US strike kills 11 Pakistani soldiers

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Auric

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 1999
9,591
2
71
Originally posted by: Lemon law

But our mistake is trying to put the cart in front of the horse and try to impose rather than understand what the population wants and needs. When the preconditions are established we can win over the Afghani people, but until those preconditions are established, we can't even hope to communicate.

The population wants to produce opium. It's what they know and are good at. It puts food on the table. Thankfully, the opportunity which was supressed under the Taliban has been restored under occupation (Allah akbar!).
 

The Green Bean

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2003
6,506
7
81
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: The Green Bean
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
It confirmed that 11 soldiers were killed including an officer.
Pakistani troops repulsed the Afghan soldiers and the coalition then bombed the area. Coalition aircraft also killed around 15 Taliban militants about a kilometre (half a mile) away, the officials said.

What were Pakistani soldiers doing WITH Taliban militants?

The message is clear ? side with our enemy and you will join them in death.

Don't be arrogant. Once Pakistan stops supporting NATO in Afghanistan there will only be one loser - NATO; without our airspace and supply routes it will be the end of your little campaign in Afghanistan.

We'll see about that -- both Russia AND the majority of the 'Stans have agreed to assist and allow shipments of ALL supplies through their countries. Once Pakistan no longer has the supply routes to use as leverage, what will they do to stop us from entering the frontier and destroying the Taliban ourselves?

My guess is that we'll eventually have the 'Stans -AND- Pakistan routes to bring in supplies; and Pakistan won't do anything to stop us from entering the frontier region.

IOW, status quo...

We will take as many invaders as POW as we can and bet on the fact that the Americans have far too much to lose if they initiate a nuclear war.
 

The Green Bean

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2003
6,506
7
81
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Didn't Beanie about 8 months ago effectively say, ""Bring it on!"" to the US touting the beloved patriot military strength ??

Lead, follow or get out of the way, bud. If you are either unwilling or unable to address the problem, or actively supporting insurgents and providing their leadership with safe haven, I don't give a sheet.

I don't care about beloved patriot resentment. NOW HEAR THIS: Your country?s national sovereignty is NOT under threat.

You need to gain a more genuine recognition of the threats posed to Afghanistan by the cross-border insurgents. Until then ...

I'd be alot less worried about the Hellfires than the AC-130s in support of SFs Ops.

Look out for Spooky


If you're so worried about cross border terrorist strikes then simply convince your Afghan "allies" to let us build the border fence!
 

The Green Bean

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2003
6,506
7
81
US State Department sad at loss of Pakistani troops WASHINGTON, June 12 (APP): The US State Department described the incident on Pakistan-Afghanistan border as regrettable, saying it is sad over the loss of Pakistani security officials. ?This is a regrettable incident. We are sad to see the loss of life among the Pakistani military who are partners in fighting terror,? spokesman Gonzalo Gallegoz said. Pakistan strongly condemned the air strike in its Mohmand tribal area and termed it as ?unprovoked and cowardly.? However, he claimed, there was notice of engagement with militants in the area. This is a reminder that better cross border communications between forces is vital, Gallegoz added. ?We are sure that military on both sides will look into the matter and review how to prevent recurrence and how to prevent the Taliban from using the area,? he stated. Quoting the air force officials in Afghanistan, he claimed early indications say they acted in self-defence. (Posted @ 12:05 PST)

I should think that should be good enough for now but NATO should be careful if it wants us to cooperate. However I wouldn't bet on the new government just letting this pass as if nothing has happened.
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
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Originally posted by: The Green Bean
Originally posted by: palehorse
We'll see about that -- both Russia AND the majority of the 'Stans have agreed to assist and allow shipments of ALL supplies through their countries. Once Pakistan no longer has the supply routes to use as leverage, what will they do to stop us from entering the frontier and destroying the Taliban ourselves?

My guess is that we'll eventually have the 'Stans -AND- Pakistan routes to bring in supplies; and Pakistan won't do anything to stop us from entering the frontier region.

IOW, status quo...

We will take as many invaders as POW as we can and bet on the fact that the Americans have far too much to lose if they initiate a nuclear war.

