Upgrade assistance for someone who's been out of the loop for several years

[CrawfishFiesta]

Hello all,

I used to assemble and upgrade PCs with some regularity up until around four years ago, when I bought my Dell P2-450 (XPS R450 in case anyone cares). I basically dropped out of the hardware scene at that point.

It's time to upgrade (well, replace for the most part). I've spent the last couple of days reading AnandTech and Tom's Hardware, getting a crash course on modern hardware. Before I buy anything I wanted to bounce some ideas off you more knowledgeable folks.

I'm looking to upgrade in accordance with a decent performance/price ratio. I don't plan on overclocking and don't need a top-end system, but I would like to be able to play the games that will be coming out over the next year or two. I use this system for RPG and strategy gaming about 20% of the time, the rest of the time it's used for low-resource work (word processing, web browing, etc). My main impetus for upgrading at this time is that I've pre-ordered Morrowind, which should be arriving in about a week, and I'd like to be able to play with decent performance and graphical settings. I was thinking of spending on the order of $500 to $750 on upgrading the system, but I'm open to spending more if needed.

After my brief research, my current to-buy list includes (prices from newegg):
- AMD ATHLON XP 1900+/266 FSB PROCESSOR CPU - OEM ($136)
- Gigabyte GA-7VRX, VIA KT333 5P1A3D RETAIL ($96)
- CORSAIR MEMORY CMX512-2700C2 PC2700 DDR RAM 333MHz w/ Heat Spreader - OEM ($199)
- VGA PNY GEFORCE4 TI4400 128MB VGA, DVI-OUT & TV-OUT. RETAIL BOX ($240)
- ENERMAX EG465P-VE(FM). 431W Power supply for AMD K7 & Pentium4 ($81)
- COOLER MASTER DP5-7H53F-A1 CPU HEAT SINK AND FAN - RETAIL ($8)
(Total Cost: 760 + Shipping)

My questions are:
1. Are these parts a good fit for each other? (I assembled this list after reading disparate posts, guides and reviews, and I really don't know whether the parts work well together)

2. Does anyone have better individual items or combinations that I should select for a roughly comparable price? (I'm definitely open to looking at other options...I cobbled this group together after only a short bit of research)

3. Will I be able to stick all these components in my Dell XPS R450 case or do I need to buy a new case? (I'd prefer to use my current case if at all possible, because it will be way easier for me to convince my wife that I'm just doing a "little upgrade" so long as the PC looks the same. She'll get suspicious if she comes home and it looks like a total new computer)

4. I've heard that AMD chips run hot. Do I need to buy anything extra to dissipate heat beyond what's specified above? (the fans that come with the power supply and the cooler master CPU heat sink)

5. I've read that a lot of faster PCs are really loud. My current PC is pretty quiet. Does the configuration specified above seem like it will be loud? Is there anything fairly simple and inexpensive I could do to reduce noise (again, I don't plan on overclocking...I just want a reliable, decent performing, unobtrusive machine).

6. I'm currently using a Creative SB Live! sound card. I've read that this card can cause problems and that some people suggest avoiding it. Is that true? Should I get rid of this card and get a different sound card or a motherboard with an integrated sound card? If so, any recommendations? (I don't care much about sound clarity, so long as it isn't horrible with very noticeable artifacts. In fact, even though I bought surround sound speakers, 95% of the time I use cheap headphones so I don't bother my wife or neighbors...we live in Manhattan. Apartments are small here).

7. Will it be OK for me to continue to use Windows 98 or do I need to buy Windows XP?

8. I didn't specify HDD, FDD, DVD, CD-RW, and NIC because I assume I'll still be able to use my existing ones. Am I right in assuming this? Have the interfaces to these peripherals changed at all in the past three or four years?

Thank you all very much for your help.

 

[Athlon4all]

<< 1. Are these parts a good fit for each other? (I assembled this list after reading disparate posts, guides and reviews, and I really don't know whether the parts work well together) >>

Yea it sounds good although I can't comment on the KT333 boards, I only know about all the KT266A's.

