update time - mobo/gpu - coming from gtx460se

[merk]

Hi All,

Upgrade bug has been biting me lately, so I'm going to give in an upgrade my system. Mainly upgrading for better gaming - the rest of the work i do on this PC is done in visual studio and works well enough for that.

Just wanted some suggestions for a mobo/gpu combo.

I'll probably keep the cpu i currently have, which is a i5 -2500 and a GTX 460 SE gpu.

As i said I'm mainly doing this to get better gaming performance. I figure i might as well upgrade the mobo as well since the newer vid cards are PCI-e 3.0x and my mobo only supports 2.x

I want to splurge a little bit on the GPU - i usually go middle of the road. This time I want to go high middle, or low high Maybe a GTX 670 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130787

Any suggestions for a motherboard to go with this? Or alternate suggestions for the video card?

 

[Termie]

Well, the truth is that you won't get one iota of improvement from replacing your motherboard. While PCIe 3.0 is worth 1-2% of increased performance on a high-end card, you can't get that with a Sandy Bridge processor. The motherboard will still operate at PCIe 2.1.

So, just drop in a new GPU and be happy you have another $100 or so to spend on it. The EVGA GTX670 FTW is a good card (I have it), but at this point in the model year, it's not a particularly good deal. For about the same price, I'd certainly recommend the Gigabyte HD7970 with 2 free games: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814125413

 

[merk]

I know i wont really see much difference between pci-e 2.x and 3.x now, just figured it would be worth doing the upgrade now.

But i guess if i can use it in my current mobo without any big difference in performance, i can also wait.

Why do you say though that the 670 isn't a good deal though? It's slightly less then the 7970 (although no free games) and from the benchmarks, it looks like it performs a little better - about 7%.

Although getting bioshock with the 7970 is making me lean towards it since i wanted that game anyhow.

Only reason I'm hessitant is i tend to think of nvidia boards being better/more reliable. Last time i had an ATI card it seemed a little flakey to me. but to be fair that was also several years ago - maybe close to a decade.

 

[mfenn]

I know i wont really see much difference between pci-e 2.x and 3.x now, just figured it would be worth doing the upgrade now.

That's not quite it. The PCIe bus on a Sandy Bridge and newer platform originates from the CPU, not the motherboard. So a new motherboard would only still only run at PCIe 2.x speeds. To get PCIe 3.0, you'd have to also upgrade to an Ivy Bridge processor, which is pointless because Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge are practically the same speed.

Why do you say though that the 670 isn't a good deal though? It's slightly less then the 7970 (although no free games) and from the benchmarks, it looks like it performs a little better - about 7%.

A GTX 670 basically the same price as a 7970 ($10 difference), but is a good bit slower on average. There are games where the GTX 670 is tied or very slightly ahead, but when the 7970 wins, it wins big. Add in free big games (not F2P credit), and the AMD is a no-brainer.

 

[merk]

The amd card is generally faster? I looked up some bench mark scores and it had the nvidia board as being the faster of the two, although not by that large of a margin. I'll have to do some more googling tomorrow and see if other benchmark sites say the same thing.

And thanks for pointing out the cpu as related to pci speeds. I wasn't aware of that.

 

[Termie]

The amd card is generally faster? I looked up some bench mark scores and it had the nvidia board as being the faster of the two, although not by that large of a margin. I'll have to do some more googling tomorrow and see if other benchmark sites say the same thing.

And thanks for pointing out the cpu as related to pci speeds. I wasn't aware of that.

The GTX670 was faster back in May of 2012, before a series of driver updates for both cards, which benefitted the 7970 more. Even the benchmarks mfenn linked from Anandtech are very out of date.

Trust me, the 7970 is faster than the GTX670. You don't have to Google it.

 

[merk]

Hmm, ok. In that case - think it's worth spending an extra $50 to get the overclocked version of that card?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814125439
Core clock is 1000 mhz vs 1100mhz and memory clock is 1375 vs 1500

Looks like the rest of the specs are the same - i'm leaning towards the cheaper of the two.

