US-Vietnam in nuclear negotiations

[lsquare]

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iJjUpOavdjcVY3HVe2LJvwMtDiBw

It's a very interesting development. I have mixed feelings about this deal. For starters, this deal seems to undermine US desire to limit proliferation around the world. This deal along with the India deal is setting a double standard and bounds to upset countries around the world that seeks to employ the peaceful use of nuclear energy. While I understand the complexity of the different regions of the world, this shouldn't be used as an excuse to treat Asia any differently from the Middle East. In my opinion, the best way to share nuclear technology with foreign countries is to force them to renounce the right to enrich their own uranium and instead provide all countries the right to access enriched uranium from an international organization.

Ultimately I suspect that there are other motives behind this deal. I consider myself to be a conservative, but I was disappointed with the Bush Administration's lack of assertiveness towards China. While I welcome the country's rise on the world stage, I have been very concerned with their opaque military activities and intentions on the world stage. It's about time that the US is becoming more assertive towards China to prevent it from completely dominating the region. It's ashame that China hasn't been more cooperative to appease US security interests in the Middle East (Iran) and in Northeast Asia (North Korea). What goes around does come around. China needs to pay a price for its intransigence in those matters. By allowing Vietnam (a rival to China) to enrich uranium, this will immediately raises the stake in the region by threatening Chinese security. Nothing would antagonize China more than to arm its rivals and allowing it rights like uranium enrichment.

 

[Schadenfroh]

Last I checked, Vietnam does not have a leader that has publicly stated that he wishes to annihilate an entire group of people from the planet. The deal is for civilian nuclear power technology, but yes.... it could possibly be used to develop nuclear weapons.

The US has a wonderful opportunity to mend relations with Vietnam and eventually turn them into an ally. Communism there will not last forever and when it falls, they might even become an ally.

We have over 1.5 million Vietnamese-Americans in the US, South Vietnam was an ally, but the wounds of the war with North Vietnam will certainly take more time to heal. The thing is, Vietnam needs a friend to protect them from Chinese intimidation now that The Soviet Union is gone. Let us not forget that China has a history of invading Vietnam as well (they marched in after we left).

 

[Zebo]

Ridiculous how we/GE build plants all over the world but won't build any here for 30 years now.

 

[OCGuy]

Ridiculous how we/GE build plants all over the world but won't build any here for 30 years now.

That is changing. The early site permits have been issued. This country is turning back to nuclear, even if our current energy secretary hates it.

 

[OCGuy]

Nixon wanted to give 'nam nukes as well.

 

[lsquare]

Last I checked, Vietnam does not have a leader that has publicly stated that he wishes to annihilate an entire group of people from the planet. The deal is for civilian nuclear power technology, but yes.... it could possibly be used to develop nuclear weapons.

Assuming that they have the right to enrich their own uranium, it can't possibly be that hard to develop a weapon once Vietnamese scientists master the technology. I'm not suggesting that Vietnam is going to develop nuclear weapons, but the possibility does exist.

The US has a wonderful opportunity to mend relations with Vietnam and eventually turn them into an ally. Communism there will not last forever and when it falls, they might even become an ally.

I agree and they make a useful ally. Vietnam has a population close to 100 million and I am firmly convinced that they fall under US plans to contain China, which is rapidly becoming a superpower that can challenge and undermine US interests in the world.

We have over 1.5 million Vietnamese-Americans in the US, South Vietnam was an ally, but the wounds of the war with North Vietnam will certainly take more time to heal. The thing is, Vietnam needs a friend to protect them from Chinese intimidation now that The Soviet Union is gone. Let us not forget that China has a history of invading Vietnam as well (they marched in after we left).

I agree and I think over time, Vietnam's strategic value to the US will only deepen. Both Vietnam and the US have a common "enemy" and strategic interests in the region.

 

[bfdd]

Ridiculous how we/GE build plants all over the world but won't build any here for 30 years now.

yeah wtf right?

btw I don't like this, I personally don't like the fact that we've ever shared any of this technology with other nations.

 

[lsquare]

yeah wtf right?

btw I don't like this, I personally don't like the fact that we've ever shared any of this technology with other nations.

It's not like the US has much of a choice here. The Russians have already stepped in. If we don't, other companies such as the ones in Canada, South Korea, France, and even the UK will step in. This is more than just sharing nuclear technology with the Vietnamese. This is about gaining influence and gaining the trust of a potential ally that may reap dividends years from now.