You won't take any damn POWs, and your military will not confront the NATO forces that enter the frontier... and nobody said anything about going nuclear, except you. :confused:

Do I need to repeat the four realistic choices you have?

These "Pakistani soldiers" who were killed were in bed with our Taliban enemies. I know it, you know it, and both of our governments know it.

See ya soon! :D
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
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Well here is the yahoo news version.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...DKmc1aw322w9t2uDys0NUE

I note the video stresses the presence or non presence of any structures the Pakistani army unit was occupying, when they had every right to occupy any piece of territory inside of Pakistan regardless if there was a structure or not.

What is more clear to me is that there a variety of different groups operating in a fairly small area. Certainly there were some taliban insurgents, there were Afghani army units,
there was US air force offensive presence, and exactly what the Pakistani army unit was doing is somewhat totally unclear. But according to the yahoo link, some sort of communication was established between the the Pakistani and Afghani army units and which side of the border that is close as 200 yards is somewhat critical.

We have the totally convinced palehorse version that the pakistani units were in bed with the taliban, we have the US army version, the Pakistani version, and the real truth may never be established.

And in such situations emotions are as valid as facts. But I think its clear that we have someone totally biased in palehorse who is basically saying, the Afghani people don't matter, the Pakistanis don't matter, historical forces don't matter, all that matters is the opinion of palehorse and his cartoonist version of good and evil and infinite US military power. And we wonder why this kind of thinking has made negative progress for six years running and the fact that the USA may very soon lose its only supply line into Afghanistan.
 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
0
0
Originally posted by: Aimster
Did you know Pakistan has missiles that can strike anywhere in Israel?

Highly dubious. Pakistan has tested missiles which they claim have a maximum range of 2000km. Perhaps you will provide evidence that these missiles are deployed and operational. Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?

Don't flatter yourself. Any risk from beloved patriot missiles is carried exponetially more by New Delhi than Tel Aviv.

 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Looking at the video, it looks like a case of unintentional friendly fire at worst. Friendly and enemy units in close proximity.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
What matters is what side of the border the Pakistani unit was on. If a US plane landed a bomb one single inch inside of Pakistani territory, its a US Violation of Pakistani sovereignty. And no other consideration matters.
 

Aimster

Lifer
Jan 5, 2003
16,129
2
0
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Aimster
Did you know Pakistan has missiles that can strike anywhere in Israel?

Highly dubious. Pakistan has tested missiles which they claim have a maximum range of 2000km. Perhaps you will provide evidence that these missiles are deployed and operational. Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?

Don't flatter yourself. Any risk from beloved patriot missiles is carried exponetially more by New Delhi than Tel Aviv.

Pakistan's missile program is very advanced.

I don't see how this is hard to believe that Pakistan has missiles capable of hitting Israel.

That's like saying Iran doesn't have missiles that can hit Israel so Israel should just completely scrap their missile defense program that is costing them billions.

 

ranmaniac

Golden Member
May 14, 2001
1,940
0
76
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: The Green Bean
Originally posted by: palehorse
We'll see about that -- both Russia AND the majority of the 'Stans have agreed to assist and allow shipments of ALL supplies through their countries. Once Pakistan no longer has the supply routes to use as leverage, what will they do to stop us from entering the frontier and destroying the Taliban ourselves?

My guess is that we'll eventually have the 'Stans -AND- Pakistan routes to bring in supplies; and Pakistan won't do anything to stop us from entering the frontier region.

IOW, status quo...

We will take as many invaders as POW as we can and bet on the fact that the Americans have far too much to lose if they initiate a nuclear war.

You won't take any damn POWs, and your military will not confront the NATO forces that enter the frontier... and nobody said anything about going nuclear, except you. :confused:

Do I need to repeat the four realistic choices you have?

These "Pakistani soldiers" who were killed were in bed with our Taliban enemies. I know it, you know it, and both of our governments know it.

