[Update2 - Not IGP?] WTF is wrong with my computer? "Soft-Locks"

[MercenaryForHire]

Update
Disabling the IGP and using a separate AGP graphics card (gF2MX) works.

Update 2
After an hour-plus of uneventful, artifact-free 3DMark, exiting back to the desktop, and just after posting "Update" above, crash.

Biostar M7NCG-400, Bios ver 09/16/2004
Does anyone know of any BIOS settings, tweaks, driver issues, or jumpers I should hunt down?

Someone help me before I throw this damned thing across the room.

It "soft locks" - as in I'll notice that I can't click the Start button, the taskbar stops responding, and then about a minute later the active window dies. 15 seconds after that I lose mouse/keyboard.

I've checked heat. Temps never break 45C even under a full load (1GHz @ 6x166), I've opened the case and pointed a desk fan at it, nothing.

I've given the CPU extra juice - 1.65v at the 1GHz setting. I've even downclocked to 6x100.
The RAM is running on 3-4-4-8 timings, sync to the CPU.
The only thing I can think of is the voltages are off for -5V in Speedfan / BIOS. Speedfan shows -3.55v, BIOS shows -61.00v. If either of those were true, the computer wouldn't even BOOT.

Someone help me. I'm going Nucking Futs here trying to figure it out. I thought it was software related, but even after a fresh reinstall of XP SP2 and no further installs it still dies. It never threw a BSOD or anything during the install either.

I'm off to boot Knoppix 3.4 and see if it runs from there. Someone please enlighten me before I sell this whole thing and get a Dell.

Edit - Booted Knoppix painlessly.

- M4H

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Update number two. Burning through Memtest like a bat out of hell. If it was the same issue, it would have locked by now.

Is there some hidden thing with the nF2 IGP that blows up in Windows? I just built an Abit nF2 SPP based one with the same Samsung RAM in dual-channel, and it ran just fine, even with a Sempron 2400 clocked up to 2.0GHz and the RAM at 2.5-3-3-7

BIOS tweaks? Settings? Anything?

- M4H

 

[n0cmonkey]

Are drivers up to date?

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Are drivers up to date?

With or without drivers, it dies either way.

Board drivers: nForce 5.10
Video drivers: Forceware 71.84

I just finished a 1hr Memtest run. Zero errors.

Let's see how long Windows thrives.

- M4H

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Okay, Windows survived for a whole two minutes there.

I'm on a fresh format now on a new drive. Going to hunt for a BIOS update for my board (Biostar M7NCG-400) apparently these things take issue with certain RAM too.

It's still kicking. What I haven't done yet is install any post-SP2 updates.

Yes, I'm aware of how vulnerable that makes this machine. I've also got to find out WTF is breaking it first.

- M4H

 

[Raduque]

I've noticed this same behavior after a fresh install on two different mobos. The only constant betweent he mobos themselves is the nForce2 chipset. (IGP on one, Ultra400 on the other) It seems to quit after a week or so and get extremely stable. I could find no cause, as all tests I did passed with flying colors. Sorry I can't help anymore, just wanted to let you know that you're not hte only one with this problem.

BTW, the way it would happen for me, would be the audio would die (since I am always listening to music), then the mouse/kb would stop responding. A reboot would bring it right back. This happened anywhere between 40s to 30m after boot.

Edit: just wanted to say I only noticed behavior on nForce2 chipsets. Installs on other chipsets don't do this.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: Raduque
I've noticed this same behavior after a fresh install on two different mobos. The only constant betweent he mobos themselves is the nForce2 chipset. (IGP on one, Ultra400 on the other) It seems to quit after a week or so and get extremely stable. I could find no cause, as all tests I did passed with flying colors. Sorry I can't help anymore, just wanted to let you know that you're not hte only one with this problem.

BTW, the way it would happen for me, would be the audio would die (since I am always listening to music), then the mouse/kb would stop responding. A reboot would bring it right back. This happened anywhere between 40s to 30m after boot.

Edit: just wanted to say I only noticed behavior on nForce2 chipsets. Installs on other chipsets don't do this.

I'd rather go back to my stable P3/733 than run an unstable XP.

Which motherboards were it? Either one a Biostar?

Edit - Now at 55m runtime. Thrashing it with P95 blended tests.

- M4H

 

[3chordcharlie]

I had bad caps on that exact board, long after the problem was supposed to be gone from manufacturing channels. I'd suggest having a look.

 

[arcenite]

I seem to recall it being a common problem with SP2 and nforce2 mobos, so use this as an excuse to build a new rig I have an nforce2 rig in my family room running XP with no problems.

 

[kehi]

I have an nforce2 rig in my family room running XP with no problems.

How, if the problem is with the NF2 and SP2, you don't have SP2 installed?

 

[arcenite]

Originally posted by: kehi

I have an nforce2 rig in my family room running XP with no problems.

How if the problem is with the NF2 and SP2, you don't have SP2 installed?

Just because it's common doesn't mean it happens to everyone, dingbat.

 

[kehi]

ok, I guess you would just be special. I was simply asking a question and you had to start calling names. OK, back to trying to figure out WTH is wrong with M4H's comp




M4H, what type of PSU are you using? Are the voltage rails ok?

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: arcenite
I seem to recall it being a common problem with SP2 and nforce2 mobos, so use this as an excuse to build a new rig I have an nforce2 rig in my family room running XP with no problems.