 

[dfuze]

It's not like the US has much of a choice here. The Russians have already stepped in. If we don't, other companies such as the ones in Canada, South Korea, France, and even the UK will step in. This is more than just sharing nuclear technology with the Vietnamese. This is about gaining influence and gaining the trust of a potential ally that may reap dividends years from now.

I see your point, but it would still be nice to see some of them built here in the US.

 

[Svnla]

Last I checked, Vietnam does not have a leader that has publicly stated that he wishes to annihilate an entire group of people from the planet. The deal is for civilian nuclear power technology, but yes.... it could possibly be used to develop nuclear weapons.

The US has a wonderful opportunity to mend relations with Vietnam and eventually turn them into an ally. Communism there will not last forever and when it falls, they might even become an ally.

We have over 1.5 million Vietnamese-Americans in the US, South Vietnam was an ally, but the wounds of the war with North Vietnam will certainly take more time to heal. The thing is, Vietnam needs a friend to protect them from Chinese intimidation now that The Soviet Union is gone. Let us not forget that China has a history of invading Vietnam as well (they marched in after we left).

The leadership of VN is welcome the US because not of anything but $$$. More trade/business with US = more $$$ for them. I went back to visit VN in the last few years and the changes (economic) were amazing.

China is declaring the WHOLE China Sea as its own lake or "core interest" such as Taiwain and Tibet and no one else can touch it. VN needs help from another superpower such as US to contain China.

VN is leary of China because afterall, China colonized VN for over 1,000 years, way back before there was a US.

 

[Modelworks]

I look at it this way. It is better for them to go through us and get the information and fuel than it is for them to make deals with other countries. This way we have access to what they are doing , how they are using it . It isn't like we are just going to send them a ship full of the stuff and tell them use it however they like. It will be done with the NRC like always where we have full access to their facilities.

This country is doomed if we do not start building nuclear plants now. All this talk of electric cars, what a joke, it would take 25 new plants to power just the cars. I'm glad I have a power company that realizes the benefits of nuclear power and live in a state that isn't opposed to it. Progress energy just brought a second reactor online here. They have room for 3 in the plant and were only using 1 previously. They got the turbine from some northern state where it was ordered and has sat in storage for years because the state refused to allow the plant to be built.

You can check here to see where new reactors are proposed in the USA.
http://www.nrc.gov/reactors/new-reactors/col/new-reactor-map.html
Progress energy has 6 sites selected for review for a total of 12 new reactors. The rest of the country , especially the western states need to get with it.


Almost all the new sites are using westinghouse AP1000 designs.
http://www.ap1000.westinghousenuclear.com/

 

[BoomerD]

"Light the nuclear candle and turn Hanoi into a permanently lit parking lot."

General Curtis LeMay had the right idea. Bomb North Vietnam back to the stone age...but fuck no... it was better to continue to let US troops get killed by the thousands.

 

[hal2kilo]

yeah wtf right?

btw I don't like this, I personally don't like the fact that we've ever shared any of this technology with other nations.

Yes, let's put the genie back in the bottle. Unfortunately, it's way too late for that. If we don't do it with the idea that we can get them into the community of non-proliferation through cooperation, then the Russians, French or other more nefarious nations will supply them with what they want. They may not be as friendly or cooperative after that.

 

[woolfe9999]

That is changing. The early site permits have been issued. This country is turning back to nuclear, even if our current energy secretary hates it.

Everything I've heard is that Chu is rather pro-nuclear power.

- wolf

 

[Lemon law]

"Light the nuclear candle and turn Hanoi into a permanently lit parking lot."

General Curtis LeMay had the right idea. Bomb North Vietnam back to the stone age...but fuck no... it was better to continue to let US troops get killed by the thousands.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Curtis Lemay did indeed have that idea, but as Goldwater VP pick, that bright idea helped Goldwater lose by a landslide.

Of course that bright idea was adopted by LBJ, it did not work, because you can't bomb country in the stone age back to the stone age. Ole LBJ and Nixon dropped more tonnage of bombs on just Vietnam, that all the countries involved in WW2 dropped during WW2.

 

[hal2kilo]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Curtis Lemay did indeed have that idea, but as Goldwater VP pick, that bright idea helped Goldwater lose by a landslide.

Of course that bright idea was adopted by LBJ, it did not work, because you can't bomb country in the stone age back to the stone age. Ole LBJ and Nixon dropped more tonnage of bombs on just Vietnam, that all the countries involved in WW2 dropped during WW2.

