Hello all, I'm still running a 775 Xeon E5450@3.6Ghz 4Gb ram, I've been considering going to a newer platform but I haven't kept up with what's the best CPU/socket it terms of bang/buck. I'd like to keep the price of the Mobo/ram/CPU around $225-250 range, I have a 120Gb SSD and a 7790 I plan on re-using, any thoughts/ideas/opinions much appreciated, thanks in advance..
Upgrade suggestions..
- Thread starter BUTCH1
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- Mar 20, 2000
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probably a hyperthreaded pentium with board and ram. unfortunately the G4560 ($65) is OOS at newegg right now and the others are about 30% more expensive for barely any more performance (the difference is graphics). add 8 GB of ram for $60 and a h270 board for $97 or b270 for $77 and you're set.
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- Jan 31, 2000
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Thanks, yea, that seems to be a popular chip, I remember Intel selling a similar chip but 100% unlocked but I can't remember which one it was, I'll do some more digging around.
- Mar 20, 2000
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You're probably thinking of the haswell based g3258 pentium, which could overclock but stuttered in games due to lack of threads.
You can't do much with such a budget when 16GB of RAM is 100+$.
Wait for quad core AMD Ryzen in the 100-199$ range, get a 60-100$ mobo and w/e amount of DRAM you need but expect to pay at least 25$ per 4GB even if you chose slower DRAM. In theory you can get it done inside the budget if you don't need more than 8GB DRAM. Going a bit above budget might be preferable for best bang for the buck.
Those CPUs are unlocked so you can overclock.
If there aren't sever shortages for Ryzen 8 cores, i expect that 6 and 4 cores will launch in April but it could be later. Some might not agree with my expectation for timing but it's very important for AMD to launch those ASAP and reach folks that can't pay 300+ on a CPU.
An important upside is that AMD plans to stick with this socket for a few generations so you could upgrade just a CPU in a few years from now.
As for the Pentium, absolutely not. It's a dual core with a GPU you don't need and not in any way shape or form, futureproof.
You don't want something that feels outdated from day one as your main PC. And you are investing in CPU/mobo/DRAM not just CPU and in that case, with all 3 added up, it's a rotten deal. It's also barely an upgrade in multi core perf vs your CPU. This CPU is a toy and it's ok for other purposes but don't get that as your main PC for the next 5 years.
Buying used parts would be a much better option than a Pentium but since you seem likely to want to use the system for many years, AMD Ryzen is by far the better path.
If you can stretch the budget, the cheapest Ryzen quad with SMT to get 8 threads would be preferable.
On the mobo side there are a bunch of chipsets and there will be ample budget options but if you might upgrade to a better CPU in some years( with maybe more cores), do account for that and get a mobo with decent power delivery.
On the RAM side, prices are terrible right now so you might want to limit the amount of DRAM you purchase this year and add more later.
At the lower range you can fit in the 250$ budget but for best bang for the buck and a bit of future proofing , spending a bit more is better.
If we assume cheapest Ryzen with SMT at 150$ and a decent B350 mobo at 80-100$, that's 230-250 so 8GB of RAM pushes it to 280-300 and you could add RAM when prices come down.
EDIT: By paying 100-150$ for a quad Ryzen you can get 2x the perf ( or better) but ,in your case, the perf per $ must be calculated on the total so at 215 vs 250-300$, you get much better perf per $ and it would be an actual upgrade for you. Ofc on top of that, the upgrade path adds a lot of value for budget constrained customers.
Even if you don't trust my reasoning, look at the perf of your existing system vs that Pentium before purchasing it.
Wait for quad core AMD Ryzen in the 100-199$ range, get a 60-100$ mobo and w/e amount of DRAM you need but expect to pay at least 25$ per 4GB even if you chose slower DRAM. In theory you can get it done inside the budget if you don't need more than 8GB DRAM. Going a bit above budget might be preferable for best bang for the buck.
Those CPUs are unlocked so you can overclock.
If there aren't sever shortages for Ryzen 8 cores, i expect that 6 and 4 cores will launch in April but it could be later. Some might not agree with my expectation for timing but it's very important for AMD to launch those ASAP and reach folks that can't pay 300+ on a CPU.
