Verge: HTC in 'disarray', staff departures, 'disastrous' First, & production problems

[ChronoReverse]

Meanwhile the One's Sense seems "cool." The accordion trick it does on lists is very eye catching.

I've always thought that Sense since version 4.1 was way nicer than Touchwiz. I never understood the claims Touchwiz was more "untouched" or "closer to stock" when it hasn't been the case since ICS came out.

It's as if old truisms were just being parroted without examining the significant changes since then.

 

[Apex]

i think this qa with jennifer lopez is funny on multiple levels...

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-12261_...-lopez-dishes-on-new-viva-movil-shopping-q-a/

i got a lot of comments disappointed this wasn't the htc one announcement.
lopez: What does that mean? Htc one? I'm so sorry.

it's a phone. So, are you going to be selling the htc one?
walden: I'll tell you if we know (laughs).

lol. :d

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

I've always thought that Sense since version 4.1 was way nicer than Touchwiz. I never understood the claims Touchwiz was more "untouched" or "closer to stock" when it hasn't been the case since ICS came out.

It's as if old truisms were just being parroted without examining the significant changes since then.

happens a lot on these boards. im probably guilty of it too sometimes.

 

[Dari]

I think Facebook basically sabotaged their own phone by releasing the Android app at the exactly the same time as release.

At the expense of HTC. Facebook doesn't care because, so long as people use Facebook Home, they're golden. It was HTC that was on the hook and it was HTC that got screwed...

 

[Accord99]

At the expense of HTC. Facebook doesn't care because, so long as people use Facebook Home, they're golden. It was HTC that was on the hook and it was HTC that got screwed...

It depends, it's very possible though that Facebook is contractually obligated to purchase a minimum number of phones, in exchange for HTC building a phone for them and that Facebook ends up eating the loss.

 

[Crono]

I don't see how anyone could possibly say that. Without even getting into the stuff that can be based on opinion and debated, the S4 has: better CPU, better camera, better screen, better battery life, removable battery, and MicroSD support. This is all stuff nobody can even debate. The One has.... aluminum? Sense? The One's current camera is worse than the GS3's camera which is ridiculous for a phone that was hyped to have a state of the art camera.

This is the problem HTC has. Not enough people research the differences. Talking to some friends, most of them just looked at the paper specs or bought into the features touted by the (patronizing) S4 commercials.

- I have yet to see a single reviewer say that the 0.2 GHz advantage the S4 has makes a noticeable difference in anything but benchmarks. Unless recent S4 updates have changed things dramatically, what I have seen is that the S4 can have some lag while the HTC One effectively has none.
- The S4's camera is better in daylight, but the HTC One is dramatically better in low light, only bested by the Nokia Lumia 920 (both phones with OIS). I've looked at a bunch of comparison shots from various sites, and the majority of them seem to indicate the same. My own shots with the One have been pretty good, though I'm not really a photographer.
- The HTC One has a better screen. Even if the S4 is bigger by 0.3 inches, it's not a better display.
- Battery life is about the same. I've seen too many varying methodologies as far as battery life testing goes, but I'll just say they are close enough.
- I will give you removable battery and microSD which are important to some. I doubt it's the majority of Android users, and even Google is pushing in the other direction.
- The HTC One has 32GB onboard storage vs 16GB for the base model. Nearly half of that is taken up on the S4 by default, 2GB of which is just Samsung bloatware. They might give you a microSD slot because they know their software isn't going to leave you much room. The S4 is a more expensive phone if you are going to match the HTC One on storage. Off contract (or even on-contract in some cases) the S4 may already be a more expensive phone.
- The front facing speakers on the One are very good and have the loudest volume of any of the current smartphones


All of that isn't even mentioning the aluminum body, which some people think is the only selling point of the One. It clearly isn't, though I do like the aluminum body and styling which makes it simply look better and it feels better to hold.

I don't see how anyone could possibly say that.

I can see how the S4 might be a better fit for some people, especially if you absolutely need batteries (though there are power cases like Mophie for the One if you did need more capacity) or a microSD slot, but those are individual needs/preferences. Both phones take different approaches. I'm not saying that the One is definitively the best phone no matter what, but the One is easily as good a phone overall as the S4, and depending on your needs it might be a better phone than the S4. It is for me.