Holy shit. I thought I knew my political history. Lemay was a nut case if it was true.

Oops sorry Lemon. Stephanie Miller says you're wrong.

It was GOLDWATER/MILLER folks. Stephanie Miller is the daughter of William E. Miller not just some Air America Left wing tool lol.

Also, it was Wallace/Lemay, even nuttier. Sadly, my grandfather voted for him. He couldn't bring himself to vote Democrat and he knew well before Watergate that Nixon was a crook.

 

[BoomerD]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Curtis Lemay did indeed have that idea, but as Goldwater VP pick, that bright idea helped Goldwater lose by a landslide.

Of course that bright idea was adopted by LBJ, it did not work, because you can't bomb country in the stone age back to the stone age. Ole LBJ and Nixon dropped more tonnage of bombs on just Vietnam, that all the countries involved in WW2 dropped during WW2.

Actually, the only one of LeMay's ideas later adopted was to mine and bomb the port of Haiphong. Johnson and Nixon never followed LeMay's recommendations fully. Too "politically incorrect."

It has also been claimed that LeMay never actually said, "Bomb them back to the stone age," but was instead something inserted by an author writing a book. He also never (publicly) made the comment about nuking Hanoi...although he is reputed to have made the comments more than once.

As a Vietnam vet, I was always disappointed in how that war was prosecuted. We never were allowed to fight to actually win the war...too many "rules of engagement," too many restrictions on how our forces were used.

IMO, the USA should NOT be in any sort of dialogue with the Vietnamese government until all the POW/MIA issues are resolved once and for all. WAY too many troops who were known to have been captured...but were never seen/heard from again.

 

[Moonbeam]

Oh good. What are we asking for to not bomb them?

 

[hal2kilo]

Oh good. What are we asking for to not bomb them?

Armchair nuke throwers are quite the thrill aren't they.

 

[lsquare]

I see your point, but it would still be nice to see some of them built here in the US.

I'm pretty sure new nuclear reactors are being built in the US. Obviously building them are slower in the US because of regulations. In places like Vietnam and China, I can guarantee you that not only are there less regulation, but also a heavy handed approach from the government. What the government wants to be done will be done. Here, we have to do environmental studies, then get different agencies to certify it, and possibly listen to people's objections and etc. Now you know why it's going to be a while before we see a new nuclear reactor up and running?

 

[lsquare]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Curtis Lemay did indeed have that idea, but as Goldwater VP pick, that bright idea helped Goldwater lose by a landslide.

Of course that bright idea was adopted by LBJ, it did not work, because you can't bomb country in the stone age back to the stone age. Ole LBJ and Nixon dropped more tonnage of bombs on just Vietnam, that all the countries involved in WW2 dropped during WW2.

True!

 

[lsquare]

Actually, the only one of LeMay's ideas later adopted was to mine and bomb the port of Haiphong. Johnson and Nixon never followed LeMay's recommendations fully. Too "politically incorrect."

It has also been claimed that LeMay never actually said, "Bomb them back to the stone age," but was instead something inserted by an author writing a book. He also never (publicly) made the comment about nuking Hanoi...although he is reputed to have made the comments more than once.

As a Vietnam vet, I was always disappointed in how that war was prosecuted. We never were allowed to fight to actually win the war...too many "rules of engagement," too many restrictions on how our forces were used.

IMO, the USA should NOT be in any sort of dialogue with the Vietnamese government until all the POW/MIA issues are resolved once and for all. WAY too many troops who were known to have been captured...but were never seen/heard from again.

In my opinion, that will weaken US presence in the region especially with China rising fast. As important as that issue is, this shouldn't prevent us from deepening our influence in the region. Vietnam is a very important regardless of what happened in the past. I'm sure that as relations deepen, then those other issues will be resolved accordingly. There's too much at stake just to let something like that get in the way.

 

[OCGuy]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Curtis Lemay did indeed have that idea, but as Goldwater VP pick, that bright idea helped Goldwater lose by a landslide.

Of course that bright idea was adopted by LBJ, it did not work, because you can't bomb country in the stone age back to the stone age. Ole LBJ and Nixon dropped more tonnage of bombs on just Vietnam, that all the countries involved in WW2 dropped during WW2.

Yes but if you know anything about the ROE that the pilots had to abide by, it is sickening.

We lost the war politically, not militarily.

 

[ElFenix]

Nixon wanted to give 'nam nukes as well.

 

[hal2kilo]

didn't go over my head either.