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US to let Turkish forces move into Syria, abandoning Kurdish allies

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VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
4,593
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McConnell thinks the anti-Syrian withdrawal resolution passed by the House wasn't strong enough.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...ria-resolution

He wasn't coy. His motive was laid bare: "It is curiously silent on the issue of whether to actually sustain a U.S. military presence in Syria, perhaps to spare Democrats from having to go on record on this question."

It's not that he wants to make it hard for Republicans to vote for it. He wants to put Democrats in a position where they have to vote no on the resolution. Then the Republicans will claim that the Democrats are responsible for the inevitable massacre of the Kurds.
 

Stryke1983

Member
Jan 1, 2016
169
237
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McConnell thinks the anti-Syrian withdrawal resolution passed by the House wasn't strong enough.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...ria-resolution

He wasn't coy. His motive was laid bare: "It is curiously silent on the issue of whether to actually sustain a U.S. military presence in Syria, perhaps to spare Democrats from having to go on record on this question."

It's not that he wants to make it hard for Republicans to vote for it. He wants to put Democrats in a position where they have to vote no on the resolution. Then the Republicans will claim that the Democrats are responsible for the inevitable massacre of the Kurds.
You'd think that with a US ally being abandoned and Trump having another meltdown McConnell would stop enabling him and just put politics aside so the government can get on with correcting the mistake and minimizing the damage done.. But no, he just has to try and capitalize on the situation.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,134
13,079
136
Mitch- " This futile gesture needs stronger wording, because Democrats."

It's done. US forces are doing the great skedaddle out of Syria & there's nothing to be done about it. Oh, and we should expect more foreign policy disasters so long as Trump is President. Mitch could change that if he cared more about country than party. He won't. Trump commands the GOP base & will lay waste to any & all Republican politicians who cross him, even if they remove him from office.
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
11,511
2,722
136
And many Trump supporters are like "well he's just doing what he promised he'd do" without taking any consideration into HOW and WHY he's doing it.

It just doesn't matter to them. We all know that blind faith is an essential tool that every despot and false prophet relies on. Those tyrants bank on it. Trump is now at the point where it's all he has left to keep his base from revolting what with those many grand gesture "campaign promises" not being kept and catchy insults against his (their) enemies getting ground down to flea shit and all.

I look forward to the time (looks to be much sooner than later) when Repubs up on the Hill think Trump's hold on their base is tenuous enough to bail on him and still get reelected.

Sure, there will always be the hold-outs, but methinks there won't be enough of them to keep the Repubs now holding seats from getting rid of Trump and rolling out their newest and improved edition of "the greatest president that ever lived" of which most of their base will, of course, accept as if Trump never existed.

edit - As an aside, i wonder if getting rid of Trump via impeachment before his term is up is more favorable to the Dems than beating him at the polls, where if successfully impeached and removed his replacement will have a much better chance at keeping the White House in the hands of the Repubs.
 
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Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,134
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I look forward to the time (looks to be much sooner than later) when Repubs up on the Hill think Trump's hold on their base is tenuous enough to bail on him and still get reelected.
You wish. Trump has them by the balls. Right by their motherfucking balls. If he goes down, he'll drag them along with him. His support among the mesmerized GOP base is unwavering. The GOP may not win with him, but they're sure to lose w/o him.
 
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Nov 25, 2013
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The US media (and many posters in this forum) are hysterically screaming about how their Kurdish allies have been betrayed by Trump and Turkey should be severely punished with economic sanctions, tariffs and other ways.

It is highly disappointing but as I know that Trump is a hate figure for obvious reasons, I don't blame anyone on the subject. Let’s clarify some facts that you don’t want to understand again.

1. Turkey is not invading Syria! Turkey started this operation in order to build a buffer zone due to the existence of the PKK & ISIS -DAES terrorist elements in the region. We will possibly come to terms with Essad or relocate some of the 4 million Syrians in Turkey by building cities and infrastucture in the region. If you are willing to host a few million Syrians for our behalf, you are welcome.

2. Turkey has been warning US, NATO, Russia and all EU countries who are ALWAYS ignorant about terrorist attacks of the PKK-YPG, which created more than 40,000 deaths and misery in our families over the last 40 years.

3. Yes,Turkey is the invader country who welcomed more than 4 million Syrian refugees and is keeping them safely in our country while the REST OF THE WORLD has been shamefully ignoring and neglecting them. We all love the humanitarian values of West a lot.