An important upside is that AMD plans to stick with this socket for a few generations so you could upgrade just a CPU in a few years from now.
As for the Pentium, absolutely not. It's a dual core with a GPU you don't need and not in any way shape or form, futureproof.
You don't want something that feels outdated from day one as your main PC. And you are investing in CPU/mobo/DRAM not just CPU and in that case, with all 3 added up, it's a rotten deal. It's also barely an upgrade in multi core perf vs your CPU. This CPU is a toy and it's ok for other purposes but don't get that as your main PC for the next 5 years.
Buying used parts would be a much better option than a Pentium but since you seem likely to want to use the system for many years, AMD Ryzen is by far the better path.
If you can stretch the budget, the cheapest Ryzen quad with SMT to get 8 threads would be preferable.
On the mobo side there are a bunch of chipsets and there will be ample budget options but if you might upgrade to a better CPU in some years( with maybe more cores), do account for that and get a mobo with decent power delivery.
On the RAM side, prices are terrible right now so you might want to limit the amount of DRAM you purchase this year and add more later.
At the lower range you can fit in the 250$ budget but for best bang for the buck and a bit of future proofing , spending a bit more is better.
If we assume cheapest Ryzen with SMT at 150$ and a decent B350 mobo at 80-100$, that's 230-250 so 8GB of RAM pushes it to 280-300 and you could add RAM when prices come down.
EDIT: By paying 100-150$ for a quad Ryzen you can get 2x the perf ( or better) but ,in your case, the perf per $ must be calculated on the total so at 215 vs 250-300$, you get much better perf per $ and it would be an actual upgrade for you. Ofc on top of that, the upgrade path adds a lot of value for budget constrained customers.
Even if you don't trust my reasoning, look at the perf of your existing system vs that Pentium before purchasing it.
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VirtualLarry
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I disagree. You want the OP to wait two more months, and spend above his stated budget? Just so he can "squeeze in" a Ryzen?
When, he could throw together a G4560 / G4600 + B150/B250 mobo today, for relatively low prices, and get some decent DDR4 (with Ryzen in mind), and then later, when Raven Ridge comes out, get AM4 then.
I've having a lot of fun with the G4560 and G4600 (using iGPU) CPUs, for NON-GAMING tasks. Though, if you look at some of the graphs Sweepr recently posted in the Skylake / Kaby Lake thread, it shows an average FPS for 16 popular games, and while the G4560 is near the bottom of the list, along with the FX-8350, it's still 57FPS min, 78FPS average. So, basically, it's perfectly adequate for 1080P 60FPS gaming these days, given a sufficient video card.
And it's only $60 on sale! (Antonline on ebay)
I snagged some B150 Biostar boards for $27 shipped, that's $87 for the pair. Add some 8GB kit of DDR4-3000/3200 for $60, and that's $147. Under $150 for a damn decent combo. YMMV on the deals. Gotta snag 'em while they're hot.
Edit: According to my CPU-Z benchmark, my G4600 with DC DDR4-2400 SO-DIMMs, scores:
ST: 1758 / MT: 4006
A reference Q8400 (2.66Ghz) is:
ST: 910 / MT: 3216
So, it would be a step up, although not a huge amount in MT, coming from a competently-overclocked Core2Quad. (I think that the ST improvement would make itself more obvious from using the new rig, though. I think it would be darn impressive, with an SSD.)
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The default choice is an i5. It doesn't excel in any area but it doesn't fall apart in any area either. Four basic cores. A non K 7600 (the fastest model) with a H270 board (more USB ports and more PCI-E flexibility) with 16GB of 2400MHz RAM will last for years for the basics.
richierich1212
Platinum Member
- Jul 5, 2002
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Well I thank everyone for the replies, I was thinking around 8Gb ram, I only run 4 now but that's all this Gigabyte board allows. Kinda weird in the sudden resurgence of two-core CPU's, I thought that would be long gone in 2017. I also have to consider the socket, what was nice about 775 is you could run a $70 CPU or a $800 Q9XXX if you wanted so I'd probably try and get into a socket that will allow an upgrade 2-3 years down the road without having to dump the current MOBO+RAM.