<< 2. Does anyone have better individual items or combinations that I should select for a roughly comparable price? (I'm definitely open to looking at other options...I cobbled this group together after only a short bit of research) >>

Well here's an Intel option, but in order to get top performance, you'd need to overclock it, it is easy though:

Pentium 4 1.6A Retail ($135 or so @ Newegg)
Asus P4S333 (or if you can find it, P4S533) around $100
Same RAM
Same Video Card
That case should be fine, but I personally prefer Antec SX635
The Retail HSF is perfect for overclocking.

That setup will easily oc to 533fsb (2.1GHz). That will provide comparable performance to your configuration.

<< 3. Will I be able to stick all these components in my Dell XPS R450 case or do I need to buy a new case? (I'd prefer to use my current case if at all possible, because it will be way easier for me to convince my wife that I'm just doing a "little upgrade" so long as the PC looks the same. She'll get suspicious if she comes home and it looks like a total new computer) >>

You definately will need a new Case/PS. Dell's are propriarity, and plus, they will not power a GF4+Northwood P4 or Athlon XP.

<< 4. I've heard that AMD chips run hot. Do I need to buy anything extra to dissipate heat beyond what's specified above? (the fans that come with the power supply and the cooler master CPU heat sink) >>

I think you'll be fine 'cause you won't be ocing, although I'd look at a different HSF (see below)

<< 5. I've read that a lot of faster PCs are really loud. My current PC is pretty quiet. Does the configuration specified above seem like it will be loud? Is there anything fairly simple and inexpensive I could do to reduce noise (again, I don't plan on overclocking...I just want a reliable, decent performing, unobtrusive machine). >>

The P4 HSF is very quiet and you don't need to worry about noise on it, but for the Athlon, well I'd look at Anandtech's Socket A cooler roundup. Rest assured, Athlon's can be quiet.

<< 6. I'm currently using a Creative SB Live! sound card. I've read that this card can cause problems and that some people suggest avoiding it. Is that true? Should I get rid of this card and get a different sound card or a motherboard with an integrated sound card? If so, any recommendations? (I don't care much about sound clarity, so long as it isn't horrible with very noticeable artifacts. In fact, even though I bought surround sound speakers, 95% of the time I use cheap headphones so I don't bother my wife or neighbors...we live in Manhattan. Apartments are small here). >>

Your SB Live! will be fine on both options. SB Live! had trouble on older Athlon chipsets, but those problems are gone.

<< 7. Will it be OK for me to continue to use Windows 98 or do I need to buy Windows XP? >>

It's a matter of choice. I personally cannot imagine not using Win XP or Win 2000. They are so stable, and I like the XP GUI, so it's your choice, Win 98 will work fine, but I would encourage you to get XP or 2000.

<< 8. I didn't specify HDD, FDD, DVD, CD-RW, and NIC because I assume I'll still be able to use my existing ones. Am I right in assuming this? Have the interfaces to these peripherals changed at all in the past three or four years? >>

They haven't really changed. Although, the one thing I would strongly encourage you to get if possible is a new hard drive that is a 7200rpm drive because that is one of the most important parts of the modern computer. I would if you don't already have a 7200RPM drive.

Good luck and welcome back! If you have any questions, please feel free to PM me and ask them

 

[xXgambitXx]

Looks like a decent setup. i agree with athlon4, especially about a different HS. Most of the sound from modern computers comes from one of 2 sources. THe Power Supply being the loudest. Several manufactures have solutions out, like Enermax's Whisper series and Zalman's Silent Power Supply. i haven't heard either personally. the best way to fix it though is to swap out the any Power supply's stock fan with a Panflo fan, these are quiet but kind of expensive. if you do that then the PS will be really quiet. The Heat Sink is a different matter. you really don't have to worry about sound from a P4 system. For an Athlon, it's pretty easy to just get a HS and Fan seperate. Since you're not doing any OC'ing, then you can get a quieter (and also less CFM) fan along with a decent HeatSink, the best right now, in my opinion, is the Thermalright AX-7, you can get this w/ a Panaflo for a quiet solution.

 

[dunkster]

For motherboard, I'd buy the Shuttle AK35 for about same price, since it's both jumper-less and offers 4 IDE ports at about the same price.

I'd get an Antec PS instead of Enermax. I've seen many posts about low rail voltages with Enermax PS, but none with Antec PS.