4. Same so-called invader Turkey is such a vicious country against the Kurds, who opened her borders on March 16, 1988 in Northern Iraq when Saddam Hussein slaughtered almost 50,000 Kurds with chemical weapons. Nearly 1,2 millions Kurds crossed Turkish borders and Turkey called for international humanitarian aid and the response of the Western world was heartbreaking and great deal of embarrassment!

5. You call the PKK-YPG militants as heroes and allies, but never asked this important question: Have they cleared-out ISIS-DEAS yet.
The answer is absolutely NOT! Still more than 70,000 ISIS-DEAS operatives are all around Northern Syria and part of Northern Iraq.
President Obama (maybe domestically he was perfect ) unfortunately ruined the balance of Middle East by ignoring Turkey and using the PKK (which is officially considered a terrorist organization by the US Senate 🤣) as a leverage tool, thanks Barrack 👊🏻!

Yet let's say Kurds helped you clear out ISIS, they did you a favor, what has Turkey been doing since the Korean war ? You sell out your old buddy for the new guy in town ? What is this ungrateful hostility ?

6. Erdogan is a dictator bla bla bla .. Well, having never and will never vote for the guy, all I can say is he is a funny kind of dictator who can lose elections and end his term around 2023. He is sitting in Ankara because he was elected democratically with 86% voter turn out elections. He is not a perfect symbol of democracy but worse examples seem to be OK for you.
Couldn't wait a month, eh? Thanks for the propaganda update though. Always appreciated.
 
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pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
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So what you are saying is that US couldnt stop Turkey to invade a foreign territory by using diplomatic ways ??
Are you suggesting that Erdogan would have attack either way without the "OK" from US ??
Yes, It seems Erdogan don't give a hoot what anyone thinks about it.

Yes. It is my opinion he told the US they were coming regardless to get his buffer zone on the border.
 

zzyzxroad

Platinum Member
Jan 29, 2017
2,503
1,547
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Yes, It seems Erdogan don't give a hoot what anyone thinks about it.

Yes. It is my opinion he told the US they were coming regardless to get his buffer zone on the border.
So Erdogan is in some sort of position to start dictating terms to the United States of America?
 

pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
17,549
1,759
126
So Erdogan is in some sort of position to start dictating terms to the United States of America?

He thinks that he is as was demonstrated by his military actions in Syria. We shouldn't have any boots on the ground in Syria at all, none. To quote one of the few things I agreed with Obama about.
 

zzyzxroad

Platinum Member
Jan 29, 2017
2,503
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He thinks that he is as was demonstrated by his military actions in Syria. We shouldn't have any boots on the ground in Syria at all, none. To quote one of the few things I agreed with Obama about.

Where is your knowledge of the region coming from? Would you consider yourself knowledge on the subject?
 

pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
17,549
1,759
126
Where is your knowledge of the region coming from? Would you consider yourself knowledge on the subject?

Nothing more than what I read in the newspaper, see online and news.

No I am not an expert on the subject.

How about you?
 

bguile

Senior member
Nov 30, 2011
465
18
81
So Erdogan is in some sort of position to start dictating terms to the United States of America?
At this point yes they are. Turkey is going to protect it's own interest's, as any country will do. They did this in the past with Cyprus, and will do so again in the future. For the current crisis, they have been saying for awhile what they want and what they are going to do to achieve it. They are not going to allow an independent Kurdish state on their borders, and they want the refugee's out. The latest deal that Pence struck with Turkey is the U.S. administration beginning to try to get back into good graces with Turkey/put this whole mess behind them and start to try to find a way to move forward. It basically is admitting that Turkey will get what it wants, with some feel good language thrown in about respecting the Kurds.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,134
13,079
136
Yes, It seems Erdogan don't give a hoot what anyone thinks about it.

Yes. It is my opinion he told the US they were coming regardless to get his buffer zone on the border.
Which is what you have to believe to believe in Trump. He does that to people, inspires them to lie for him, even when they don't realize that's what they're doing.
 

zzyzxroad

Platinum Member
Jan 29, 2017
2,503
1,547
106
Nothing more than what I read in the newspaper, see online and news.

No I am not an expert on the subject.

