US Military to leave Saudi Arabia

[syzygy]

BBC Link: US military to leave Saudi Arabia

donald rumsfeld has spoken. decision is imminent. this fulfills saudi arabia's wish.

A top US military official said the decision was taken by a "very mutual agreement"
with the Saudi Government and that the withdrawal would be completed by the end of
the summer.

does this bode well for democratic reform in saudi arabia which was promised by crown
prince abdullah a few months ago ? among their preconditions was the removal of u.s.
forces from their country.

saudi monarchy mulls democratic reforms

 

[phillyTIM]

i'm suprised that the US had the audacity to "use" the domain of an "allie" who produced most of the terrorist participants in the 9-11 hijackings.

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

From the same person who has condemned each and every aspect of the military involvement in Iraq...

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

Oh the irony...

 

[Tiger]

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

If your an american citizen you've got some real self hate issues and need counseling.
If your not a citizen I'd suggest leaving the counrty since we seem to make you so unhappy.

 

[Nitemare]

Good riddance. Saudi Arabia produced 2/3 of the 9-11 hijackers as well as has the state religion of wahabism...which advocates the killing of all non-muslims.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

The US essentially served as hired labor for the Saudi royals. . . . ."very mutual agreement" . . . my arse. SA has a significant military (thanx primarily to purchases from the US) and we've conveniently dismantled the region's most imposing military power other than Israel. The royals opposed the Iraq invasion (as did I) but the success of the invasion/early occupation phase makes a continued US presence on Saudi soil unnecessary.

I'm not calling the Saudi royals hypocrites . . . but if the shoe fits . . .

 

[Insane3D]

Wasn't the presence of troops in Saudi Arabia, AKA the holy land, the whole point for OBL declaring a jihad on us? Looks like he got his way in the end... I wonder if he is still alive, if he will be able to convince his followers to attack us anymore...

 

[CPA]

Saudi Arabia = France

 

[Fencer128]

Originally posted by: CPA
Saudi Arabia = France

I don't follow exactly, could you elaborate please?

Cheers,

Andy

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
i'm suprised that the US had the audacity to "use" the domain of an "allie" who produced most of the terrorist participants in the 9-11 hijackings.

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

A fool and hyprocite in the truest sense.

 

[exp]

Sounds good to me.

 

[Alistar7]

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
i'm suprised that the US had the audacity to "use" the domain of an "allie" who produced most of the terrorist participants in the 9-11 hijackings.

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

nothing suprising here, I have been telling you we were pulling out of SA for about a month. SA is going to start creating a nationally elected assembly to eventually shift the control of power to the people.We have been pushing for them to do this for 10 years, 9/11 was the impetus for this change. Philly, we didn't have to use force to accomplish this, we merely told SA, we can prove the link to a-queeda nad you know it, step down or you are next. Because we have a good relatonship this was done in private. If you think this was not the case, fine, then please tell me why they changed their minds NOW

 

[LilBlinbBlahIce]

Originally posted by: Alistar7

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
i'm suprised that the US had the audacity to "use" the domain of an "allie" who produced most of the terrorist participants in the 9-11 hijackings.

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

nothing suprising here, I have been telling you we were pulling out of SA for about a month. SA is going to start creating a nationally elected assembly to eventually shift the control of power to the people.We have been pushing for them to do this for 10 years, 9/11 was the impetus for this change. Philly, we didn't have to use force to accomplish this, we merely told SA, we can prove the link to a-queeda nad you know it, step down or you are next. Because we have a good relatonship this was done in private. If you think this was not the case, fine, then please tell me why they changed their minds NOW

If you really think Saudi Arabia is going to be anything close to a democracy, you really live in la la land. You're asking the most oppresive, contra-democratic nation on this planet to suddently shift or face attack by the US? Ain't going to happen. I have been to Saudi, women are not allowed to drive, work or anything. No where in the Koran does it say anything like that. They actually have people walking around who hit them if their not covering their whole face let alone not wearing a hijab. This has been the mentality for a long, long time, long enough to where it is engrained in both the older generation and the newer one as being "the way things are supposed to be." Wahabism is an interpretation of Islam that most Muslims do not follow, go to any South East Asian Muslim nation or many of the more progressive Arab nations like Bahrain and you will see just how extreme SA really is. To get these guys to change their perspective and embrace democracy over night would be harder than having the Israelis and Pals. coming to a peace settlement by next month IMO. I really don't think there was a "become a democracy or you're next" with Saudi, if anyone proposed that they are truely retarded and have no understanding of the region. I have heard of these proposed reforms, let's see what they will achieve.

