UPDATE: BUSH COMMUTES LIBBY'S SENTENCE -Courts can't touch Libby.

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Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: sirjonk
Originally posted by: Craig234
No, because the judges, at least the honest ones not appointed from the Federalist Society right-wing machine trying to corrupt our judicial system, are acting based on justice and the law, while Bush overrides them based on political considerations - whether to reassure other 'loyalists' who put him above the American people, or to buy Libby's silence.

Actually, Judge Walton was appointed by Bush in 2001. King David could have presided over this trial. Libby was gonna walk no matter what.

I was discussing the suggestion of 'what if the judge sentenced him to no prison', and contrasting judges' agendas with the president's; and carving out an exception for my generalization about judges having an agenda of justice for the judges who are members of the Federalist Society who, IMO, have another agenda for our nation.

A quick search doesn't seem to indicate that Walton, or any of the three judges on the appeals court who denied Libby's appeal, are members of the Federalist Society, FYI.

(And none of the three were appointed by GWB).
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Think about it... the judge could have given Libby a sentance that involved no jail time, would that have been 'replacing the verdict of the jury'?

You mean like one of those "judical activisim" judges your neocons keep whining about? It's clear to me Bush has no respect for judges, no matter who appointed them or what sentences they hand down. After all the only thing that matters is that he is the "decider" and the country can go to hell if it suits his purposes. The only bright spot is that it doesn't seem to have far to go to get there.
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
126
Originally posted by: Phokus
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: ProfJohn
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: Phokus
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: ProfJohn
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: Phokus
Intersting quote from GWB when he was governer of Texas:

"I don't believe my role is to replace the verdict of a jury with my own," - George W. Bush on why he signed death warrants for 152 inmates as governor of Texas.</end quote></div>
Ummm he didn?t replace the verdict of the jury; he replaced the punishment of a judge.</end quote></div>

Yeah that's a huge leap, nonprofjohn.

Anyway, http://www.guardian.co.uk/usla...ry/0,,-6755010,00.html</end quote></div>
How is that a leap?
Think about it... the judge could have given Libby a sentance that involved no jail time, would that have been 'replacing the verdict of the jury'?</end quote></div>

There's this thing called sentencing guidelines. Might want to look it up.


And one more thing, the MAXIMUM libby could have gotten was 25 years and a $1,000,000 fine. To say this sentence was too harsh is ridiculous.
 

Linux23

Lifer
Apr 9, 2000
11,333
705
126
I do have to give Bush credit for something. He has some set of Balls on him. :D
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
126
Originally posted by: Linux23
I do have to give Bush credit for something. He has some set of Balls on him. :D

For his next trick, he will perform an abortion on live television while pleging his allegiance to Al Quaeda while miraculously not yet dropping to nixon level approval ratings.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,335
126
Well this is great. You have Republicans applauding this, making excuses for libby and saying that lieing is no big deal. You have Democrats "outraged" that someone that lied gets off so easy. Reminds me of the Clinton days, just reverse the reactions of the Repubs and Dems. Yet another shining example of why both parties are full of hypocrites.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
Originally posted by: JD50
Well this is great. You have Republicans applauding this, making excuses for libby and saying that lieing is no big deal. You have Democrats "outraged" that someone that lied gets off so easy. Reminds me of the Clinton days, just reverse the reactions of the Repubs and Dems. Yet another shining example of why both parties are full of hypocrites.

I don't see how it's a perfect analogy.

While it's undeniable that Clinton lied, it's not so clear in Libby's case. While I don't claim to know if Libby did or did not lie, it's certainly plausible that he actually did not remember correctly the details of conversations, or that Russert himself may have gotten it wrong.

Furthermore, a lie requires intent. So in addition to being incorrect (again, which I don't know) one must assume a nefarious motive for the "incorrectness".