The Pentium is an irresponsible recommendation, the folks before my post did it because they are not used to think of options, you do it because you have an affinity for Intel.
My suggestion offers him a few times more value when including the upgrade [path.
This is about people's money so please be responsible..
UsandThem
Elite Member
- May 4, 2000
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Just because someone offers a different opinion than you, it does not make them irresponsible. Well, maybe if they are saying a i7-7700k goes into a AM4 motherboard.
Larry has built many AMD systems (he even still has some AM3+ motherboards in his little shop of horrors). I usually agree with Larry most of the time, but I do agree with you with one caveat. If someone who posted here asking for what they should buy because they don't know what is what, and wanted to order the parts tomorrow, I still would recommend an Intel system. Why? Is it because Ryzen "sucks"? Not at all. It looks like a solid platform with performance on the high-end of what I was hoping for. So why would I recommend an Intel system then? Maturity. If someone builds an AMD Ryzen system right now, there will be some growing pains/troubleshooting/updates. That person would have to be ok dealing with a brand new platform. Now all of that might happen smoothly, but from the various builders threads I have read, there are some room for improvement (especially in the BIOS area). I also feel the same way when Intel releases an entirely new platform as well, and I waited about 3 months after Skylake launched to build my system for the exact same reason.
Now if someone was looking at building one a month from now, I might be singing a different tune. Maybe some of the issues have already been taken care of. While all my system have been Intel for the last 10 or so years, prior to that all I used was AMD, so I'm not a "fanboy" in either direction. I am all about what is the best long-term value when building a new system. For some people, a fast dual-core system is all they will ever need based on their use. However, I do agree that someone building a "gaming PC" now, and who isn't a person who builds a new computer every 1-2 years, I would highly recommend a quad-core and above based system.
I built this box 2 days ago and out of 16GB of RAM I've already seen it crack close to 4.5GB just browsing and Office in the background. 8GB will do for a basic box but if you longevity out of your box double it. The get a cheap CPU now and upgrade in three years route is dead now, Intel has already gone through LGA 1155, LGA 1150 and now LGA 1151 since 2011 and only because Intel. Buy the best CPU you can afford with a decent mobo now that has the ports you need plus some spare and ride it out till it dies.
VirtualLarry
No Lifer
- Aug 25, 2001
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I think that's the first time in a long time that anyone has "accused" me of having an affinity for Intel, LOL.
I build a lot of "budget"-class rigs, and right now, the Intel G4560 is pretty clearly (to me), the best bang-for-buck, value-for-money, CPU that you can buy right now. (Where is Raven's Ridge, come on AMD!)
FM2/FM2+ "quad cores" aren't even real quad-cores, they are dual-module chips, and... in my experience, they suck. I actually prefer the FM1 CPUs, at least their dual-cores were true dual-cores. (I have a stock of those still.)
I'm just saying, if you want performance on the cheap, the G4560 is a decent chip, and it can be had for as low as $60 on ebay, new.
Ryzen may be a good value at the high-end, but that market is the same market that Intel's HEDT chips play in. Not everyone is in the market for a HEDT-class chip.
And of course, AMD's FX-series chips are mostly sort of DOA to me.
Edit: I mean, waiting for Ryzen's not a bad choice, really, either. But the G4560 is "cheap and now", while Ryzen (if you don't want to drop a minimum of $330 on the CPU alone!), is "wait for the future, it's better". But the future is always "better". If the OP needs to build NOW, then I've explained what I would pick. And the first two replies to this thread said the same thing, btw.
Maybe the OP should clarify, whether they are looking to buy "HEDT" or "mainstream", whether they want to do gaming, video-editing, or just web-browsing / productivity applications, and what their maximum budget is.
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VirtualLarry
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Well, I don't know if he can afford a whole quad-core Intel rig on $250, the CPU alone will eat up most of that, and then you've got to buy a decent mobo and some currently-a-bit-expensive RAM.
I kind of agree about the RAM amount, 4GB is way too little in this day and age (even some laptops, maybe just above entry-level, are coming with 8GB standard), 8GB is good enough for now, except possibly higher-end gaming rigs, and 16GB is just really sweet to have. Above 16GB, well, if you need that, you'll know. (Higher-end scientific / rendering / etc.)
