Unintended Consequence of Wal-Mart's Raise: Unhappy Workers

Nov 8, 2012
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Bwahahaha I love it. The consequences of giving random raises for no reason to people that have no reason to deserve it: Instead of fighting the top of the food chain, they fight in the cage they are in with eachother. Great ideas ol' chap! :thumbsup:

This is why you don't do min wage hikes for no reason at a company when it isn't justified. You have people getting raises that don't deserve it after others fought by slaving and working extra hours for it.

This just goes to show what the whole raising wages has and ALWAYS is about.... "The Jones are making more money than me! That's bullshit I should be making that much! I can't even afford an iPhone 6 yet!"

When Wal-Mart Stores Inc. chief Doug McMillon announced plans to boost store workers’ minimum wage earlier this year, he said the move was intended to improve morale and retain employees.

Debate over minimum wage increase heats up CBS MoneyWatch
Yet for some of the hundreds of thousands of workers getting no raise, the policy is having the opposite effect.

In interviews and in hundreds of comments on Facebook, Wal-Mart employees are calling the move unfair to senior workers who got no increase and now make the same or close to what newer, less experienced colleagues earn. New workers started making a minimum of $9 an hour in April and will get at least $10 an hour in February.

“It is pitting people against each other,” said Charmaine Givens-Thomas, a 10-year veteran who makes $12 an hour at a store near Chicago and belongs to OUR Walmart, a union-backed group that has lobbied for better working conditions. “It hurts morale when people feel like they aren’t being appreciated. I hear people every day talking about looking for other jobs and wanting to remove themselves from Wal-Mart and a job that will make them feel like that.”

Some workers also said they suspect their hours are being cut and annual raises reduced to cover the cost of the wage increase for newer workers. Wal-Mart denies that and says it’s taking steps to ensure all employees have an opportunity to move into higher-paying jobs. Along with bumping up the minimum wage, it increased the amount workers receive when promoted, boosted pay for some managers and raised the maximum pay for all hourly positions.

Wage Inequality
Several U.S. retailers have raised the minimum wage for their workers in recent months, among them Gap Inc., TJX Cos. and Target Corp. The moves were widely hailed amid calls to combat wage inequality -- an issue that even reached the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission, which on Wednesday voted to force companies to reveal the pay gap between the chief executive officer and their typical worker.

However, if Wal-Mart and other retailers don’t also adjust pay for veteran hourly workers, they could face rising dissent, said David Cooper, an economic analyst at the Economic Policy Institute. Typically, when employers boost their base pay, they also give raises to those making within $1 to $2 of the new minimum to preserve a type of wage hierarchy and keep their longer-time workers happy, studies show.

“Companies want to preserve some type of internal wage ladder, so to do that they have to adjust wages of folks above the new minimum,” Cooper said. If Wal-Mart doesn’t raise wages for these workers, “folks are going to leave or start complaining more vocally,” he said.

Feeling Disenfranchised
Executives knew the minimum wage hike would make those left out feel disenfranchised, said Kristin Oliver, Wal-Mart’s U.S. human resources chief. Since then, the company has been hearing from upset employees and understands that the new wage policy could lead to increased turnover, she said.

In an attempt to retain workers who didn’t get a raise, Wal-Mart has changed its scheduling system to help workers get the hours they want and started a new training program for employees looking to advance within the company. Wal-Mart announced the scheduling changes as well as a new training program at the same time as the wage increase to address the different needs of its workers, Wal-Mart spokesman Kory Lundberg said.

“We are constantly looking and evolving what the right pay should be and we were aware of the issue,” Oliver said. “We weren’t prepared to go forward with any additional increases but have continued to look at it to see if there is something else we should do for those in the middle.”

Giving additional raises to employees already making close to the new minimum wage would cost Wal-Mart about $400 million, said Jeannette Wicks-Lim, an assistant research professor at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst. She based her calculation on raises the retail industry has handed out after past increases to state and federal minimum wages. Wal-Mart declined to comment on her calculation.

Strain Profits
Additional pay bumps could put further strain on profits, which Wal-Mart said last quarter were dragged down by the $1 billion it’s already spending on raises. Last year, the Bentonville, Arkansas-based chain generated $486 billion in annual sales and a profit of about $16 billion.