Fern
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: JD50
Well this is great. You have Republicans applauding this, making excuses for libby and saying that lieing is no big deal. You have Democrats "outraged" that someone that lied gets off so easy. Reminds me of the Clinton days, just reverse the reactions of the Repubs and Dems. Yet another shining example of why both parties are full of hypocrites.

There's a big difference, well several, but one is that the judicial system was used for Clinton, and he got his punishment, while the judicial system's punishment for Libby was overturned.

The fact that Libby's punishment was more severe, reflecting anything from the several counts and multiple offenses, to the seriousness of the effects of his lies, is not the issue.

It's just a pleasant surprise that a Bush-appointed attorney and a Bush-appointed judge had the integrity to act as they did on the Libby matter.

I wonder what the story is there - if what's coming out now about the Bushies pressuring Ashcroft to approve torture in his hospital room made him appoint a 'real' investigator.

We do know he was soon replaced by a Bush crony, Alberto Gonzales, who is happy to do the dirty work.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Originally posted by: JD50
Well this is great. You have Republicans applauding this, making excuses for libby and saying that lieing is no big deal. You have Democrats "outraged" that someone that lied gets off so easy. Reminds me of the Clinton days, just reverse the reactions of the Repubs and Dems. Yet another shining example of why both parties are full of hypocrites.
Not so fast. I think you'll find there are a lot of "Democrats" (i.e., people who oppose Bush) who also criticized Clinton for lying. I'm on the record here as saying Clinton was both wrong and stupid for lying. What he should have done is either cave immediately and confess the whole thing -- the right choice -- or stand up and say "It's none of your damn business."

That said, I also acknowledged it's not surprising he lied. Everyone lies about sex, even consensual sex between adults, and the question should never have been asked in the first place. It was nobody's business except Hillary's. I've also blasted the Republicans for their $70M witch-hunt. It showed a total lack of respect for the public interest and the taxpayers' money. On the bright side, I guess, they created a whole generation of young women who are much more accepting of oral sex, having been bombarded with reminders about it every night on the news. I'm not sure how those Repubs reconcile that with their self-professed "family values" platform, but what do you expect from politicians?

Finally, I would suggest it's preposterous to in any way suggest there's a reasonable comparison between lying about a private sex act and lying to obstruct the investigation in the outing of an undercover CIA operative specialing in WMDs during a "war" about WMDs. One is purely partisan, tabloid material; the other a potential threat to national security. While there may be a touch of hypocrisy on the part of Clinton loyalists, it is flaming hypocrisy by the Bush apologists.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Originally posted by: Fern
Originally posted by: JD50
Well this is great. You have Republicans applauding this, making excuses for libby and saying that lieing is no big deal. You have Democrats "outraged" that someone that lied gets off so easy. Reminds me of the Clinton days, just reverse the reactions of the Repubs and Dems. Yet another shining example of why both parties are full of hypocrites.
I don't see how it's a perfect analogy.

While it's undeniable that Clinton lied, it's not so clear in Libby's case. While I don't claim to know if Libby did or did not lie, it's certainly plausible that he actually did not remember correctly the details of conversations, or that Russert himself may have gotten it wrong.

Furthermore, a lie requires intent. So in addition to being incorrect (again, which I don't know) one must assume a nefarious motive for the "incorrectness".

Fern
Wow. Speaking of apologists.
 

UberNeuman

Lifer
Nov 4, 1999
16,937
3,087
126
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: Fern
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: JD50
Well this is great. You have Republicans applauding this, making excuses for libby and saying that lieing is no big deal. You have Democrats "outraged" that someone that lied gets off so easy. Reminds me of the Clinton days, just reverse the reactions of the Repubs and Dems. Yet another shining example of why both parties are full of hypocrites.</end quote></div>
I don't see how it's a perfect analogy.

While it's undeniable that Clinton lied, it's not so clear in Libby's case. While I don't claim to know if Libby did or did not lie, it's certainly plausible that he actually did not remember correctly the details of conversations, or that Russert himself may have gotten it wrong.