 

[ChronoReverse]

I wouldn't say the screen is definitively better either way.

If they had scaled up the One X screen to 1080p then I would have agreed it's a better screen but the One screen is a step back in a number of ways.

 

[Dari]

It depends, it's very possible though that Facebook is contractually obligated to purchase a minimum number of phones, in exchange for HTC building a phone for them and that Facebook ends up eating the loss.

Maybe they did. Maybe not. Either way Facebook allegedly reneged on waiting months to allow non-First phones to have Facebook Home. That was the death knell for First...

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

I don't see how anyone could possibly say that. Without even getting into the stuff that can be based on opinion and debated, the S4 has: better CPU, better camera, better screen, better battery life, removable battery, and MicroSD support. This is all stuff nobody can even debate. The One has.... aluminum? Sense? The One's current camera is worse than the GS3's camera which is ridiculous for a phone that was hyped to have a state of the art camera.

better CPU? same CPU, just clocked slightly higher and doesn't translate to better performance. In fact, the S4 lags more than the One.

better camera? in bright light it's slightly better. night shots are far worse. if you don't blow up your pictures, One is better for most.

better screen? debatable. most reviewers prefer the natural, accurate colors of the One over the oversaturated AMOLED. LCD is also brighter in direct sunlight so I'd say the One actually has the edge

better battery life? most have said they're pretty much equal.

removable batt and microSD. no argument there. S4 wins.

you're right, these are things that nobody can debate. the One wins in most of the categories.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

It does. And the few little parts of Halo that are still there (like the color stripe on the notification shade) look way out of place.

Meanwhile the One's Sense seems "cool." The accordion trick it does on lists is very eye catching.

coming from AOSP, i hate the accordion animation.

 

[Apex]

The issue I have with LCD is when I'm in bright sunlight, I'm normally using sunglasses (run-of-the-mill polarized sunglasses). I'm not sure if the One's LCD is still like this, but my One V was really hard to see in one direction.

Here's what they look like in portrait, with the HTC One V (with LCD screen) on the left, and the Samsung Galaxy S4 (with AMOLED) on the right, with both of them set to relatively equal, high brightness. While it's not a great photograph (sorry, hard to hold sunglasses in front of camera lens), you can tell both are easily readable:

Here's what they look like in landscape:

The fact that the LCD screen has a directional polarizer means it can only be viewed from 1 orientation.

Anyone know if there is an extinction angle on the HTC One, or merely a smaller color shift?

This might better show what happens with the One V (it happens to the iPad):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78GdcXCM9nk

 

[Crono]

Nvm, misread your post

 

[Brian Stirling]

The One will probably keep HTC afloat for the next year but they don't have the clout that Samsung and particularly Apple has so they seem doomed to make what the carriers, not customers, want. I have and love the One but wish it had a bigger battery and a uSD slot. HTC is making a version for China that has a uSD slot so there's no reason they couldn't have offered one in the US versions except, perhaps, the carriers would prefer the phone didn't have one.


Brian

 

[Phokus]

The One will probably keep HTC afloat for the next year but they don't have the clout that Samsung and particularly Apple has so they seem doomed to make what the carriers, not customers, want. I have and love the One but wish it had a bigger battery and a uSD slot. HTC is making a version for China that has a uSD slot so there's no reason they couldn't have offered one in the US versions except, perhaps, the carriers would prefer the phone didn't have one.


Brian

Why would the carriers care whether a phone has a microsd slot or not

 

[Crono]

Why would the carriers care whether a phone has a microsd slot or not

They are responsible for returns and support.

No microSDs = one less thing to get messed up on a phone. Especially for the average consumer who might be confused by installing to microSD or where to store files, aside from the hardware itself possibly being damaged from swapping or installation of cards.

Not saying that's a problem for power or even more casual users of Android, but when you are talking about supporting millions of smartphones you can see why carriers might not like microSD especially when relatively few users (just look at the number of iPhones out there) who aren't really demanding them.

 

[GTRagnarok]

I imagine they would want people to use the Cloud more too. More usage = more data requirements = higher bills.

 

[wirednuts]

*snip*
This might better show what happens with the One V (it happens to the iPad):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78GdcXCM9nk

i have the one v too, and its a budget phone. the lcd on my sensation is WAY better

 

[Crono]

I imagine they would want people to use the Cloud more too. More usage = more data requirements = higher bills.