 

[CaptnKirk]

With the U.S. presence removed from Saudi Arabia, there will be no farther pressure for the Saudis to provide any form of
democracy to the people that live there. It was a 'talking point' concession for our / their governments anyway.

What is DOES provide is further unincumbered financial support of Osama Bin Laden and his organization
as the lack of our presence removes the few checks and balances we had there.

There is a huge political mess building there, as the Arab youth have had education, status, and a free ride on the
wealth of the country - but there is virtually no work or anything productive to do in that society.
This leads them to where the Al Queda message has meaning to those from 16 to 30 years of age.
You are either with 'em or against 'em.

 

[Alistar7]

Originally posted by: LilBlinbBlahIce

Originally posted by: Alistar7

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
i'm suprised that the US had the audacity to "use" the domain of an "allie" who produced most of the terrorist participants in the 9-11 hijackings.

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

nothing suprising here, I have been telling you we were pulling out of SA for about a month. SA is going to start creating a nationally elected assembly to eventually shift the control of power to the people.We have been pushing for them to do this for 10 years, 9/11 was the impetus for this change. Philly, we didn't have to use force to accomplish this, we merely told SA, we can prove the link to a-queeda nad you know it, step down or you are next. Because we have a good relatonship this was done in private. If you think this was not the case, fine, then please tell me why they changed their minds NOW

If you really think Saudi Arabia is going to be anything close to a democracy, you really live in la la land. You're asking the most oppresive, contra-democratic nation on this planet to suddently shift or face attack by the US? Ain't going to happen. I have been to Saudi, women are not allowed to drive, work or anything. No where in the Koran does it say anything like that. They actually have people walking around who hit them if their not covering their whole face let alone not wearing a hijab. This has been the mentality for a long, long time, long enough to where it is engrained in both the older generation and the newer one as being "the way things are supposed to be." Wahabism is an interpretation of Islam that most Muslims do not follow, go to any South East Asian Muslim nation or many of the more progressive Arab nations like Bahrain and you will see just how extreme SA really is. To get these guys to change their perspective and embrace democracy over night would be harder than having the Israelis and Pals. coming to a peace settlement by next month IMO. I really don't think there was a "become a democracy or you're next" with Saudi, if anyone proposed that they are truely retarded and have no understanding of the region. I have heard of these proposed reforms, let's see what they will achieve.

I told you this would happen over a month ago, it is. Now you are telling me the reasons are BS? LOL

Think lil, you are correct in EVERYTHING you stated about their culture and current govt. WHY the sudden change? Why did it suddently correspond to this war and 9/11? Why did they change their minds NOW that they don't even need to the US for protection? We did tell them (very quietly) you are next. You don't think Bush could have laid a path from SA to OBL? LIl, I really want to hear why you think they changed their minds if not for this reason.

 

[LilBlinbBlahIce]

Originally posted by: Alistar7

Originally posted by: LilBlinbBlahIce

Originally posted by: Alistar7

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
i'm suprised that the US had the audacity to "use" the domain of an "allie" who produced most of the terrorist participants in the 9-11 hijackings.