Furthermore, a lie requires intent. So in addition to being incorrect (again, which I don't know) one must assume a nefarious motive for the "incorrectness".

Fern</end quote></div>
Wow. Speaking of apologists.

More like a shining example of cognitive dissonance....

 

BMW540I6speed

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2005
1,055
0
0
Happy Birthday, America...

The President who once bemoaned "activist judges" has now himself become our nation's most powerful activist judge.

Mr. President, thank you so, so much for making us all proud to be americans!

Your commuting of Libby's sentence really helps us to hold our heads up high, in the face of corrput and vicous despots around the world.

No doubt they are all learning lessons about democracy, the rule of law and the greatness of America.

What a wonderful gift you have given us Americans - and the rest of the world - right in time for our "independence day" celebration.

Thanks again, Mr. President.

A Potential Partial Solution:

One way to check these sorts of abuses on the part of the Executive Branch is to amend the Constitution to limit the President's power to issue pardons and commutations. The Founders considered impeachment the corrective to such abuses, but it's clear from their writings they thought that remedy would be easier to implement, as well as more common than it has turned out to be in practice.

Anyway,

1. The President shall not have the power to pardon any party for any crime committed for which said party has not been convicted in a court of law.

2. The President shall not have the power to pardon any party for any crime for which said party has been convicted in a court of law during the President's tenure of office.

3. The President shall not have the power to commute the sentence for any criminal conviction issued by a court of law during the President's tenure of office, except in instances where the sentence is death, where the President may stay the execution of the convicted party for the duration of the President's tenure of office.

And this, an additional clause in honor of (pardon the choice of words) Elliott Abrams:

4. Any party convicted of a felony crime in a court of law shall be permanently barred from employ by the federal government, even if said party has been granted a pardon for the crime by the President.

Presidents should not be allowed to hold "get out of jail free" cards for members of their Administration. It's an invitation for corruption.




 

Hacp

Lifer
Jun 8, 2005
13,923
2
81
I don't see how it's a perfect analogy.

While it's undeniable that Clinton lied, it's not so clear in Libby's case. While I don't claim to know if Libby did or did not lie, it's certainly plausible that he actually did not remember correctly the details of conversations, or that Russert himself may have gotten it wrong.

Furthermore, a lie requires intent. So in addition to being incorrect (again, which I don't know) one must assume a nefarious motive for the "incorrectness".

So are you saying that even though a jury convicted him of perjury, he didn't actually do it? He was just an innocent victim, framed by the liberal media, out to find someone to blame for the war in Iraq?

Give it a break. I'm sure Libby's lawyers were smart enough to think of this. It didn't or wouldn't have held its own in court, and thats that.
 

BMW540I6speed

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2005
1,055
0
0
Bowfinger said:
Wow. Speaking of apologists.

Indeed...

Core facts:

CIA in Republican administration complains about leak to Republican attorney general, who appoints highly respected Republican prosecutor, who investigates and brings charges in court presided over by Republican-appointed judge (appointed, in fact, by the sitting President). Jury that all observers agree was highly thoughtful and careful in its deliberations votes unanimously to convict on several charges.

But they accuse those of us who think Libby should be held accountable as adhering to an "assigned posture's in this drama."

The truth, of course, is just the opposite:

The "assigned posture" of conservative pundits is to portray anyone who advocates applying the normal rule of law to Libby's case as a raving partsan loon.




 

IGBT

Lifer
Jul 16, 2001
17,960
140
106


Pardons granted by President Clinton (1993-2001)...