How about you?
Absolutely not but all the military and foreign policy experts seems to agree that this was a horrible move by trump. Got any links that back up you position?
 

zzyzxroad

Platinum Member
Jan 29, 2017
2,503
1,547
106
At this point yes they are. Turkey is going to protect it's own interest's, as any country will do. They did this in the past with Cyprus, and will do so again in the future. For the current crisis, they have been saying for awhile what they want and what they are going to do to achieve it. They are not going to allow an independent Kurdish state on their borders, and they want the refugee's out. The latest deal that Pence struck with Turkey is the U.S. administration beginning to try to get back into good graces with Turkey/put this whole mess behind them and start to try to find a way to move forward. It basically is admitting that Turkey will get what it wants, with some feel good language thrown in about respecting the Kurds.
So you think if trump didn't give his blessing and agree to pull our troops, Turkey would have attacked Kurds with embedded US troops?
 

Bitek

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2001
9,016
2,900
136
At this point yes they are. Turkey is going to protect it's own interest's, as any country will do. They did this in the past with Cyprus, and will do so again in the future. For the current crisis, they have been saying for awhile what they want and what they are going to do to achieve it. They are not going to allow an independent Kurdish state on their borders, and they want the refugee's out. The latest deal that Pence struck with Turkey is the U.S. administration beginning to try to get back into good graces with Turkey/put this whole mess behind them and start to try to find a way to move forward. It basically is admitting that Turkey will get what it wants, with some feel good language thrown in about respecting the Kurds.
What you said, but with more truthiness:

 

DisarmedDespot

Senior member
Jun 2, 2016
370
260
136
So why did Trump order an immediate and disorganized pullout right now, after years of his presidency, and then give Turkey's wanna be dictator a green light to invade and let his allied militias butcher civilians?

Why not start an organized, gradual pullout within his first hundred days? Would give every side time to prepare for eventualities instead of instantly pulling the carpet out from under the Kurds because Erdogan was scaring him on the phone.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
14,382
4,647
136
Would you also rather leave ally and friend behind to get slaughtered?

No, I would warn them that thousands of Turkish troops are on the way.

Would you sell out your friend and ally to their enemy, tuck tail and run, to let them get slaughtered?

No, the Kurds are a very capable force. There is nothing that 1000 Americans scattered across the Northern regions of Syria would have changed.

Good job?

Yes, We should not have been in Syria to begin with.


*****************************
Now you answer some questions. K


Do you think we should be pouring thousands of our troops into Syria to stop the Turkish hoards?

How many American lives are you willing to throw into a fire that doesn't belong to us?

The fight between the Turkish and Kurds has been going on for over 4 decades. It has nothing to do with us. If we are going to fight the Turks on behalf of the Kurds we need to go all in and just send troops into Turkey.

Should we start bombing Turkey?
cy : Would you also rather leave ally and friend behind to get slaughtered?
geek : No, I would warn them that thousands of Turkish troops are on the way.
cy : And where should they go? You helped them carve out this block for themselves, in return for them doing your dirty on ISIS.


cy : Would you sell out your friend and ally to their enemy, tuck tail and run, to let them get slaughtered?
geek : No, the Kurds are a very capable force. There is nothing that 1000 Americans scattered across the Northern regions of Syria would have changed.
cy : You know that is not true. Turkey would not have pushed on the Kurds if the US had stayed. What is Erdogan going to do? Decalre war on America? Please.


cy : Good job?
geek : Yes, We should not have been in Syria to begin with.
cy : 100% besides the point, you are there now. You could argue that you never should have been in the ME to begin with.. but then again maybe you wouldnt have the nice things you have now.


geek : Now you answer some questions. K
cy : Aight.

geek :Do you think we should be pouring thousands of our troops into Syria to stop the Turkish hoards?
cy : Again, it would never have happened. Erdogan is not going to declare war on America. That is nuts.

geek :How many American lives are you willing to throw into a fire that doesn't belong to us?
cy :As an ally to the US ... Ill have to consider my options next time you try and tap us for Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syra - whatever. I know how you treat your allies now, I can only thank god that it was not my ass you sold out this time. So the answer must be along these lines : How many lives of an ally goes toward one American?

geek : The fight between the Turkish and Kurds has been going on for over 4 decades. It has nothing to do with us. If we are going to fight the Turks on behalf of the Kurds we need to go all in and just send troops into Turkey.
cy : Or you could have secured them another piece of land somewhere else. They just want a place to live. I think that would have been the stand up thing to do if you absolutely had to FOLD to a psychopathic character like Erdogan.

geek : Should we start bombing Turkey?
cy : You know, Turkey, Erdogan, is spanking you cause he has seen you taking a screwing from Putin with no consequence. I am thinking if you take the schoolyard bully out for a dance, idiots like Erdogan wont be a problem to begin with.
 

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