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

Shows how two-faced the US government is.

nothing suprising here, I have been telling you we were pulling out of SA for about a month. SA is going to start creating a nationally elected assembly to eventually shift the control of power to the people.We have been pushing for them to do this for 10 years, 9/11 was the impetus for this change. Philly, we didn't have to use force to accomplish this, we merely told SA, we can prove the link to a-queeda nad you know it, step down or you are next. Because we have a good relatonship this was done in private. If you think this was not the case, fine, then please tell me why they changed their minds NOW

If you really think Saudi Arabia is going to be anything close to a democracy, you really live in la la land. You're asking the most oppresive, contra-democratic nation on this planet to suddently shift or face attack by the US? Ain't going to happen. I have been to Saudi, women are not allowed to drive, work or anything. No where in the Koran does it say anything like that. They actually have people walking around who hit them if their not covering their whole face let alone not wearing a hijab. This has been the mentality for a long, long time, long enough to where it is engrained in both the older generation and the newer one as being "the way things are supposed to be." Wahabism is an interpretation of Islam that most Muslims do not follow, go to any South East Asian Muslim nation or many of the more progressive Arab nations like Bahrain and you will see just how extreme SA really is. To get these guys to change their perspective and embrace democracy over night would be harder than having the Israelis and Pals. coming to a peace settlement by next month IMO. I really don't think there was a "become a democracy or you're next" with Saudi, if anyone proposed that they are truely retarded and have no understanding of the region. I have heard of these proposed reforms, let's see what they will achieve.

I told you this would happen over a month ago, it is. Now you are telling me the reasons are BS? LOL

Think lil, you are correct in EVERYTHING you stated about their culture and current govt. WHY the sudden change? Why did it suddently correspond to this war and 9/11? Why did they change their minds NOW that they don't even need to the US for protection? We did tell them (very quietly) you are next. You don't think Bush could have laid a path from SA to OBL? LIl, I really want to hear why you think they changed their minds if not for this reason.

I'm not saying they won't try to instill some limited reforms, but I highly doubt anything that would be comparable to western democracies is going to take hold, if we think the Iraqi people may not be ready for dem., imagine the Saudis! Think about it, say they do achieve some level of democracy, and a Wahabi cleric or someone comes to power, can you imagine how bad the situation would get? Iraq is different because the older generation is educated and has some concept of the benefits of democracy, its only the "Saddam generation" that could be susseptible to radicalization. The Saudi's don't have anyone who has experienced democracy. Atleast now we have the Sauds in power who are US puppets, better to keep the status quo IMO. I would love to see a truely democratic SA, but its not going to happen anytime soon.

 

[konichiwa]

Originally posted by: Tiger

if the US was so gung-ho patriotic for it's people, then the US would have used it's military force AGAINST the Saudis rather than leech upon the Saudi's for support.

If your an american citizen you've got some real self hate issues and need counseling.
If your not a citizen I'd suggest leaving the counrty since we seem to make you so unhappy.

(The merits of phillyTIM's argument aside...) I'm really, really tired of this sad old argument of "love it or leave it." It's the idiotic brainchild of unthinking, unquestioning Americans like yourself, Tiger, who can't see the value of skepticisim and dissent.

Really makes me cringe hearing this mantra repeated over and over.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: konichiwa
Really makes me cringe hearing this mantra repeated over and over.

Equally as tiring is the "everything is the our fault" brigade who can't wait for an opportunity to litter a thread with their self-righteous indignation droppings. Nothing but one-trick ponies...the lot of them.

 

[konichiwa]

Glad we agree, then.

 

[NightTrain]

I certainly do...I'm not so sure you do tho

 

[konichiwa]

Oh I do. Believe it or not I'm not a "everthing is our fault" hawk, even though it may seem so consdiering a dissenting voice is always the loudest among this crowd of "with us or against us" chants.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: konichiwa
Oh I do. Believe it or not I'm not a "everthing is our fault" hawk, even though it may seem so consdiering a dissenting voice is always the loudest among this crowd of "with us or against us" chants.

It's the nature of the beast. People invest a certain amount of intellectual capital in one side or the other and are loathe to relinquish any. We strain at gnats while swallowing camels whole.

 

[NightTrain]

oops

 

[Moonbeam]

We would know a lot more about the thick cesspool of corruption that's the House of Saud if Bush hadn't shut down the FBI investigation into the Osama's family. The Bin Ladens are the source of Bush millions.

 

[NightTrain]

Originally posted by: MoonbeamThe Bin Ladens are the source of Bush millions.

And here I always thought it was ole Prescott and the Nazis. I can never keep it straight.