I'll probably have to pick up a new psu as well - i think my current psu is 450 watts and it's suggesting 550-600 for these cards.

 

[Termie]

Hmm, ok. In that case - think it's worth spending an extra $50 to get the overclocked version of that card?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814125439
Core clock is 1000 mhz vs 1100mhz and memory clock is 1375 vs 1500

Looks like the rest of the specs are the same - i'm leaning towards the cheaper of the two.

I personally do not think it is worth the extra $50 over the same design with the 1000MHz clock: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814125413

On the other hand, if you aren't that familiar with overclocking, you'll have guaranteed amazing performance with the higher cost model. It's up to you and how comfortable you are with tweaking. Truth is you won't really notice the extra speed in most cases.

 

[merk]

On the other hand, if you aren't that familiar with overclocking, you'll have guaranteed amazing performance with the higher cost model. It's up to you and how comfortable you are with tweaking. Truth is you won't really notice the extra speed in most cases.

I thought the whole point of the higher cost card was that I wouldn't need to do any tweaking of my own?

Generally speaking i don't usually bother overclocking anything. it seems like you can either overclock a little bit - and you wont really notice a difference, or overclock a lot but then have to worry about cooling/stability etc

Although I'm a little confused by your reply - since you said I'll have amazing performance with the overclocked card, but you also said I wont really notice the extra speed in most cases.

 

[Termie]

I thought the whole point of the higher cost card was that I wouldn't need to do any tweaking of my own?

Generally speaking i don't usually bother overclocking anything. it seems like you can either overclock a little bit - and you wont really notice a difference, or overclock a lot but then have to worry about cooling/stability etc

Although I'm a little confused by your reply - since you said I'll have amazing performance with the overclocked card, but you also said I wont really notice the extra speed in most cases.

Both cards will perform very well, and ultimately would have the exact same performance once overclocked. If you don't want to spend the time overclocking, the more expensive card will perform about 8% faster out of the box than the less expensive card. I don't think that's worth $50, but it may be to you if you just want to install it and know you're getting very close to the maximum potential performance from the card.

 

[mfenn]

Overclocking the GPU core and memory by 10% literally takes about 30 seconds. You open up CCC, go to the Overdrive section, check a box, and drag 3 sliders to the right. That's it.

 

[merk]

Overclocking the GPU core and memory by 10% literally take about 30 seconds. You open up CCC, go to the Overdrive section, check a box, and drag 3 sliders to the right. That's it.

hmm - well then i guess i might as well get the cheaper one and if i want to i can play with overclocking afterwards. Thanks

 

[aaksheytalwar]

It is like this

Stock 7950~stock 670, 670 might be a bit faster overall
Stock 7970~stock 680
Oced 7900 > oced 6xx oced
7970 ghz stock > oced 6xx
Oced 7970ghz > 6xx oced

Besides 7900s are more future proof and much better with newer titles especially at 1440p/1600p where they outperform even at stock.

A 7970 with a guaranteed oc can match or beat any oced 680. And same for the 7950 and 670 respectively. Infact an oced 7950>= stock 680

 

[Sleepingforest]

I'll be a little cautious and say that the 7970GHz editions are not necessarily binned any better than the normal 7970s, just clocked higher out of the factory. I'd also say that while the 7970 is definitely better than the 670, some are worse than some 680s when both are at their factory configuration (as manufacturers have varying built in overclocks). At any rate, if you are at all willing to overclock, the AMD 7XXX series is better than the Nvidia 6XX series.

 

[merk]

Thanks guys, I appreciated all the feedback from everyone. I think i'm going to go with the non-oc'ed 7970. It definitely seems worth it with the two games thrown in.

I'm just deciding (again) if i should replace the mobo. Turns out my friend wants to upgrade his pc. My PC would be an upgrade for what he has now. So I might upgrade everything on mine and then sell him my parts.

Does it matter what chipset I get in regards to the video card?

 

[merk]

http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=19204531

The parts i put together if i decide to do a full upgrade - I'll probably only go this route if my friend is willing to pay at least $400 for my old parts.