Text


David Phillip Aronsohn D. Minn. 1961 Failure to pay special occupational tax on wagering, 26 U.S.C. § 7203
Wanda Kaye Bain-Prentice D. Ariz. 1982 Mail fraud, 18 U.S.C. § 1341
Antonio Barucco U. S. Army general court-martial 1945 Desertion in violation of the 58th Article of War
Kristine Margo Beck D. Idaho 1981 Bank embezzlement, 18 U.S.C. § 656
David Christopher Billmaier D. New Mex. 1980 Possession with intent to distribute amphetamines, 21 U.S.C. § 841(a)(1)
Terry Lee Brown E. D. Ky. 1962 Interstate transportation of a stolen motor vehicle, 18 U.S.C. § 2312
Joe Carl Bruton N. D. Tex. 1979 Conspiracy to commit mail fraud, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Nolan Lynn DeMarce W. D. Wis. 1983 Making false statements to obtain bank loans, 18 U.S.C. § 1014
Jimmy C. Dick N. D. Calif. 1976 Conspiracy to manufacture counterfeit Federal Reserve Notes, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Edward Eugene Dishman W. D. Okla. 1983 Conspiracy to defraud the United States and Oklahoma counties, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Brenda Kay Engle S. D. Ind. 1983 Conspiracy to commit theft from interstate shipment, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Mary Theresa Fajer D. Oregon 1980 Conspiracy to commit bank embezzlement, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2 and 371
Albert James Forte D. Dist. Col. 1973 Making and subscribing false and fraudulent income tax return, 26 U.S.C. § 7206(1)
Fendley Lee Frazier S. D. Ala. 1965 Interstate transportation of a stolen motor vehicle, 18 U.S.C. § 2312
Robert Linward Freeland, Jr. N. D. Ind. 1983 Forcible rescue of seized property, 26 U.S.C. § 7212(b)
Ralph Leon Furst S. D. Calif. 1966 Embezzlement of United States mail (U.S. Code section not cited)
Barbara Ann Gericke W. D. Wis. 1984 Conspiracy to introduce contraband into federal prison, 18 U.S.C. §§ 371 and 1791
Billy Joe Gilmore N. D. Tex. 1982 Mail fraud and aiding and abetting, 18 U.S.C. §§ 1341 and 2
Loreto Joseph Iafrate N. D. W. Va. 1976 Failure to record receipt of firearms, 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(m) and 924(a)
Carl Bruce Jones W. D. Mo. 1983 Distribution of marijuana and use of telephone to facilitate marijuana distribution, 18 U.S.C. § 2 and 21 U.S.C. §§ 841(a)(1) and 843(b)
Candace Deon Leverenz N. D. Calif. 1972 Unlawful distribution of LSD, 21 U.S.C. §§ 841(a)(1) and (b)(1)(B)
George William Lindgren S. D. N. Y. 1975 Bank embezzlement, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Brian George Meierkord C. D. Ill. 1983 Making false statement to bank, 18 U.S.C. § 1014
Jackie Lee Miller N. D. Okla. 1983 Conspiracy to defraud the United States, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Joseph Patrick Naulty E. D. Pa. 1980 Carrying away goods moving as part of foreign shipment, 18 U.S.C. § 659
Theodore Roosevelt Noel N. D. Ala. 1972 Selling whiskey in unstamped containers and making false statement in the acquisition of firearms from licensed dealer, 26 U.S.C. § 5604(a)(1) and 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(a)(6) and 924(a)
Mary Louise Oaks M. D. La. 1979 Conspiracy to defraud the government with respect to claims, 18 U.S.C. § 286
Robert Paul Padelsky D. Utah 1980 Misapplication of bank funds, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Elizabeth Amy Peterson D. Nev. 1985 Conspiracy to make false statements to bank, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Susan Lauranne Prather W. D. Ark. 1975 Causing marijuana to be transported through the mail, 21 U.S.C. § 843(b)
Gary Lynn Quammen W. D. Wis. 1976 Misapplication of bank funds, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Robert Ronal Raymond D. Conn. 1972 Conspiracy to manufacture, receive, possess, and sell firearms silencers, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Elizabeth Hogg Rushing N. D. Ga. 1978 Misapplication of bank funds, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Marc Alan Schaffer S. D. N. Y. 1968 Submission of false statements to Selective Service System Local Board, 50 U.S.C. Appendix § 462(a)
Roy Aaron Smith E. D. Tex. 1982 Misprision of a felony, 18 U.S.C. § 4
Diane Dorothea Smunk D. So. Dak. 1984 Embezzlement by government employee, 18 U.S.C. § 641
Thomas Peter Stathakis D. So. Car. 1976 Selling and delivering firearms to out-of-state resident and falsifying firearms records, 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(b)(3), 922(m), and 924(a)
Kathleen Vacanti C. D. Calif. 1979 Conspiracy to defraud the United States by obtaining payment of false claims, presenting false claims to the United States, forging a writing, and aiding and abetting, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2, 286, 287, and 495
Pupi White W. D. Mo. 1985 Making false statement on United States passport application, 18 U.S.C. § 911
Charles Coleman Wicker E. D. Mo. 1975 Conspiracy to conduct illegal gambling business, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Roderick Douglas Woods S. D. Miss. 1982 Misappropriation of bank funds and aiding and abetting, 18 U.S.C. §§ 656 and 2
 