See ya soon! :D

More horseshit from the resident islamophobe. More Pakistani soldiers have died at the hands of militants and taliban than US soldiers in the Afghanistan campaign.
 

maddogchen

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2004
8,903
2
76
Originally posted by: Lemon law
What matters is what side of the border the Pakistani unit was on. If a US plane landed a bomb one single inch inside of Pakistani territory, its a US Violation of Pakistani sovereignty. And no other consideration matters.

thats bullshit. they're firing rpgs from inside Pakistani territory into Afghanistan. And that is what matters the most.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Originally posted by: maddogchen
Originally posted by: Lemon law
What matters is what side of the border the Pakistani unit was on. If a US plane landed a bomb one single inch inside of Pakistani territory, its a US Violation of Pakistani sovereignty. And no other consideration matters.

thats bullshit. they're firing rpgs from inside Pakistani territory into Afghanistan. And that is what matters the most.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is firing RPG's from inside Pakistani territory? Are you sure its not the taliban insurgents
and not the Pakistani Army unit?

And does it matter when the two Pakistani major political parties are very close to ready to force the Pakistani government to sever the US supply line which is a 100% Pakistani right.

We the people in the USA would not tolerate this kind of reckless abandon inside our territory even if our own army or police were the ones shooting and bombing anything that moves. Why should we expect the Pakistanis to tolerate it?
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
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Originally posted by: Lemon law
Originally posted by: maddogchen
Originally posted by: Lemon law
What matters is what side of the border the Pakistani unit was on. If a US plane landed a bomb one single inch inside of Pakistani territory, its a US Violation of Pakistani sovereignty. And no other consideration matters.

thats bullshit. they're firing rpgs from inside Pakistani territory into Afghanistan. And that is what matters the most.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is firing RPG's from inside Pakistani territory? Are you sure its not the taliban insurgents
and not the Pakistani Army unit?

And does it matter when the two Pakistani major political parties are very close to ready to force the Pakistani government to sever the US supply line which is a 100% Pakistani right.

The US has been sending in Predator drones Pakistan with the cooperation of the Pakistani government. Again, looking at the video, it looks at worse like an accidental case of friendly fire. An incident which we should apologize for and try to rectify but hardly a malicious or cowardly act. I'd imagine it would also be damn hard to tell where the border is there as well.

Our relationship with Pakistan has always been tenuous at best.
 

maddogchen

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2004
8,903
2
76
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Originally posted by: maddogchen
Originally posted by: Lemon law
What matters is what side of the border the Pakistani unit was on. If a US plane landed a bomb one single inch inside of Pakistani territory, its a US Violation of Pakistani sovereignty. And no other consideration matters.

thats bullshit. they're firing rpgs from inside Pakistani territory into Afghanistan. And that is what matters the most.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who is firing RPG's from inside Pakistani territory? Are you sure its not the taliban insurgents
and not the Pakistani Army unit?

And does it matter when the two Pakistani major political parties are very close to ready to force the Pakistani government to sever the US supply line which is a 100% Pakistani right.

We the people in the USA would not tolerate this kind of reckless abandon inside our territory even if our own army or police were the ones shooting and bombing anything that moves. Why should we expect the Pakistanis to tolerate it?

we the people in the USA? what a crappy statement there. reckless abandon, whatever.
Stop making stupid assumptions of we the people.

If it was Pakistani army units firing rpgs at coalition troops then it totally goes against the Pakistani story. Either way its the coalition's right to defend themselves.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Queasy somewhat says it all with-------Our relationship with Pakistan has always been tenuous at best.

But still inaccurate, they are lending us a supply route into a landlocked country and nothing more. The other choice was Iran, Iran, or Iran.

They have made it more or less crystal clear that there is to be no US military activity inside of Pakistani territory.

And if the Pakistani government decides to terminate that supply route, there is zero the USA can do.

Yet we have grade A idiots like palehorse asserting the non existent right to operate inside of Pakistan and that skates on very thin ice when Pakistani army units become collateral damage.
 

maddogchen

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2004
8,903
2
76
problem is that the Taliban problem will not go away until Pakistan seriously faces the problems it has in its region. Until we get at the root of the problem where the Taliban has safe haven in Pakistan and regularly recruits from Pakistan, we will continue to have a war on the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan.
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Queasy somewhat says it all with-------Our relationship with Pakistan has always been tenuous at best.