Wal-Mart has said about 500,000 of its 1.3 million U.S. employees are getting raises as part of the new pay policy and all employees will be able to benefit from the new scheduling and training programs.

“We are trying to create a situation where they have a path to higher paying positions over time,” Oliver said.

Still, that hasn’t been the takeaway for many workers.

Sal Fuentes, who makes $13 an hour operating a forklift overnights at a Wal-Mart in Duarte, California, said he expects the company to give out lower raises to him and other senior employees to compensate for the cost of raising pay for the newer employees.

Talent Competition
“There is always some way they get the money back,” said Fuentes, who has worked at the company since 2006 and is a member of OUR Walmart. “They give you some but they are taking away something else. It has always been like that.”

While employers may think raising wages will help them compete for talent, research shows workers care more about how much a colleague is making than someone at another company.

“Workers appear to pay attention to peer wages,” said Laura Giuliano, an associate professor of economics at the University of Miami who has studied the issue. “Even a small difference can matter, and whether or not it is going to matter may well depend on whether it appears arbitrary or unfair.”

Givens-Thomas said she was happy to see her colleagues getting a raise and thinks it’s a sign Wal-Mart is moving in the right direction. Still, she said the new wage policy is bittersweet; Givens-Thomas recently moved in with her mother because she couldn’t afford her rent.

“I am impressed that they are even trying to raise the wages -- I know it has been hard for them,” she said. “I would like to continue to see pay go up because it has been stagnant for so many years and people are really suffering.”

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/unintended-consequence-wal-marts-raise-150726331.html
 

OverVolt

Lifer
Aug 31, 2002
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The same thing happened at that credit processing company that set the $70k minimum wage apparently.

I can't imagine an immediate manager makes much more than $15/hr and had put alot of sweat into getting there in a Wal-Mart type environment and the new cashier who just walked in the door now gets that. They probably need him more than they realize and he is probably like screw this I'm going to go back to being a cashier and then there is nobody who gives a shit there anymore. And I think anybody in a walmart who gave a shit was probably a gold nugget in the rough to begin with.
 

maddogchen

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2004
8,903
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hungry dogs, throw them a bone and they'll rip each other to shreds getting it.

but the key question is, why do you keep a pack of hungry dogs?
 
Nov 8, 2012
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hungry dogs, throw them a bone and they'll rip each other to shreds getting it.

but the key question is, why do you keep a pack of hungry dogs?

It's "Keeping up with the Jones" syndrome ingrained in the american society. You could toss in 50lbs of brisket in the cage and it's still never enough
 

Bock

Senior member
Mar 28, 2013
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You aren't that observant are you?

The problem isn't that new employees got more, it's that the walmart lifers didn't get their pay adjusted upwards as well.

iirc, the skilled positions at walmart & distributors actually pay decent.
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
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You post an article about unhappy employees who didn't get raises being angry they didn't get them...but somehow conclude the opposite happened.

Oh, I get it now, you're reading impaired.
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,842
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You post an article about unhappy employees who didn't get raises being angry they didn't get them...but somehow conclude the opposite happened.

Oh, I get it now, you're reading impaired.

You aren't that observant are you?

The problem isn't that new employees got more, it's that the walmart lifers didn't get their pay adjusted upwards as well.

iirc, the skilled positions at walmart & distributors actually pay decent.



What are you not understanding here? Oh, I guess all of it.

In interviews and in hundreds of comments on Facebook, Wal-Mart employees are calling the move unfair to senior workers who got no increase and now make the same or close to what newer, less experienced colleagues earn. New workers started making a minimum of $9 an hour in April and will get at least $10 an hour in February.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
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What are you not understanding here? Oh, I guess all of it.

Can you show us where walmart employees are unhappy with their raise? Or is the only thing you can show us is that they are unhappy that others didn't get a raise. There is a difference, do you understand that difference?
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
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What are you not understanding here? Oh, I guess all of it.

the-derp-is-strong-with-this-one.jpg
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,842
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You post an article about unhappy employees who didn't get raises being angry they didn't get them...but somehow conclude the opposite happened.

Oh, I get it now, you're reading impaired.

Can you show us where walmart employees are unhappy with their raise? Or is the only thing you can show us is that they are unhappy that others didn't get a raise. There is a difference, do you understand that difference?