Hacp

Lifer
Jun 8, 2005
13,923
2
81
Text


David Phillip Aronsohn D. Minn. 1961 Failure to pay special occupational tax on wagering, 26 U.S.C. § 7203
Wanda Kaye Bain-Prentice D. Ariz. 1982 Mail fraud, 18 U.S.C. § 1341
Antonio Barucco U. S. Army general court-martial 1945 Desertion in violation of the 58th Article of War
Kristine Margo Beck D. Idaho 1981 Bank embezzlement, 18 U.S.C. § 656
David Christopher Billmaier D. New Mex. 1980 Possession with intent to distribute amphetamines, 21 U.S.C. § 841(a)(1)
Terry Lee Brown E. D. Ky. 1962 Interstate transportation of a stolen motor vehicle, 18 U.S.C. § 2312
Joe Carl Bruton N. D. Tex. 1979 Conspiracy to commit mail fraud, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Nolan Lynn DeMarce W. D. Wis. 1983 Making false statements to obtain bank loans, 18 U.S.C. § 1014
Jimmy C. Dick N. D. Calif. 1976 Conspiracy to manufacture counterfeit Federal Reserve Notes, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Edward Eugene Dishman W. D. Okla. 1983 Conspiracy to defraud the United States and Oklahoma counties, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Brenda Kay Engle S. D. Ind. 1983 Conspiracy to commit theft from interstate shipment, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Mary Theresa Fajer D. Oregon 1980 Conspiracy to commit bank embezzlement, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2 and 371
Albert James Forte D. Dist. Col. 1973 Making and subscribing false and fraudulent income tax return, 26 U.S.C. § 7206(1)
Fendley Lee Frazier S. D. Ala. 1965 Interstate transportation of a stolen motor vehicle, 18 U.S.C. § 2312
Robert Linward Freeland, Jr. N. D. Ind. 1983 Forcible rescue of seized property, 26 U.S.C. § 7212(b)
Ralph Leon Furst S. D. Calif. 1966 Embezzlement of United States mail (U.S. Code section not cited)
Barbara Ann Gericke W. D. Wis. 1984 Conspiracy to introduce contraband into federal prison, 18 U.S.C. §§ 371 and 1791
Billy Joe Gilmore N. D. Tex. 1982 Mail fraud and aiding and abetting, 18 U.S.C. §§ 1341 and 2
Loreto Joseph Iafrate N. D. W. Va. 1976 Failure to record receipt of firearms, 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(m) and 924(a)
Carl Bruce Jones W. D. Mo. 1983 Distribution of marijuana and use of telephone to facilitate marijuana distribution, 18 U.S.C. § 2 and 21 U.S.C. §§ 841(a)(1) and 843(b)
Candace Deon Leverenz N. D. Calif. 1972 Unlawful distribution of LSD, 21 U.S.C. §§ 841(a)(1) and (b)(1)(B)