But still inaccurate, they are lending us a supply route into a landlocked country and nothing more. The other choice was Iran, Iran, or Iran.

They have made it more or less crystal clear that there is to be no US military activity inside of Pakistani territory.

And if the Pakistani government decides to terminate that supply route, there is zero the USA can do.

Yet we have grade A idiots like palehorse asserting the non existent right to operate inside of Pakistan and that skates on very thin ice when Pakistani army units become collateral damage.

Realize that the Pakistani release states that the area is disputed territory.

If both sides claim it and there is no painted line down the border, who was where?

And the fact that there were Taliban in the mix (very close to the Pakistanis) muddies the water even more.



 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
0
0
Originally posted by: Aimster
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Aimster
Did you know Pakistan has missiles that can strike anywhere in Israel?

Highly dubious. Pakistan has tested missiles which they claim have a maximum range of 2000km. Perhaps you will provide evidence that these missiles are deployed and operational. Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?

Don't flatter yourself. Any risk from beloved patriot missiles is carried exponetially more by New Delhi than Tel Aviv.

Pakistan's missile program is very advanced.

I don't see how this is hard to believe that Pakistan has missiles capable of hitting Israel.

That's like saying Iran doesn't have missiles that can hit Israel so Israel should just completely scrap their missile defense program that is costing them billions.

Way to NOT answer the question: Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Aimster
Did you know Pakistan has missiles that can strike anywhere in Israel?

Highly dubious. Pakistan has tested missiles which they claim have a maximum range of 2000km. Perhaps you will provide evidence that these missiles are deployed and operational. Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?

Don't flatter yourself. Any risk from beloved patriot missiles is carried exponetially more by New Delhi than Tel Aviv.
Link
Islamabad and Tel Aviv are both in the possession of long-range missiles and none of them is safe from the other. Pakistan?s Ghauri III has been tested to do 2,700 kilometers, a range which could be increased to 3,500 kilometers with the adjustment of payload. Israel, on the other hand, has long ago tested its Jericho II to a range of 1,450 kilometers. But that?s not it! According to a former pentagon official familiar with Israel?s missile programme: "it?s safe to assume that the missile (Jericho II) hasn?t been tested to full range."

Moreover, Jerichos are fired from Shavit launcher which is powerful enough to make Jericho II travel to a distance of 4,500 kilometers. Israel is also believed to have Jericho III ready with a range up to 5,000 kilometers.

Which Jerichos and Ghauris able to hit Kahuta and Soreq (Israel?s equivalent of Kahuta) Tel Aviv and Islamabad are involved in a balance of terror even from a distance of over 3,500 kilometers.

But this balance of terror constituted by missiles, does not create any parity in the striking or bargaining positions of these two countries because Israel still has edge over Pakistan in the shape of its anti-missile defence system, Arrow II, which is considered one of the most sophisticated anti-ballistic missile system. This is the same system a vital component of which, according to the International Herald Tribune, had already been purchased by India in February this year.

 

Aimster

Lifer
Jan 5, 2003
16,129
2
0
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Aimster
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Aimster
Did you know Pakistan has missiles that can strike anywhere in Israel?

Highly dubious. Pakistan has tested missiles which they claim have a maximum range of 2000km. Perhaps you will provide evidence that these missiles are deployed and operational. Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?

Don't flatter yourself. Any risk from beloved patriot missiles is carried exponetially more by New Delhi than Tel Aviv.

Pakistan's missile program is very advanced.

I don't see how this is hard to believe that Pakistan has missiles capable of hitting Israel.

That's like saying Iran doesn't have missiles that can hit Israel so Israel should just completely scrap their missile defense program that is costing them billions.

Way to NOT answer the question: Maybe you could give us a little idea how far it is from Pakistan to Israel?

What are you like 12?
You need to learn how to talk to people. Communication problems on the Internet? Must be hell for you in person


The Distance from Islamabad Pakistan to Tel Aviv Israel is 3,500KM
Which is exactly what their missiles are capable of

Before you post again do yourself a favor and take communication 101 at the local community college