Upgrade CPU or GPU?

[imported_GeekWannabe]

Hi folks, I have a very specific question about what I think are the two best upgrade paths for me at the moment, so I'll get right to it.

Current config is as follows:
Intel C2D 2.13GHz (all stock clocks)
Intel D975xbx2
2x1GB crucial Ballistix (800)
ATI radeon x1950xtx @ 1600x1200
4x80GB SATA in striped raid array
1x320GB SATA storage drive
Antec 650W psu
Antec Nine-Hundred Case w/ additional side-cover fan

My primary usage (approx 90%) is for playing 2-4 Everquest accounts simultaneously, sometimes on multiple monitors, and I'm having difficulty keeping them all playable beyond 2. Perhaps this is to be expected, I honestly don't know.....but from what I can tell Everquest is not a particularly demanding game comparatively speaking.

The two options I feel are feasable (and within my financial reach) would be:
A. Q6600 proc. and 2 additional GB of the Ballistix RAM

B. An additional radeon 1950 (crossfired?) or a newer GPU entirely

Any advice you could give would be greatly appreciated, and if you feel there's a better solution I'll certainly give it consideration if it fits the budget. Many Thanks!

*Almost forgot......OS is XP home (32-bit?) so could that be a potential system-speed or RAM bottleneck?

 

[Tempered81]

Overclock the 2.13ghz Stock core2duo, and get a 4870/gtx260

 

[Cogman]

New GPU and a little more ram on the side will do wonders for you. Your CPU should be fast enough for running two instances of the game.

Look at the 4870 or 4850 by ATI, they are really good and fairly cheap. The 260 and 280 from Nvidia aren't too shabby either. (both are pretty competitive against each other)

 

[brencat]

Learn how to OC your E6400 to ~ 3.0ghz which will give you a tremendous performance boost, and replace your graphics card with a Radeon 4850. Total out of pocket will be < $150.

I do NOT recommend you spend $180 to go quad without trying to OC first. And another 2gb RAM is not needed if you're sticking with XP.

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

Wow, you guys are incredibly fast responders! I like the idea of a new GPU, just hated to ignore CPU if it was going to be an issue but it seems not to be. I'm pretty sure case cooling is set to overkill at the moment, but what should I get for HSF to ensure I don't cook it OCing?
Also, I've heard and read that the D975xbx2 is oc-unfriendly, any idea what multiplier/voltage settings to use and still maintain the stability that I purchased that board for? thanks again!

 

[brencat]

You should have a look at the OCing sticky at the top of this forum which will help give you the basics. And you probably won't need an aftermarket HSF to do 3.0ghz with safe temps. Safe temps would be 65c or less under full load with a stress testing program like Orthos or Prime95 v25.3 or higher. Monitor your temps with Coretemp 99.3.

If you want to go past 3.0ghz, then yes, you may need something more -- Xigmatek S1283 is currently the reigning champ for air cooling, and probably the best value for the $$. Book some reading time into your schedule and you'll pick it up real quick.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

+1 on the GPU upgrade

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

Excellent advice from all, and with Christmas vacation looming I may actually have the time to roll up my sleeves and dig in! peace, Hugh

 

[OCNewbie]

From what I've read, Everquest, and most MMO's in general, is traditionally very RAM hungry. I think adding another 2 gigs wouldn't hurt. But yeah, go for the free upgrades first with the OC'ng of your CPU.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Yeah, I second the RAM upgrade.

 

[nyker96]

I think you will get the most bang for buck if you do the following:
1. upgrade RAM to 2x2gb kit, very cheap these days.
2. get a newer ATI 4830/4850/4870 card which one depend on your budget.
3. sell off the rest extras.

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

I unplugged the unit just now and gave it a good canned-air bath, and I'm going to grab the few utilities I'll need and see how a mild OC works......2.6-2.8 depending on what kind of temps I'm getting. I picked up the goodies I'll need to lap the CPU/hsf but I'll wait to do that until I have the case open again to plug in the addt'l ram.

One question Nyker, with 4 slots available and 2x1GB already paid for, is there a real advantage to ditching it for a 2x2GB setup? I can snag an identical pair of Ballistix nowadays for a measly ~$45 for the remaining slots, but if the architecture of a 2x2GB setup yeilds real gains I'll spring for that.
(as a side note while I had the case open I flipped the fan dips up a notch to medium on the Nine-Hundred case, still pretty quiet and have another step go up if needed)

Update: Made the changes to the bios recommended in the c2d oc sticky (those unrelated to voltages and clocks that is) and left everything else on auto-config, changing ONLY the bus speed to 300, and HWM is showing 2400mhz with a 1.289Vcore, rated FSB@1200, dram freq@450, 2:3 ratio, 5-5-5-18 timings. I'm unsure about the dram voltage but will try to decifer that in a minute.