This IS my new rig. YOU finance my upgrade.

- M4H

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: kehi
M4H, what type of PSU are you using? Are the voltage rails ok?

Can't read without powering the system off, but it shouldn't be that. It was pulled from an IBM system powering a P4 2.4 and makes about the same juice as a Shuttle XPC. Seeing as I'm using the onboard video, I shouldn't be pulling more watts than this thing can spit out. It's about time I rebooted anyways to check.

- M4H

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Okay, PSU specs:

IBM OEM
+5v = 14A
+3.3v = 12A
+5vaux = 2A
+12v = 10A
-12v = 0.8A

It seems to be on the weak side - but it is an mATX PSU, and if it was the PSU, wouldn't I be unable to run Knoppix either?

Edit - And wouldn't P95 on "max in-place" have killed this thing off by now if it was a weak PSU? I'm going to fire up a defrag.

- M4H

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Just flashed the BIOS to 09/16/2004 from 07/14/2004 - let's see if that does anything.

- M4H

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Nothing. In fact, it wouldn't even make it past the XP splash screen.

Time to scrape up some spare parts and play Hot Potato with various components.

- M4H

 

[Raduque]

Biostar? Nope, both my boards are MSIs. First one was a K7N2G-L that I replaced because lightning fried a modem + PCI slot. The current board is a K7N2 Delta2 Platinum.

FWIW, my power rail readings are off also. My +12v reads in bios and windows progs at 11.30 or so, and the 3.3/5 are both under by about .20 Again, only on the nForce2 boards with this PSU, though. Other boards and this PSUs rails are dead-on. It's a 500w Topower w/aux connector. Haven't tried other PSUs on this board, as nothing else I have has the 4-pin aux 12v connector.

Good luck!

 

[ScrapSilicon]

1,2 or 3 sticks and what kind..? the 3 M7NCG-400s I've assembled(all running XP) ..2 are running a single 512 stick(Kingston)..the 3rd a pr of matching 256mb Infineon -6 sticks ..the 3rd had issues with centon paired with a nanya :roll: .. testing the same odd pr(centon/nanya ) on a albatron kxd18pro board..the pair appears stable there.. so far ..goodluck

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: ScrapSilicon
1,2 or 3 sticks and what kind..? the 3 M7NCG-400s I've assembled(all running XP) ..2 are running a single 512 stick(Kingston)..the 3rd a pr of matching 256mb Infineon -6 sticks ..the 3rd had issues with centon paired with a nanya :roll: .. testing the same odd pr(centon/nanya ) on a albatron kxd18pro board..the pair appears stable there.. so far ..goodluck

2x512MB Samsung OEM.

I think the problem is that the power supply is getting heatsoaked - it can't handle being the sole exhaust outlet, and the accrued heat makes it less and less efficient until it finally can't pump out the required wattage. I'll test that out later, and if so, it's time for an extremely-warranty-voiding deviation from ATX PSU spec.

- M4H

 

[ScrapSilicon]

it's time for an extremely-warranty-voiding deviation from ATX PSU spec.

heh..last week dealt with an LC 300(yeah..junk) that had only three of 6 sides still having sheetmetal ..had to put a fan in it

 

[Jeff7]

Did it just start doing this, or has it been this way since the system was built?


The M7NCG-400 has memory compatibility problems. Try a different brand.

Mine wouldn't work with GeIL Golden Dragon Value, but it did work with a stick of Buffalo RAM that wouldn't work at 200MHz on any other system. Oddly enough, it worked with the M7NCG-400.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: Jeff7
Did it just start doing this, or has it been this way since the system was built?


The M7NCG-400 has memory compatibility problems. Try a different brand.

Mine wouldn't work with GeIL Golden Dragon Value, but it did work with a stick of Buffalo RAM that wouldn't work at 200MHz on any other system. Oddly enough, it worked with the M7NCG-400.

It's always done this. And if the RAM was incompatible, wouldn't it have thrown a few dozen errors in Memtest and failed to run Knoppix?

I don't have any "spare RAM" either.

- M4H

 

[TStep]

I assume you are running the monitor via the onboard connection.

-Have you tried using an AGP card?

-It's been a long while since I've had an nForce2 IGP (8RGA+), but I recall having IGP overclocking adjustments in that bios that would foul the chipset up if pushed too far. Being unfamiliar with the Biostar, does it have any such settings in BIOS?

-Also, I was considering this board for a system buid, but never followed through. While researching it, I had found threads/reviews that stated using the IGP over fsb=166 caused alot of problems. Although rated 200(400), it's actually limited to 166(333) when using the IGP. Are you running over 166? Edit: missed it, 6x166

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire

Originally posted by: Jeff7
Did it just start doing this, or has it been this way since the system was built?


The M7NCG-400 has memory compatibility problems. Try a different brand.

Mine wouldn't work with GeIL Golden Dragon Value, but it did work with a stick of Buffalo RAM that wouldn't work at 200MHz on any other system. Oddly enough, it worked with the M7NCG-400.

It's always done this. And if the RAM was incompatible, wouldn't it have thrown a few dozen errors in Memtest and failed to run Knoppix?

I don't have any "spare RAM" either.

- M4H

Not necessarily. Memtest passed the GeIL RAM just fine, which helped make it such a tough case to solve. Knoppix booted fine too. However, a Linux Mandrake install wasn't able to finish.