Venting a bathroom fan

NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
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Bathroom renovation is coming to a close and this week I installed a bathroom vent fan in the original ceiling hole where original fan was. I still need to run the duct pipe but am running into some questions.

Bathroom is on the second floor and I can run a duct pretty easily since I have attic access. The attic has attic windows on the gable ends of the house, the one nearest to the bathroom (where the previous fan was ducted to) had the window removed, a big plywood board installed where the window previously sat with a gable vent also installed in this plywood. The previous owner just aimed a flexible metal duct as far into the gable vent as possible and hoped the fan had enough power to push the exhaust outside. Of course, ignoring that the gas being expelled would just be sucked back into the attic via the gable vent...

So I'd like to drill a hole into the plywood board under and to the side of the gable vent (try to keep it from re-entering the attic). Gable vent is installed more or less in the center of previous window opening and the bathroom vent would go in the lowest corner. The problem is that I need to screw/nail the outdoor hood vent cap (one of those with a flapper and animal screen you can buy anywhere) from the outside. The problem is that this side of the house is more or less on the fourth floor up. Exposed basement wall, 2 floors and then attic. The idea of getting all the way up to the other side of this plywood/gable vent is pretty undesirable. I don't even own a ladder that tall.

Anything I can do to install this vent from the inside that doesn't require me to do it from the outside?

The only thing I can think of is from the attic, to remove the plywood board from the window framing, install the vent hood on the outside side of it and then reinstall the plywood.

But at that point, I might as well do the job correctly and seal the opening properly. When the window was removed, the plywood to seal up the opening should have had some house wrap and then siding. Pretty sure the only barrier between th attic and outside is plywood. At the very least, the previous owner did paint it. I also have soffit and ridge vents so Im thinking I dont need this extra gable vent; this is probably messing with normal roof venting. Im kinda loath to mess with this; go to install a fan duct and it also turns into a gable vent removal lol.

Second issue, how do you secure/hang the pipe when it needs to run above the ceiling joists? If I had to suspend the pipe under the joists, there are plenty of hangers I could use. But running above the joists of the second floor ceiling in the attic, that's upside down from typical. I need to run the duct horizontally to reach the gable end of the house about a foot above the joists. If I had to, I have enough scrap wood to build up a platform every 2 feet or so. Is there something a little quicker or even a little elegant? If its expensive, then I'll chop up a few 2x4s and screw them all together to the desired height to get the job done.

I can supply pics if needed...
 

paperfist

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
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Just curious, how far is the duct run?

I don't know about that height, but I had a guy come out for $150 and run a vent right above where I needed it for a 2nd floor bathroom.

The alternative sounded a lot like yours. Run the 6" duct vent through the top of the rafters, snake around some bends and out the side wall where I'd have to act like a monkey and figure out how to attach the vent to the side wall.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
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I put a vent in last summer. If I recall correctly, the outside "snapped" into place against the inside parts, in addition to being screwed to the house. So, perhaps you could tie a rope to a thin 12" or so long board, drop the board out through the hole you drill, feed the board through the cap, run the other end through the 12" or 18" piece of vent pipe that attaches, then pull the cap up to the hole, position it with your hand, and push the vent pipe onto the cap while keeping the cap pulled tight to the wall.

Then, position some lumber, attached to your floor joists or floor, that supports the vent, and put a screw or two into it to keep it in place, pulled tight to the wall.

Maybe that would work.


But, why not just go up on a ladder and do it right?
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
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Hey, speaking of vent fans in bathrooms, the one I installed last summer trips the GFCI if it's running while someone's taking a hot shower.