Yeah, apparently you are having some major brain malfunctions around here. The entire topic of discussion is how raising the wages for some (namely, starting empyloyee's) has completely pissed off their senior members. That was (and is) the entire basis of discussion.

If you couldn't tell from my post mentioning things such as "Keeping up with the Jones" and tossing a scrap of meat in the Lion's cage, you are clearly having severe mental issues.

But then again, I guess that is why you both vote the way you do :awe:
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
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So Walmart raises their minimum wage a significant amount, but that bumps up only the bottom. Those previously above the bottom are now at the bottom again. The difference is they have the years, experience, and marketability to go elsewhere. Which leaves Walmart in a vacuum where those that weren't at the bottom but were getting paid better than the bottom because of their skills and experience are now leaving.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
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Can you show us where walmart employees are unhappy with their raise? Or is the only thing you can show us is that they are unhappy that others didn't get a raise. There is a difference, do you understand that difference?

Oh the ones getting the raise are happy. The ones that were already at that level previous from having worked their time, and improved their skillset and experience level are now at the "bottom" with those that got a free raise up. Those employee in that position are going to be upset if they don't get a raise as well to differentiate their improved marketability over those at the bottom.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
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So the lesson is don't give your employees pay raises or is it, pay all of your employees well and you will have better morale and better retention?

Apparently walmart doesn't know how to take care of it's employees but the OP would rather blame the employees. Interesting.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
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Oh the ones getting the raise are happy. The ones that were already at that level previous from having worked their time, and improved their skillset and experience level are now at the "bottom" with those that got a free raise up. Those employee in that position are going to be upset if they don't get a raise as well to differentiate their improved marketability over those at the bottom.

Yep and I said as much.
 

Mxylplyx

Diamond Member
Mar 21, 2007
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I bet many conservatives would have trouble sleeping at night if they knew some walmart cashier or fast food worker wasn't struggling to pay the rent every month.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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Democrats make life harder.

It is hard to be happy about a job that Wal-mart only lets you work for 20 hours a week in fear of having to pay for your Obama care. This is the reality that was created by full government control of your health care. There is more pain and suffering to come.
 

Strk

Lifer
Nov 23, 2003
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I bet many conservatives would have trouble sleeping at night if they knew some walmart cashier or fast food worker wasn't struggling to pay the rent every month.

I don't think they mind that part. It's the using government assistance because they aren't paid a decent wage by a profitable company that is the issue.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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Oh the ones getting the raise are happy. The ones that were already at that level previous from having worked their time, and improved their skillset and experience level are now at the "bottom" with those that got a free raise up. Those employee in that position are going to be upset if they don't get a raise as well to differentiate their improved marketability over those at the bottom.

I think that's one of the things that people who are in favor of unilaterally increasing minimum wage by a large amount fail to take into account. Just because minimum wage increases doesn't mean the people who were making more than minimum wage beforehand are also going to get bumped. If I'm making $15 an hour and some lesser-skilled co-workers are making $10, I feel OK with my position. If they all get bumped to $15, that doesn't mean I'm moving up to $20. Suddenly the additional skills and experience I have don't actually translate to increased salary, and that's not going to leave me satisfied.

I think increasing minimum wage is ultimately a good thing, but sometimes good intentions have unintended consequences. You're not mandating a 30% increase in salaries across the board for anyone earning under a certain amount, you're just raising the absolute bottom up to people who are slightly above the bottom. It's a nice gesture, but if your concern is the vast disparity of wealth between the rich and the poor, maybe you should focus some of your attention on the people at the top.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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I wonder how working a Wal-mart is different than working at target or some other store in the retail sector?
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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Is a grocery store or a sales clerk at a retail store your career path? If so, you may want to consider other options.
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
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Yeah, apparently you are having some major brain malfunctions around here. The entire topic of discussion is how raising the wages for some (namely, starting empyloyee's) has completely pissed off their senior members. That was (and is) the entire basis of discussion.

If you couldn't tell from my post mentioning things such as "Keeping up with the Jones" and tossing a scrap of meat in the Lion's cage, you are clearly having severe mental issues.

But then again, I guess that is why you both vote the way you do :awe:

Jesus_facepalm.jpg