George William Lindgren S. D. N. Y. 1975 Bank embezzlement, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Brian George Meierkord C. D. Ill. 1983 Making false statement to bank, 18 U.S.C. § 1014
Jackie Lee Miller N. D. Okla. 1983 Conspiracy to defraud the United States, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Joseph Patrick Naulty E. D. Pa. 1980 Carrying away goods moving as part of foreign shipment, 18 U.S.C. § 659
Theodore Roosevelt Noel N. D. Ala. 1972 Selling whiskey in unstamped containers and making false statement in the acquisition of firearms from licensed dealer, 26 U.S.C. § 5604(a)(1) and 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(a)(6) and 924(a)
Mary Louise Oaks M. D. La. 1979 Conspiracy to defraud the government with respect to claims, 18 U.S.C. § 286
Robert Paul Padelsky D. Utah 1980 Misapplication of bank funds, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Elizabeth Amy Peterson D. Nev. 1985 Conspiracy to make false statements to bank, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Susan Lauranne Prather W. D. Ark. 1975 Causing marijuana to be transported through the mail, 21 U.S.C. § 843(b)
Gary Lynn Quammen W. D. Wis. 1976 Misapplication of bank funds, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Robert Ronal Raymond D. Conn. 1972 Conspiracy to manufacture, receive, possess, and sell firearms silencers, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Elizabeth Hogg Rushing N. D. Ga. 1978 Misapplication of bank funds, 18 U.S.C. § 656
Marc Alan Schaffer S. D. N. Y. 1968 Submission of false statements to Selective Service System Local Board, 50 U.S.C. Appendix § 462(a)
Roy Aaron Smith E. D. Tex. 1982 Misprision of a felony, 18 U.S.C. § 4
Diane Dorothea Smunk D. So. Dak. 1984 Embezzlement by government employee, 18 U.S.C. § 641
Thomas Peter Stathakis D. So. Car. 1976 Selling and delivering firearms to out-of-state resident and falsifying firearms records, 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(b)(3), 922(m), and 924(a)
Kathleen Vacanti C. D. Calif. 1979 Conspiracy to defraud the United States by obtaining payment of false claims, presenting false claims to the United States, forging a writing, and aiding and abetting, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2, 286, 287, and 495
Pupi White W. D. Mo. 1985 Making false statement on United States passport application, 18 U.S.C. § 911
Charles Coleman Wicker E. D. Mo. 1975 Conspiracy to conduct illegal gambling business, 18 U.S.C. § 371
Roderick Douglas Woods S. D. Miss. 1982 Misappropriation of bank funds and aiding and abetting, 18 U.S.C. §§ 656 and 2