Are more expensive or certain brand vent fans less likely to have nuisance trips?
 

skyking

Lifer
Nov 21, 2001
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how much eave on the gable end? If the eave is not subject to direct rain due to eave protection, you could cut a hole and screen it for bugs, and use an inside flange piece to hang the hose on.
If you want the flappers on it like a dryer vent, Carefully cut out a rectangle big enough for the flange of the flapper assembly, first putting a screw in it and wire so it does not fall when you make the last cut.
Take it downstairs and cut the hole in it and mount the flapper.
put strips of plywood all around the backside to re-fasten it to the plywood above. Paint the edges of plywood if you wish, both in the fixed wood upstairs and the edge of this adapter you are making.
Put a generous bead of caulk along the edge of plywood, on the face of those strips, and put it back in the hole. Fasten with short screws so they don't shine through.
Hang the hose on it.
Profit!
 

TheGardener

Golden Member
Jul 19, 2014
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Had new shingles put in a couple years back. Contractor mentioned that the bathroom fan (second floor) was vented to the crawl space. Bathroom has no windows. Didn't cost much to have him vent it through the roof.

What a difference it made!
 

skyking

Lifer
Nov 21, 2001
22,790
5,949
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Had new shingles put in a couple years back. Contractor mentioned that the bathroom fan (second floor) was vented to the crawl space. Bathroom has no windows. Didn't cost much to have him vent it through the roof.

What a difference it made!

contractor was on the ball :thumbsup:
 

NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
5,847
154
106
Here is a link to pics. Album

First pic shows the former gable window in the attic from the outside. Window was removed and a gable vent added. I hope to vent through this plywood so as to avoid drilling through the siding of the house.

Next pics show from inside of attic, above second floor. The new bathroom fan can be seen and its a pretty straight shot over to the gable vent. You can see a tan square in the lower lefthand corner of the gable vent. Thatts where the flex hose from the old fan was attached. Stapled right to the screen; thats years of lint/dust accumulation blown against the animal screen.

I also wont be removing the gable vent anytime soon, there is a birds nest in the louvers with birds. Kinda amusing to quietly look at them from the attic and they have no clue. I'll get rid of the gable possibly after the fall when the vacate.
 
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NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
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Just curious, how far is the duct run?

Its about 2 feet higher than the fan and 4 foot across the joists to get to the wall.

I figured I was going to make a long sweeping elbow immediately out of the fan box with a flexible aluminum duct. Recommended to me to use flexible duct coming out of the fan to isolate any fan vibrations so they dont resonate and shake the rigid ducting.

So angle the run straight up for 2 or so feet and then 90 degree elbow to a horizontal run. Pitch the pipe 1/4 inch per foot downwards so any condensation that forms in the duct can run downhill and out towards the exit. Uninsulated attic with cold winters.

Since its only a 4 foot horizontal run, I was going to support the 90 degree elbow at the beginning of the run with one of these: Hanger But put the support feet facing the ceiling joists. Build a makeshift platform out of some scrap wood to get the necessary height.

At the gable end, I was going to hang another one of those support from a side beam connector Side Beam Connector screwed into an attic wall stud with some 3/8 inch threaded rod cut to lenght.

Question:

Is insulating the duct overkill or is it even necessary? For purposes of keeping the duct warm so exhaust gases dont cool down and condense in the cold attic. I understand the physics of why this would happen and will pitch the pipe anyway towards the exit in case. But is insulation needed? If so, it would be only a few feet and wont break the bank...
 
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NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
5,847
154
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But, why not just go up on a ladder and do it right?


The back side of the house in the posted pics has an exposed basement wall. So its really 4 stories of height from that side of the house. Basement, 2 floors and then attic.

I dont have a ladder that tall anyway and heights give me the chills. So the work has to be done from inside the attic
 

NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
5,847
154
106
how much eave on the gable end? If the eave is not subject to direct rain due to eave protection, you could cut a hole and screen it for bugs, and use an inside flange piece to hang the hose on.
If you want the flappers on it like a dryer vent, Carefully cut out a rectangle big enough for the flange of the flapper assembly, first putting a screw in it and wire so it does not fall when you make the last cut.
Take it downstairs and cut the hole in it and mount the flapper.
put strips of plywood all around the backside to re-fasten it to the plywood above. Paint the edges of plywood if you wish, both in the fixed wood upstairs and the edge of this adapter you are making.
Put a generous bead of caulk along the edge of plywood, on the face of those strips, and put it back in the hole. Fasten with short screws so they don't shine through.
Hang the hose on it.
Profit!

