US states lure back manufacturing....

[z1ggy]

Our assembly line workers make 15 and up. No way will any Control System Engineer worth anything going to work for that.

In a place like TX where cost of living is pretty low, $25/hr is actually not too shabby for entry level. 2-3 exp is probably pushing it, but still not bad in this economy where kids are struggling to find work.

 

[realibrad]

This graph shows why manufacturing will never be what it was in the US.

People are so efficient, that we simply don't need the manpower we used to. The reason the jobs went to China has to do with 1 reason and 1 reason only. The cost to automate production is higher than paying a Chinese worker. Automation has made the American worker too expensive to do the jobs. Even if China tomorrow said they would give up all manufacturing jobs, it would not matter, because it would all go into automation.

It takes many many times more people in China to produce what 1 skilled American and a factory can produce.

 

[Engineer]

Even if China tomorrow said they would give up all manufacturing jobs, it would not matter, because it would all go into automation.

It takes many many times more people in China to produce what 1 skilled American and a factory can produce.

It would not matter? So you would just assume the factories, even if possibly automated, to go stay in China? How about management, accountants, HR people, maintenance, engineering, operators (even if only a few) at the plant level? How about the automation houses that build the equipment, service it? How about the technical sales that sell the components to make the automation?

 

[realibrad]

It would not matter? So you would just assume the factories, even if possibly automated, to go stay in China? How about management, accountants, HR people, maintenance, engineering, operators (even if only a few) at the plant level? How about the automation houses that build the equipment, service it? How about the technical sales that sell the components to make the automation?

I thought about addressing that, but I can do it now.

Yes, you will get externality job creation. I will admit I don't know what the net effect would be, but in my opinion I don't think it would enough to justify the expense of trying to get those jobs here. Aside from the issue of if China got the jobs through shady ways or not, is the fact that getting those jobs here will be costly.

A lot of the things you listed would still not come from the US. We live in a globalized world, and transportation costs are cheaper than ever. Accountants, Engineering, component suppliers, and sales would not need to come back to the US. The reason those jobs stay in places like China is because the cost of labor is so low. Even those jobs are going to get replaced in the not too distant future.

http://www.gizmag.com/rethink-robotics-baxter-industrial-robot/24183/

$22k (One time cost) for a robot is very close to skilled workers in China. They don't require anything close to what a human does.

The fact of the matter is, that people in foreign countries have a much lower standard of living. If you give a person more, they will expect more in the future. I have never seen a society that advanced and stopped because they had enough. China is no different, and the more we fight the future, the longer we draw this out. Let capitalism work, and you will see China raised out of poverty and they will in turn demand more. History will repeat itself like it always does, and we will all be better off.

 

[Engineer]

I thought about addressing that, but I can do it now.

Yes, you will get externality job creation. I will admit I don't know what the net effect would be, but in my opinion I don't think it would enough to justify the expense of trying to get those jobs here. Aside from the issue of if China got the jobs through shady ways or not, is the fact that getting those jobs here will be costly.

A lot of the things you listed would still not come from the US. We live in a globalized world, and transportation costs are cheaper than ever. Accountants, Engineering, component suppliers, and sales would not need to come back to the US. The reason those jobs stay in places like China is because the cost of labor is so low. Even those jobs are going to get replaced in the not too distant future.

http://www.gizmag.com/rethink-robotics-baxter-industrial-robot/24183/

$22k (One time cost) for a robot is very close to skilled workers in China. They don't require anything close to what a human does.

The fact of the matter is, that people in foreign countries have a much lower standard of living. If you give a person more, they will expect more in the future. I have never seen a society that advanced and stopped because they had enough. China is no different, and the more we fight the future, the longer we draw this out. Let capitalism work, and you will see China raised out of poverty and they will in turn demand more. History will repeat itself like it always does, and we will all be better off.

You obviously don't know much about automation and what people in the US prefer or use when it comes to local factories.

Edit: By the way, the robot you show (Baxter), sucks donkey balls. He is far to slow to do anything effective. He is cheap and he is made in the USA (and supposed to be easy to program). Baxter 2.0 is supposed to be better. We'll see.

 

[realibrad]

You obviously don't know much about automation and what people in the US prefer or use when it comes to local factories.

Oh no doubt this is more of your wheelhouse. But don't just end it there, give me the reasons you think I'm wrong. Ill gladly change my position if you have a compelling argument.

 

[Engineer]

Oh no doubt this is more of your wheelhouse. But don't just end it there, give me the reasons you think I'm wrong. Ill gladly change my position if you have a compelling argument.

Reserved: Will update once I get more time (on a hot job).

 

[charrison]

That was proposed by the Bush administration and never happened after the flogging they took for suggesting it.

It was not a proposal by the bush admin. It was a quote by alan greenspan on the difficulty of classifying what a manufacturing job is.

 

[Zebo]

This graph shows why manufacturing will never be what it was in the US.

People are so efficient, that we simply don't need the manpower we used to. The reason the jobs went to China has to do with 1 reason and 1 reason only. The cost to automate production is higher than paying a Chinese worker. Automation has made the American worker too expensive to do the jobs. Even if China tomorrow said they would give up all manufacturing jobs, it would not matter, because it would all go into automation.

It takes many many times more people in China to produce what 1 skilled American and a factory can produce.

lol at your chart. As if we live a 1950s lifestyle in 1200sqft home and single car with maybe 1 tv. Naw we have tones more shit. Track GDP vs manf. then you'll see problem. Track welfare or foodstamps vs manf then youll see inverse relations.

And its not cheaper. cheaper for company maybe. My dad sold his lightning manf business to china - they packed it all up even half the building they cut up put in containers and moved it to china. Lights cost same still. Welfare/disability rolls increased.

Bottom line why are we paying people to sit at home and buying shit from china? Shouldnt be that way to subsidize a business. Either way we have to pay. TANSTAAFL.

Thats why my sig says cheap is more expensive. We also are fucking up generations sociologically by sitting at home collecting checks. Leaving them with no job speaking let alone work skills.

Drive through detriot akron canton buffalo or any former manf area and see the cultural wastelands our bad policy has brought. Id wear a bullet proof vest though.

 

[Engineer]

It was not a proposal by the bush admin. It was a quote by alan greenspan on the difficulty of classifying what a manufacturing job is.

It was from one of the Bush economists, not Greenspan.