Another croney trying to detract the thread. If we had kept using past standards to justify current wrongdoings, slavery would still exist today.
 

GrGr

Diamond Member
Sep 25, 2003
3,204
0
76
The vast majority of the pro-Libby commute/soon to be pardon posts are "but Clinton" nonsense.

 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Hopefully this ends this nut's campaign right here and now:

7-3-2007Romney defends Bush decision on Libby

Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney, who as Massachusetts governor refused to pardon an Iraq war veteran's BB-gun conviction, on Tuesday called President Bush's commutation of Scooter Libby's prison sentence "reasonable."

During the four years Romney was in office, 100 requests for commutations and 172 requests for pardons were filed in the state. All were denied.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,899
7,428
136
arrogance. 100% pure, unadulterated, in-your-face, elitist arrogance. this treachery committed against the common people of this nation has set a new standard for what is and will always be the hallmark of g.w. bush's legacy: the pawn who crowned himself king.

i give credit where credit is due; 'ol dubyuh and cheney are consistent. as recent events have shown, both of them are sneeringly, condescendingly, imperiously and egotistically consistent in their outright contempt of the will of the people and the laws of our land.

it's quite plain to see now that serving the people of this great nation was the last thing on their minds as they strategized to acquire the reins of power over us so many years ago.

it's also quite obvious now that when bush and cheney took their oaths of office, they were swearing allegiance only to themselves and their cronies and not to the nation they supposedly serve. they have outed themselves as opportunists and profiteers preying on the trust and reverence we deservedly bestow on those high offices.

commuting libby's jail sentence is just bush and cheney delivering another contemptuous slap to the faces of what they perceive to be as the ignorant and irritating peasants that they rule over while spitting on the bill of rights and the constitution that the rest of us have to protect, cherish and live by.

for over six years now they have been flaunting the power they invested within themselves through the shrewd use of signing statements and interpretations of laws provided by a laptog AG that was programmed to serve the administration and not the people.

despicable. shame on us for turning these pompous self-righteous charlatans loose on our nation.

never again, please.
 

IGBT

Lifer
Jul 16, 2001
17,960
140
106
Originally posted by: tweaker2
arrogance. 100% pure, unadulterated, in-your-face, elitist arrogance. this treachery committed against the common people of this nation has set a new standard for what is and will always be the hallmark of g.w. bush's legacy: the pawn who crowned himself king.

i give credit where credit is due; 'ol dubyuh and cheney are consistent. as recent events have shown, both of them are sneeringly, condescendingly, imperiously and egotistically consistent in their outright contempt of the will of the people and the laws of our land.

it's quite plain to see now that serving the people of this great nation was the last thing on their minds as they strategized to acquire the reins of power over us so many years ago.

it's also quite obvious now that when bush and cheney took their oaths of office, they were swearing allegiance only to themselves and their cronies and not to the nation they supposedly serve. they have outed themselves as opportunists and profiteers preying on the trust and reverence we deservedly bestow on those high offices.

commuting libby's jail sentence is just bush and cheney delivering another contemptuous slap to the faces of what they perceive to be as the ignorant and irritating peasants that they rule over while spitting on the bill of rights and the constitution that the rest of us have to protect, cherish and live by.

for over six years now they have been flaunting the power they invested within themselves through the shrewd use of signing statements and interpretations of laws provided by a laptog AG that was programmed to serve the administration and not the people.

despicable. shame on us for turning these pompous self-righteous charlatans loose on our nation.

never again, please.


..and furthermore your president won't rule out a full pardon. so start thinking of another paragraph of diatribe and ire. this is far from over.
 

CallMeJoe

Diamond Member
Jul 30, 2004
6,938
5
81
I don't see where the outrage is coming from. Scooter is being severely punished. His legal defense fund will have to pay a $250K fine, and his conviction bars him from continuing his career until after his pardon. Until then, he'll be forced to support himself doing $10K speaking engagements, and shilling on Faux News. Can you imagine a more demeaning fate?
 

GrGr

Diamond Member
Sep 25, 2003
3,204
0
76
Libby will be pardoned no question. This is just par for the course with this White House. Elliot Abrams is a convicted felon too. Why Libby should just get back to work for his masters asap.



 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,338
1,215
126
Originally posted by: Hacp

Another croney trying to detract the thread. If we had kept using past standards to justify current wrongdoings, slavery would still exist today.


A few of Dubya's biggest critics are the ones involved with past presidentional pardons.

Isn't Dubya pretty low on the number of pardons and commutations list as compared with past administrations?
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
126
Originally posted by: CallMeJoe
I don't see where the outrage is coming from. Scooter is being severely punished. His legal defense fund will have to pay a $250K fine, and his conviction bars him from continuing his career until after his pardon. Until then, he'll be forced to support himself doing $10K speaking engagements, and shilling on Faux News. Can you imagine a more demeaning fate?

Didn't they raise millions for his defense? Somehow, i don't think he'll be living on the streets when all is said and done.
 

CallMeJoe

Diamond Member
Jul 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: Phokus
Didn't they raise millions for his defense? Somehow, i don't think he'll be living on the streets when all is said and done.
Sorry, I forgot the [sarcasm] tag. I forget to tag it, since it was my first language.