Edit: I will concede that the Pentium with HT, while an obvious pick for now, may not be the best choice longer-term. Perhaps the AM4 platform will be, or possibly some new Intel platform (socket 26xx)? It's even possible, though nothing concrete suggests it yet, that socket 1151 might extend all the way through Coffee Lake, with six cores on the mainstream socket. In that case, getting in on the ground floor of 1151 might not be a bad idea.
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- Mar 20, 2000
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oh however do i manage to get along with just 8 GB of ram?!? the horror!
8 GB is fine.
i'll echo larry's comment about the pentium being the bargain pick right now, however that may change in 4-6 months based on what amd does with pushing zen processors into lower price points.
however, and, if you've got a microcenter, you can get a 7600k, cheap h110 board, and 8 gb of ram for $310AR. and you can't beat that with a stick.
8 GB is fine.
i'll echo larry's comment about the pentium being the bargain pick right now, however that may change in 4-6 months based on what amd does with pushing zen processors into lower price points.
however, and, if you've got a microcenter, you can get a 7600k, cheap h110 board, and 8 gb of ram for $310AR. and you can't beat that with a stick.
Reinvented
Senior member
- Oct 5, 2005
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I ended up going this route...sort of. I got a 7600k, and an Asrock B250M Pro4, and 16GB's of memory. Board had a discount combo which was nice. I wouldn't risk getting a 100 series board, unless you know that it has a bios update to support Kaby Lake already on it. I almost made that mistake, and it would have costed me some money to either get a different CPU (Skylake) or a different board that supported the 7600K. Either way, this was a good upgrade for me and gaming. I splurged a bit more, and got a new GPU as well. Was good!
S
So socket 1151 is probably the best bet,(for Intel) as far as compatibility with future upgrades go?. Damm, I remember my first build, an AMD K5@100Mhz back in '91, hours hovering over the MOBO with a magnifying glass making sure all the jumpers were correctly configured, manually entering HD values into the BIOS. At that time I thought I was pretty smart, now I feel like Barney F-ing Rubble LOL. One thing I won't compromise on is Gigabyte, this 775 board has run from '08-present without one issue, nothing is more of a PIA than have a MOBO just croak after 1-2 yrs of usage. Ditto Antec on the PS, I forgot how many Hipro, Orion, you name it PS just up and quit after less than a year.
So socket 1151 is probably the best bet,(for Intel) as far as compatibility with future upgrades go?. Damm, I remember my first build, an AMD K5@100Mhz back in '91, hours hovering over the MOBO with a magnifying glass making sure all the jumpers were correctly configured, manually entering HD values into the BIOS. At that time I thought I was pretty smart, now I feel like Barney F-ing Rubble LOL. One thing I won't compromise on is Gigabyte, this 775 board has run from '08-present without one issue, nothing is more of a PIA than have a MOBO just croak after 1-2 yrs of usage. Ditto Antec on the PS, I forgot how many Hipro, Orion, you name it PS just up and quit after less than a year.
UsandThem
Elite Member
- May 4, 2000
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LGA1151 is the way to go for at least another year, and it is unknown at this point if Intel's next CPU will continue to use LGA1151 or a new socket. Intel sure likes changing their sockets.
Not sure how long it's been since you looked at Antec, but their power supply lineup isn't what it used to be. They still have a few good units, but it's almost a cautionary tell how they gave up the PSU market to EVGA, Corsair, and Seasonic.
OK, thanks for that, I have one of their "Earthwatts" series but it's only 430 so I might have to spend to upgrade there as well. The Hipro went after 2-3 months, fried a cap and filled the room with smoke that would knock a buzzard off a shi*wagon, the sparks shooting out the back were most entertaining as well!. Miraculously my rig was undamaged LOL.
I picked up an Antec True Power Classic 550w for this build, even though its from 2013 and based off Seasonic's older G series (its not a more modern platform from last year) it works just fine. Gold rated, 14cm deep so not fat, and quiet (so far). The PSU options locally here are the definition of poor.
VirtualLarry
No Lifer
- Aug 25, 2001
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