 

[Termie]

http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=19204531

The parts i put together if i decide to do a full upgrade - I'll probably only go this route if my friend is willing to pay at least $400 for my old parts.

Looks good, but don't buy the DDR3-2133 kit unless the sale is still on when you purchase it. At $135, it's not worth it, at $115, it's arguably a pretty good deal if you're into benchmarking.

Also, you picked the wrong CPU. You meant to get the 3570K, which is the same price as the 3570 right now after credit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819116504

Finally, the Corsair HX750 at $140 isn't a particularly good deal. I'd either go for the Seasonic X650 at $120 or this Seasonic Platinum 660 for $130AR: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151121

You don't need the extra wattage unless you're going to get a second 7970.

 

[merk]

What's the difference between the two cpu's? It just seems like one has better onboard graphics. I didn't get that one since it's $15 more (although you get a $15 gift card from newegg so i guess it's the same price in the end).

As for the PSU - thanks for pointing that out. I did actually mean to get a 650w psu. Not sure how i added that one in by mistake. I updated my list to include the seasonic x650 instead of the 750 corsair

 

[Termie]

What's the difference between the two cpu's? It just seems like one has better onboard graphics. I didn't get that one since it's $15 more (although you get a $15 gift card from newegg so i guess it's the same price in the end).

As for the PSU - thanks for pointing that out. I did actually mean to get a 650w psu. Not sure how i added that one in by mistake. I updated my list to include the seasonic x650 instead of the 750 corsair

The k models from Intel are unlocked to allow easy overclocking. The model you chose is limited to very slight overclocking past stock.

 

[merk]

Forgot to ask - for the memory, you suggest just getting the ddr3-1800 instead? If so, how does $104 for 16gb sound? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231615

And I'll switch the cpu to the K model. Thanks for your help.

 

[Termie]

Forgot to ask - for the memory, you suggest just getting the ddr3-1800 instead? If so, how does $104 for 16gb sound? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231615

And I'll switch the cpu to the K model. Thanks for your help.

That memory is a nice pick. I like that it's rated for 1.5v, which is optimal for the z77 platform, rather than 1.6v. I personally would get the Crucial DDR3-1600, 1.35v kit for $90, though:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820148663

Out of stock, unfortunately.

 

[merk]

That memory is a nice pick. I like that it's rated for 1.5v, which is optimal for the z77 platform, rather than 1.6v. I personally would get the Crucial DDR3-1600, 1.35v kit for $90, though:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820148663

Out of stock, unfortunately.

Just curious - why would you pick that memory? Just think it's a better value for the dollar?

 

[Termie]

Just curious - why would you pick that memory? Just think it's a better value for the dollar?

It can be overclocked to the same level of performance.

Also, you really only need 8GB at this point, so I can't really recommend paying a premium for 16GB.

If it's no more than twice the price of 8GB, it's not a bad deal, otherwise you could just upgrade later.

 

[merk]

I might actually be able to make use of 16gb - i do development work so i often have a ton of apps/browser tabs etc open. Often times I'll have those open in the background while taking a break playing a game.

I've got 8gb now and that does seem adequate. I'll have to check task manager/process monitor and just see how much memory i use at peak. If it's close to the 8gb mark i might as well spend the extra $50 i think and get 16gb.

Although as you say, i can always get 8 now and get 8 more later if need be. Only down side to doing that is i'll have all 4 slots filled with 4gb sticks. But i suppose if and when the time comes i need more then 16gb of ram, I'll probably be ready to upgrade the whole PC again anyhow

 

[merk]

One small update - i think i'll go with the non-k version of the cpu after all. The K version doesn't support all the options for running a virtual pc. The non-k version does.
http://ark.intel.com/products/65520/Intel-Core-i5-3570K-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_80-GHz?q=i5-3570

http://ark.intel.com/products/65702/Intel-Core-i5-3570-Processor-6M-Cache-3_40-GHz

Since i pretty much never bother overclocking, but i do sometimes make use of virtual computing, i think i'd get a little more bang for the buck with the non-k version.