If you really don't intend to overclock, 2700-rated memory may be overkill. Corsair XMS2400 is excellent DDRAM, and should run with all dram timings maxed.

If you change your mind about overclocking, you WILL have to replace that $8 heatsink.

For most users, 98SE is an excellent OS.

If noise is a problem, Panaflo L1As or equivalent are cheap and it's easy to replace existing fans.

Hope this helps!

 

[JohnnyTT]

Everything you have listed sounds perfect. My suggestions would be the following:

1. Replace the memory with 2100 cas 2 memory. (only a few $ difference, not a biggie)

2. 431watt power supply isn't necessary. Like somebody said above, you most likely can't use your dell case for this upgrade. Any Antec case with a 300watt power supply or more will be perfect for you.

3. You should also get a new hard-drive. A Western Digital BB model drive is perfect, and 40gigs or less is very inexpensive.

4. Win98 SE is fine. If you are only using 98 (not SE), I would then upgrade.

5. That HeatSink and the above case and power supply, are relatively quiet, so noise won't be a problem.

6. You will not have a heat problem.

7. Your Creative Live will also be fine. There is no need to upgrade.


Good Luck,

 

[DT4K]

CPU -- The athlon is a good pick. but if you are not overclocking, you might consider getting retail instead of oem. Then you get the 3 yr warranty and you get a heatsink and fan that is just as good as that $8 one you have listed. Be careful though, reading forums like these may give you the itch to start overclocking. If you think you might, get a thermalright AX-7. And get some Arctic Silver 3 to use instead of the thermal pad that comes with many heatsinks.

Mobo -- From what I have read, the KT333 is not much of an improvement from the KT266A. Either way, my preference is for the Epox and Abit boards. I have the Epox 8kha+ and I have been very happy with it.

RAM -- Corsair is good memory, but so is Crucial, Mushkin, and Kingmax. You may be able to get a better price on one of those brands if you look around.

Video Card -- If most of your gaming is strategy and RPG, that card is overkill. I would save some money and get a Geforce 2 Ti or one of the Radeon cards for around $100 or less. If you were using onboard video on that Dell, even a Geforce2 MX would be a huge improvement. If you want to play the latest fast-paced shooters, then go ahead and get a Geforce 3 or 4. If you can wait a couple of weeks, the Geforce 4 Ti4200 will be available for around $180 and will only be a little slower than that Ti4400. The Geforce 3 Ti200 is what I have and it is plenty fast for the latest games. It's around $130 now. Toms hardware had a good roundup that compares all these cards
HERE

Power Supply -- Overkill. A lot of people run high-end athlon systems on 250W power supplies and have no problems. The important thing is to get a good brand name and not a generic. And I would get 300W or 350W to be safe. But you can get a very nice antec case with a quality antec 300w or 350w psu for about the same price as that Enermax PSU by itself. Someone said that Dell case was proprietary, but I thought I heard that Dell uses Palo Alto brand cases. I would check with Dell on that. For my XP1700+ system, I got an Enlight 7237 case with 300W Enlight PSU for $46. It's a nice basic case. I've been very happy with it. Though if I had more in my budget, I would have gone for something a little fancier.

Finally -- Order everything from www.Newegg.com. They always have very good prices and have a very good reputation among us hardware enthusiasts. I have ordered from them several times and have been very satisfied.

Good luck and have fun.

 

[kgraeme]

The replies you've gotten have been great. Much of the options have as much to do with preference as anything. The one factor though that doesn't get a lot of attention in review sites is loudness. The Enermax PSU and the CoolerMaster HSF you have listed are going to make for a fairly loud system, especially if you are accustomed to a Dell.

The Antec PSUs are a bit quieter than Enermax, but can even be more quiet with a fan modification (voiding the warranty of course). The PC Power and Cooling PSUs are probably the top of the line for both reliability and quiet, but quite expensive.

The Thermalright AX-7 HSF was mentioned. Another excellent one is the Alpha PAL8045, but it's pretty pricey. While you may not be interested in overclocking, these higher performance coolers also allow for an extermely quiet system at stock speeds just by putting a big slow fan on it.