this mess and alienated everyone until Iraq wasnt the real issue anymore but US behavior...

 

[lowtech1]

Originally posted by: Wheezer

We had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

people wanna talk the talk...but they have no balls.

That is the truth. Of course we had support, as long as we had to take no action.

They are like the conscientious objector, it all sounds good until you have to either put out or get out and for many of these so called friends it was easier to get out.

Please try and ask your parents or elderly that were in Vietnam during the war & see that they has to say regarding War, enemies & American.

"There is no true enemy in war, there is only pain, lost & sacrifice"

 

[swifty3]

Originally posted by: Wheezer

Originally posted by: swifty3

Originally posted by: Wheezer

We had tremendous support after 9-11, amongst countries AND their people. Where has that gone?

people wanna talk the talk...but they have no balls.

That is the truth. Of course we had support, as long as we had to take no action.

They are like the conscientious objector, it all sounds good until you have to either put out or get out and for many of these so called friends it was easier to get out.

Or quite possibly its just not as simple as "your with us or againt us". Perhaps not everyone was convinced of the legitimacy of a pre-emptive strike on a soveriegn nation. Perhaps some people feel that war is a last resort, and a sign of failure of all other avenues and solutions. War is hell, and anyone who doesn't realize this is ignorant.

I do realize that war is hell.

I also realize that sometimes war is a nesscery evil.

So tell me how much time should they have had?

We gave Saddam 12 YEARS to comply. He did not. So explain to me how this is pre-emptive.

It's pre-emptive because Iraq did nothing to incur an invasion by a foriegn country, like they did by invading Kuwait in 91'. And Saddam did not have a deadline of 12 years, the world just chose not to assume that Saddam is all of a sudden an imminent threat. And besides, your totally getting off the topic of this thread!

In my mind, the original quote had to do with leadership in any type of government, and the vercity of the rhetoric that they use to persuade people to see things the way they do, and to support the actions of the policy makers. It is an interesting quote, because it is coming from a man on trial for his life, who was a co-conspirator with the propaganda masters of all time. At least that is what I got out of it. By posting it I thought it might cause people to take a step back, and THINK for a moment.

But maybe for you, there is no point.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: swifty3

In my mind, the original quote had to do with leadership in any type of government, and the vercity of the rhetoric that they use to persuade people to see things the way they do, and to support the actions of the policy makers.

So are you saying it applies to the current situation or not?

 

[swifty3]

Originally posted by: NightTrain

Originally posted by: swifty3

Originally posted by: NightTrain

Originally posted by: Wheezer
So again I ask wtf is the point?

Bush = Hitler

Same old disgruntled election losers. Nothing to do with Iraq. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Wow, the simplicity of your thought process just floors me. If that is the only thing you can derive from that quote, then maybe you should try THINKING a bit before you post. Where was Bush mentioned at all? Why would you make a connection between Hitler and Bush?

So what was your point again?

The is no point. No thought or idea can penetrate the solidified mass that is your brain. No point at all, so go back to your cave.

 

[LH]

We dont consider everyone against us as enemies. We do consider those that are against US and a threat to US as enemies. That list includes Iran and NK. They are both threats, they have both made threats. We dont consider, France, Russia, China enemies.

 

[Morph]

Originally posted by: LH
Well Germany said yesterday that Saddam needs removed. Jumping on the bandwagon? Maybe? Outright support? Maybe not, but we do have plenty of support. The four major economic powers = USA, UK, Japan, Germany. We have all them in our corner now, more or less. The four major military power, USA, China, UK, Russia.

You don't know what you're talking about. We do not have Russia's backing in this, nor China. The German government may be trying to hedge their bets now, but the German people are still overwhelmingly opposed to this war.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: swifty3

Originally posted by: NightTrain

Originally posted by: swifty3

Originally posted by: NightTrain

Originally posted by: Wheezer
So again I ask wtf is the point?

Bush = Hitler

Same old disgruntled election losers. Nothing to do with Iraq. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Wow, the simplicity of your thought process just floors me. If that is the only thing you can derive from that quote, then maybe you should try THINKING a bit before you post. Where was Bush mentioned at all? Why would you make a connection between Hitler and Bush?

So what was your point again?

The is no point. No thought or idea can penetrate the solidified mass that is your brain. No point at all, so go back to your cave.

You insinuate that Bush, like Hitler, has duped the masses. Look at the reponses.

"Describes our situation to a T."
"And how fitting it is."
"His point was is that the same actions are being done now."
"The Nazi regime was able to gain incredible popularity amongst its people using these tactics (convincing their people that someone else is a threat); thats the point. Bush has rallied US support but global support is horrible, correct? That's why it parallels."
"You had support as long Bush didnt act up as the Führer"

Dress it up all you want...but Bush=Hitler is the end result.