Using 2nd wireless router as AP questions

[Patroclus]

I'm helping my friend to set up a 2nd wireless router as AP to extend wireless coverage. I've read and concluded that there is real benefit of buying a dedicated AP, so I will just buy another wireless router to be used as AP instead. However there are couple of confusions even after reading many pages.

1. Some guides mention about disabling DHCP, NAT & firewall in the slave router (when used as AP), while other guides only mention about disabling DHCP. How does this NAT & firewall setting in the slave router affect its functionality as AP ? What happens if the slave router doesnt have these settings / can not be disabled thru the setup page ?

2. All guides mention about the requirements of using the same SSID, same encryption & password to the master wifi router. I can not understand why this is necessary if the slave router is actually connected to the master router with CAT5 cable, and not thru wifi (like expander, extender, or repeater). Why do they have to be the same SSID, encryption & password ? Doesn't this slave router simply create another hotspot independent of the first master router, which means it does not have to be the same as the master router wifi settings.

3. Does a dedicated AP simply extend the wifi coverage/hotspot of the first wifi router, or does it actually create another hotspot ?
If extending the main router's wifi hotspot, will all my wifi devices like Smartphones, laptop, etc support auto-switching to the strongest wifi signal ?
If it does create another hotspot, does it mean I can set up a different SSID, encryption mode & password on the AP

4. If I use another wifi router as a switch/slave wifi router/AP, is this what you call "bridge mode" ?

Please enlighten me. Thank you.

 

[Fardringle]

1. When using a router as an access point, you need to disable DHCP on the 'slave' router and connect one of the slave's LAN ports to one of the LAN ports on the master router. That effectively disables the NAT/Firewall since you aren't using the WAN port on the access point router at all.

2. You don't HAVE to use the same SSID and password on the main router and access point, but it simplifies things if you do since your wireless devices will automatically connect to the strongest signal instead of you having to manually select which one you want to use.

3. An access point extends the wifi coverate of the main router BY acting as a second hotspot for the network.
Some devices will automatically switch between signals when the signal gets too weak and a stronger signal comes into range (known as roaming), some will not. It depends on the equipment.
You can definitely set up a different SSID and password on the access point if you want to.

4. Bridge Mode generally refers to the ISP modem/router. Putting it into bridge mode disables the firewall functions and makes it act just as a modem and then you connect your own router. Using a router as a simple access point has a similar effect because you are disabling or not using the routing functions of the device.

 

[JackMDS]

If there is a way to to use a wire and configure a Wireless Router as a an Access Point (AP) it is far superior than solution than an Extender/Repeater.

Extender/Repeater inherently always results in getting less than 50% of the Bandwidth (Speed) as oppose to wire connected AP.

Q1 - Using Wireless Routers (or Modem/Wireless Router) as a Switch with an Access Point - http://www.ezlan.net/router_AP.html

Q2 - SSID can be same or different. PW- can be same or different the decision of the right combination is a practical usuage decision and Not a technological one.

A person should understand the simple difference and sepd the few minutes to learn how to configure the different iteration.

Otherwise, putting same SSID and PW is the most comfortable thing to do and the right solution for most users.

Q3. Auto switching to the strongest Signal (AKA roaming) is rarely achieved by sub $250 Wireless.

Entry Level Wireless would switch to a Strongest signal only if the current used signal is Not functional. If current signal is 50% and there is another connectable signal thta is 90% the Wireless client would not switch from the 50 to the 90.

AP in Bridge mode means an AP that act as a Driversless Wireless card.

I.e., it connects to a Wireless source that is is strong enough to connect to, and provide an Output via wire to other Network capable Ethernet devices.

In general - http://www.ezlan.net/Wireless_Modes.html

 

[Patroclus]

ic ic. Thanks to both of you. I think I have a clearer understanding now. I still might have some questions if I dig in deeper but I need to review all these basic understandings one more time to make sure I won't get lost again later.
I'll ask here again if I need to.

 

[Patroclus]

ok. I have another question about repeater mode.
I have found many explanations do not address this question:
Can I connect a wired device to the LAN port of a router configured as a repeater (for WAN & LAN connection) ?

And here comes another confusion. Many people seem to use the term "repeater" & "repeater bridge" interchangably. As I understand, a repeater bridge can actually act as a repeater & a bridge at the same time, so it supports a wired connection to it for WAN & LAN. Does this mean a repeater (only) does not support wired connection?

And according to this page : http://www.flashrouters.com/blog/20...ent-bridge-wireless-repeater-modes-in-dd-wrt/

A repeater : Computers connected to one router cannot see computers connected to other routers in Windows Network.
A repeater bridge : All computers can see one another in Windows Network.

Here comes the question : Some routers have a repeater mode build into the firmware, so how do we know which one they're talking about ?

Apparently my DLink DIR-600L, when used in repeater mode, can browse my other computer shared drive & folders wirelessly, so I assume this is repeater-bridge mode.
Now I'm curious whether it also works if I connect the laptop to its LAN port. I will test when I have time

 

[Fardringle]

Repeaters and bridges connect to the existing wireless signal and re-broadcast it to extend the range, but they cut the available bandwidth in half when doing it. A repeater only does wireless. A bridge will connect to the existing wireless network and have wired devices attached to it.

What you want is an access point that connects to the existing WIRED network and broadcasts a wireless signal out to increase the coverage of the existing wireless network.

And yes, you can connect wired devices to the LAN ports to connect them to the network as well when you use a router as an access point.

 

[JackMDS]

You are right there is a lot of useless verbiage in dealing with these things and little Technological Accuracy.

Parts of the http://www.flashrouters.com/ page is a mistaken BS.

One of the reasons for it is lack of standard.

There is some accuracy in the description of WIFI conforming Wireless devices. However Repeater/Extender and some Bridges Modes are not part of the WIFI certification standard and many writers blubbers according their limited knowledge, and or, marketing needs (in case of vendors/manufacturers.

Example: Fardringle in his first post describes what bridge means in case of a Modem/Wireless Router. I described a bridge concerningstand alone Wireless Router. Both of our descriptions are correct and use the word Bridge, but it a different type of Network configurations that do not relate directly one to the other and yet it is described with the same terms.

At moment it seems that you already have the basic understanding of the issue. So ask yourself what do you need for your specific network, otherwise you will keep "fishing in a pond without fish".

 

[Imp]

1. When using a router as an access point, you need to disable DHCP on the 'slave' router and connect one of the slave's LAN ports to one of the LAN ports on the master router. That effectively disables the NAT/Firewall since you aren't using the WAN port on the access point router at all.

Thank you!

I'm about to get a router to setup as an AP and had the same question. Same as OP, I saw a few guides that just talked about disabling DHCP and changing the router IP, but not many talked about NAT/SPI/firewall. I was starting to think that not using the WAN port made those non-issues.