Prime95 running for close to 20 minutes and seems to have stabilized at 59c.

I'm assuming I'll need a better hsf or do a lap-dance on the intel unit before pushing anything else, but perhaps there's voltages I can tweak to get temps down. Any suggestions on how to proceed?

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: GeekWannabe
I unplugged the unit just now and gave it a good canned-air bath, and I'm going to grab the few utilities I'll need and see how a mild OC works......2.6-2.8 depending on what kind of temps I'm getting. I picked up the goodies I'll need to lap the CPU/hsf but I'll wait to do that until I have the case open again to plug in the addt'l ram.

One question Nyker, with 4 slots available and 2x1GB already paid for, is there a real advantage to ditching it for a 2x2GB setup? I can snag an identical pair of Ballistix nowadays for a measly ~$45 for the remaining slots, but if the architecture of a 2x2GB setup yeilds real gains I'll spring for that.
(as a side note while I had the case open I flipped the fan dips up a notch to medium on the Nine-Hundred case, still pretty quiet and have another step to go up if needed)

For the same price, you can get 4GB
RAM is so cheap now-a-days there's no reason not to upgrade
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231122

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: GeekWannabe


For the same price, you can get 4GB
RAM is so cheap now-a-days there's no reason not to upgrade
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231122

Hey zerocool,
Thanks for the reply........I just noticed the "big tricked-out nametag" sig and had to say- everytime that commercial comes on I chuckle to myself and the wife shakes her head, I'm certain she's thinking "doesn't take much to amuse that poor bastard........."

 

[cmdrdredd]

Originally posted by: GeekWannabe
Wow, you guys are incredibly fast responders! I like the idea of a new GPU, just hated to ignore CPU if it was going to be an issue but it seems not to be. I'm pretty sure case cooling is set to overkill at the moment, but what should I get for HSF to ensure I don't cook it OCing?
Also, I've heard and read that the D975xbx2 is oc-unfriendly, any idea what multiplier/voltage settings to use and still maintain the stability that I purchased that board for? thanks again!

Xigmatek HDT-S1284EE http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16835233023

and the bolt kit http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16835233020

total $45 and you'll never have to worry about anything. The bolt kit requires removal of the motherboard for install, but it takes the weight off the mobo around the socket area. Push pins are bad.

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

Well, after an overnight stress-test that peaked at 61c without errors of any kind, I decided to re-try the 333 setting in reference frequency that had failed on several occasions before.

I'm currently running prime95 with the following settings:
Vcore-1.3125(bios),1.277(cpuz)
FSBvolt-1.250
MCH/ICHvolt-1.525
Host clock-325mhz
Ref. freq-266
mem freq-800
mem volt-1.84
which yields 2597mhz, 1298 rated fsb,
and memory values of:
dram freq-487
ratio-2:3
on 5-5-5-18 timings

I've disabled EIST and enabled the voltage-ramping setting who's name escapes me at the moment, but even dialing all the clock settings to minimum won't allow me to boot with a Reference freq at 333, ever........Am I missing something? Isn't running with the 266 ref freq and pushing the others unnecessarily hard on things? Does my bios revision (2333) have anything to do with it?

I've scoured the boards here and elsewhere trying to avoid asking a stupid question, but it puzzles me why it would refuse to boot with a ref freq of 333 even when I slam the host clock down to its minimum of 266, essentially not even an overclock if I'm not mistaken.

Any advice or direction to the resolution so that I can resolve this would be greatly appreciated, I dont have an issue keeping it at 2596 with the 266 host clock setting, it just seems like an rough way to achieve 2.6ghz (or is that not correct?)
thanks all......can't say enough about how incredibly knowledgable people can take the hair-pulling out of some pretty complicated stuff!