True. Google itself has more to gain from this I would think (Google Plus, Google Drive, Google Play Music, etc), but carriers certainly don't mind the users who are upgrading to bigger and more expensive data plans.

Right now I'm happy so long as I have 32GB or more storage on my phone. Most of the large files I have are transient - I delete or offload any of the big files, which is mostly video. I manage playlists on my desktop, anyway, so I just keep the music I'm currently listening to on my phone. Some people love to have their entire music or video collections numbering thousands or tens of thousands of files on every device they own. I don't stockpile anything that I can't afford to lose, so I've never really needed a ton of storage on desktops, laptops, backups, mobile devices, etc but that's just me.

 

[ChronoReverse]

No microSDs = one less thing to get messed up on a phone. Especially for the average consumer who might be confused by installing to microSD or where to store files, aside from the hardware itself possibly being damaged from swapping or installation of cards.

We give too little credit to the average user.

Phones for years before the iPhone had removeable storage. My LG had microSD while my brother's Sony had memory stick.

People can usually figure these things out UNLESS the phone (OS) maker actively makes it difficult.

 

[Bateluer]

People can usually figure these things out UNLESS the phone (OS) maker actively makes it difficult.

^ This. Carriers are extremely guilty of this too.

 

[Crono]

We give too little credit to the average user.

Phones for years before the iPhone had removeable storage. My LG had microSD while my brother's Sony had memory stick.

People can usually figure these things out UNLESS the phone (OS) maker actively makes it difficult.

Unless you know how many calls/tickets/replacements the carriers had to deal with it's hard to judge whether the carriers benefit from preferring not to have microSD slots in phones.

I remember Anand or maybe Brian Klug saying in one of the AnandTech podcasts that many users didn't even realize some of the phones back then came with microSD cards and would throw them out alongside the boxes or just forget to install them. I wouldn't give credit to the "average" user when looking at it from the business side of maximizing profit and minimizing loss, because eve if most users can figure our how to install and manage microSDs properly, there is a financially significant number of non-tech savvy buyers who will complain or demand a replacement if/when they can't figure things out or unintentionally damage their phone.

Even if it's 1% of users, that's a hell of a lot of people when you start looking at hundreds of thousands or millions of purchases and contracts.
I'm not saying whether it's a good decision, just explaining one possible reason the carriers don't want to support microSD.

 

[Apex]

i have the one v too, and its a budget phone. the lcd on my sensation is WAY better

I agree. However, continuing the discussion above about the relative merits of the LCD and AMOLED screens, one of the big disadvantages I've noticed is the inability to use them in sunlight with polarized sunglasses in more than 1 orientation. Does the Sensation not have this limitation?

 

[ChronoReverse]

Unless you know how many calls/tickets/replacements the carriers had to deal with it's hard to judge whether the carriers benefit from preferring not to have microSD slots in phones.

As opposed to service calls of users complaining "why did I run out of space already"? (I have no numbers too of course so I wouldn't bother making this claim)

Seriously, it's the epitome of being one sided here in the crusade against something that can only benefit the user. Don't we normally expect that these things should err in our benefit? When did we fall into making excuses for the carriers?



The right answer should be 32GB standard AND removeable storage. They don't have to even come with the microSD if we're actually going to use the ridiculously flimsy excuse that people left them in the box.

Samsung didn't get it completely right because of the 16GB standard model but I'm glad they released the GS4 because proved all the excuses about "larger batteries and screen" or "smaller and lighter" absolutely wrong.

 

[wirednuts]

I agree. However, continuing the discussion above about the relative merits of the LCD and AMOLED screens, one of the big disadvantages I've noticed is the inability to use them in sunlight with polarized sunglasses in more than 1 orientation. Does the Sensation not have this limitation?

oh sorry, i get what you mean now. i would imagine it does, because most (all?) lcd's have polarizers (as you were saying).

i definitely like OLED better, but thats more to do with the technology itself rather then the fact its actually better

 

[ChronoReverse]

oh sorry, i get what you mean now. i would imagine it does, because most (all?) lcd's have polarizers (as you were saying).

i definitely like OLED better, but thats more to do with the technology itself rather then the fact its actually better

In fact, LCD working mechanism is polarization. It would take some very clever engineering to remove this effect.