Sounds like a plan. I like that instead of needing to remove the entire installed board. Drill a pilot hole and using a saw-zall cut a rectangle bigger than the hood vent to be installed. Mount the outside hood and screen into the cut out square. Then reinstall, seal with caulk and use some scrap wood to hold the square into place to the larger board.
 

paperfist

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
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www.the-teh.com
I personally wouldn't use aluminum flexible duct work.

The coarse insides tend to grab onto dust and that builds up over time. Plus the stuff is super easy to dent and crease up.

What about actual HVAC flex ducts? They are already insulated too. I had to use that for my downstairs bathroom as there wasn't enough space to run tin duct work.
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
8,173
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Had new shingles put in a couple years back. Contractor mentioned that the bathroom fan (second floor) was vented to the crawl space. Bathroom has no windows. Didn't cost much to have him vent it through the roof.

What a difference it made!

Crawl space? You mean the attic?

What difference did it make?

I have a very hard time believing there's much difference between venting a bathroom fan into an attic and venting it the whole way outside.
 

NetWareHead

THAT guy
Aug 10, 2002
5,847
154
106
I personally wouldn't use aluminum flexible duct work.

The coarse insides tend to grab onto dust and that builds up over time. Plus the stuff is super easy to dent and crease up.

What about actual HVAC flex ducts? They are already insulated too. I had to use that for my downstairs bathroom as there wasn't enough space to run tin duct work.

Do you mean somethng like this?: http://www.homedepot.com/p/6-in-x-2...le-Duct-R6-Silver-Jacket-F6IFD6X300/100396935

I kinda wanted to stay away from flexible duct for the reasons you stated: it grabs dust and also is harder for the fan to push through.

My fan says not to install an elbow at the exit point on the box. Presumably for reasons that hard angles make it harder for the fan to push. But I have no choice, need to change 90 degrees towards the exit. So instead of a hard elbox, I'd take a run of flexible ducting and use that to make the most obtuse angle possible towards the exit. I'd also get sound isolation from the rest of the ducting by using a short run of flexible ducting. Then change over to rigid ducting for the rest of the run
 

paperfist

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
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www.the-teh.com
Do you mean somethng like this?: http://www.homedepot.com/p/6-in-x-2...le-Duct-R6-Silver-Jacket-F6IFD6X300/100396935

I kinda wanted to stay away from flexible duct for the reasons you stated: it grabs dust and also is harder for the fan to push through.

My fan says not to install an elbow at the exit point on the box. Presumably for reasons that hard angles make it harder for the fan to push. But I have no choice, need to change 90 degrees towards the exit. So instead of a hard elbox, I'd take a run of flexible ducting and use that to make the most obtuse angle possible towards the exit. I'd also get sound isolation from the rest of the ducting by using a short run of flexible ducting. Then change over to rigid ducting for the rest of the run

Yes sir!

The flex duct you linked to has a smooth interior wall. My bro-in-law is a HVAC guy and says the only real problem with them is they loose velocity the longer the run is.

Yeah a 90 right out of the box is going to kill air flow. With a flex duct like you say you can vary the angle.

You can also use that SDR drain pipe (green in color) for the rigid part of the run.
 

NutBucket

Lifer
Aug 30, 2000
27,154
635
126
Crawl space? You mean the attic?

What difference did it make?

I have a very hard time believing there's much difference between venting a bathroom fan into an attic and venting it the whole way outside.
No, but it's a bad idea to vent into the attic as the humid air can cause mold to form.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
22,297
6,463
136
Crawl space? You mean the attic?

What difference did it make?

I have a very hard time believing there's much difference between venting a bathroom fan into an attic and venting it the whole way outside.

Warm moist air in the attic promotes mold and fungus growth, you don't want that in your attic.
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
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Have a 2nd floor bathroom with no vent, just a window. Wonder how much to have a fan installed?