 

[brencat]

Originally posted by: GeekWannabe
I'm currently running prime95 with the following settings:
Vcore-1.3125(bios),1.277(cpuz)
FSBvolt-1.250
MCH/ICHvolt-1.525
Host clock-325mhz
Ref. freq-266
mem freq-800
mem volt-1.84
which yields 2597mhz, 1298 rated fsb,
and memory values of:
dram freq-487
ratio-2:3on 5-5-5-18 timings

The bolded part is contributing to your difficulty. You need to get that RAM ratio to read 1:1. At 2:3 ratio, every time you boost the FSB, you're raising the RAM frequency by 1.5x (i.e. 325 FSB /2 x 3 = 487 mhz RAM). You want DRAM freq to match the host clock (FSB), at least until you get your CPU OC stable.

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

I can't believe I couldn't see that, after 20+ trips through the bios screens.....took the fresh set of eyes and lowered the memory frequency to 667 as per the Peakin chart that was so kindly referred to me in this forums mobo-specific oc post.

Booted immediately into windows this time and I'm commencing a stress-test to check it out, many thanks Bren and everyone else who helped me get this far in a 2-day stretch....wouldn't have stood a chance without ya!

 

[zipflint]

I don't mean to derail this thread, but I'm in a similar situation as the thread starter.
Except I'm currently running a C2D E6600@3Ghz. Rock solid with stock air cooling.
I'm trying to figure out if I should bump up to a Q6600 or a GTX260 graphics card.

here's my current setup:
CPU: Core 2 Duo E660@3Ghz
mobo: EVGA 122-CK-NF68 (this is a 680i chipset)
RAM: 4GB DDR2@400Mhz
Video: NVidia GTS8800 on a 22-inch Samsung, native rez is 1680X1050 and I never change it, except to run Crysis,
hard disks: I've got two IDE and two SATA drives,, smallest is 300GB, largest is 700GB
O/S: XP Pro 32bit and Vista Ultimate 64bit. I dual boot, and have the O/Ses on separate drives, just because it seemed more simple that way.

I do a lot of gaming and to be honest, it's Crysis that has me wanting to upgrade.
But I also do a lot of video encoding/re-encoding and audio recording/mixing. I do that mostly in XP but I want to start using Vista more often. I also do some frequent, but light, Photoshop CS3 and CS4 work, and I use Lightroom2.1 almost daily.

I know that neither the Q6600 nor the GTX260 is going to make Crysis run like butter, but will one or the other give me decent (say.....15%-20%) performance increase? I would consider the ATI 4850 due to cost but I'm afraid my Nvidia-based mobo would throw a fit.

Jeebus....this turned into a looooong post. Sorry about that.

 

[brencat]

zipflint, were I in your position, I wouldn't upgrade unless your encoding work becomes the majority of what you do. And I'm gathering that's not the case since you appear to be more of a gamer. The fact is, although the Q6600 would be the most helpful for encoding, it's the cash outlay that has me concerned. You'll drop $180 for the quad and $200 for the GTX260 -- so $380, and you'll be lucky to recover ~ $170 if you sell your GTS + E6600.

You have to decide if a $210 net outlay is justified. I don't believe it is, but it's your money at the end of the day. You have a very nice system as is. Crysis and the game's engine are total disasters in terms of resource usage. Is that game alone worth $210 to you?

 

[zipflint]

To be honest....nah, not really. I think the most sensible thing to do would be to
wait for the Core i7 and its related periphery (new mobo and DDR3 memory) become
more affordable. The more I think about it, the more I'm inclined to wait it out.

Because your argument is quite valid. I don't really do *that* much encoding, after all.

 

[biostud]

Originally posted by: zipflint

But I also do a lot of video encoding/re-encoding and audio recording/mixing. I do that mostly in XP but I want to start using Vista more often.

check this out (there's an audio problem ATM, but it should be fixed in an upcoming update)

http://www.badaboomit.com/

 

[imported_GeekWannabe]

Hey folks, OP here with a strange development after the successful oc and stress testing was completed:

After several uneventful sessions, when I turned on the system today I got an error regarding the system configuration files in windows32 that prevented the startup.

Since I haven't formatted since the original install 2 years ago I figured it wouldn't hurt to do it anyway, since I didnt have any luck seeing the raid array with my Knoppix v3.9 disk and have backups of everything essential anyway.

Problem is, when I start the XP install and load the Marvell raid drivers with the f6 function, during the install a box appears stating that they are not logo-certified and would I like to proceed anyway. I hit "yes" and it gets past that alright but the next Marvell driver that prompts that same box freezes the system and all inputs (mouse/kb non-functional).

I understand this is in the incorrect forum but I thought that the familiarity with the system and its recent history posted above would be beneficial in diagnosis.

Thanks for having a look and sharing your insight once again,
Hugh