Unidentified federal law enforcement arresting Portland protesters in unmarked vehicles, for unknown reasons...

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Feb 4, 2009
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Not confusing at all. ISIS used women as shields too. Law enforcement can distinguish between moms and anarchists.

ISIS used women as shields so they could shoot at other people.
I can’t believe you even said this. Really big reach.

I bet ISIS eat cheese and drinks water too!
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
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It's kind of amazing that Starbuck thought the police wouldn't attack mothers as well. I mean has he been paying any attention to the police riots of the last couple months?
I have been paying close attention. You have a small minority of rioters exploiting BLM to excuse their behavior, and the police exploiting those rioters to crack down on the protests, mostly because Trump thinks “law and order” is his path to reelection. There would be no need for a law enforcement presence if you didn’t have an element insisting on damaging property.
 
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Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
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ISIS used women as shields so they could shoot at other people.
I can’t believe you even said this. Really big reach.

I bet ISIS eat cheese and drinks water too!
Then why create a skirmish line of women if not to create the same psychological intent. This is no longer about BLM. This is about controlling a narrative and finger pointing. A line of moms getting caught in the crossfire between rioters and law enforcement is an exploitable visual.

Trump is attempting to create the same visual in deploying federal agencies to crack down on the rioters.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
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I have been paying close attention. You have a small minority of rioters exploiting BLM to excuse their behavior, and the police exploiting those rioters to crack down on the protests.

If you've been paying attention, you'll be able to recount the police rioting as well
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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Then why create a skirmish line of women if not to create the same psychological intent. This is no longer about BLM. This is about controlling a narrative and finger pointing. A line of moms getting caught in the crossfire between rioters and law enforcement is an exploitable visual.

Trump is attempting to create the same visual in deploying federal agencies to crack down on the rioters.
Where was the riot in the videos linked in my article and why was using flash bangs and tear gas on those women necessary?

The police are out of control and are rioting. You might be right that law enforcement can tell the difference between mothers and rioters but if that’s true then the obvious conclusion is that they don’t care about the difference and are just indiscriminately attacking the citizens they swore to protect, which is far worse.

We can train officers to know the difference between a rioter and a mom, but how do you train someone to not betray their oath? Maybe vastly increase firings and prosecutions? Perhaps some time to cool their heels in prison will get the police riots under control.
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,199
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ISIS used women as shields so they could shoot at other people.
I can’t believe you even said this. Really big reach.

I bet ISIS eat cheese and drinks water too!

Lol, I can totally believe Starbuck said it, not surprising in the least.
 
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Feb 4, 2009
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Then why create a skirmish line of women if not to create the same psychological intent. This is no longer about BLM. This is about controlling a narrative and finger pointing. A line of moms getting caught in the crossfire between rioters and law enforcement is an exploitable visual.

Trump is attempting to create the same visual in deploying federal agencies to crack down on the rioters.

The idea is the moms fucking voluntarily line up to deescalate force. Brave Women.
 
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JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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Then why create a skirmish line of women if not to create the same psychological intent. This is no longer about BLM. This is about controlling a narrative and finger pointing. A line of moms getting caught in the crossfire between rioters and law enforcement is an exploitable visual.

Trump is attempting to create the same visual in deploying federal agencies to crack down on the rioters.
your point is that Trump is doing is correctly and the BLM people are doing it all for show....
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,632
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The idea is the moms fucking voluntarily line up to deescalate force. Brave Women.
Exactly. They were trying to reign in police violence by putting innocent moms in the way. Sadly, it appears the moms underestimated just how committed the police were to using violence.

It’s the same as the Navy guy who got pepper sprayed his hand broken by the cops for just standing there. He underestimated just how violent these police riots have gotten.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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Then why create a skirmish line of women if not to create the same psychological intent. This is no longer about BLM. This is about controlling a narrative and finger pointing. A line of moms getting caught in the crossfire between rioters and law enforcement is an exploitable visual.

Trump is attempting to create the same visual in deploying federal agencies to crack down on the rioters.

Bullshit. Trump usurps the power of state & local authorities to deliberately provoke the people of Portland. DHS has no business deploying thugs against their wishes. If he can escalate to Portland being burned to the ground it will suit his purposes entirely.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
27,649
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Exactly. They were trying to reign in police violence by putting innocent moms in the way. Sadly, it appears the moms underestimated just how committed the police were to using violence.

It’s the same as the Navy guy who got pepper sprayed his hand broken by the cops for just standing there. He underestimated just how violent these police riots have gotten.
The root cause of the problem is the protesters just don’t choose the right way to protest. If they would just do that then the police wouldn’t attack them.

Is that basically Starbuck again?
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,483
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There's a movement to try and get "Dads" to stand up after seeing how powerful the images of the "Moms" were. I'm really considering heading down there but my wife doesn't want me to after seeing what has happened to others. We had one guy get his face shattered by a rubber bullet, then the navy guy getting his hands busted. Moms getting gassed and flashbanged. But still...this is one time in my life I finally felt like it was something I needed to do.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
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I mean, only one side of this argument is using tear gas and flashbangs. I'm thinking they need the finger pointed at them.
The finger also needs to be pointed at the small element looking to damage federal property that gives federal law enforcement a justification for using flash bangs and tear gas.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,632
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The root cause of the problem is the protesters just don’t choose the right way to protest. If they would just do that then the police wouldn’t attack them.

Is that basically Starbuck again?
I mean the whole NFL thing exposed the intellectual and moral bankruptcy of that argument. Kaepernick found the absolutely most benign way possible to protest and people still freaked out.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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The finger also needs to be pointed at the small element looking to damage federal property that gives federal law enforcement a justification for using flash bangs and tear gas.
While I agree that damaging and vandalizing federal property is wrong and those responsible should be arrested, it in no way justifies violence against peaceful protesters.

Those police responsible should be fired, arrested, and charged with crimes. The officials in charge of the police response should be investigated to see if their orders led to these crimes and if so, they should be fired or potentially charged as well.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
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The finger also needs to be pointed at the small element looking to damage federal property that gives federal law enforcement a justification for using flash bangs and tear gas.

It was all fading slowly away until Trump put more fuel on the fire.
 
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Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
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It was all fading slowly away until Trump put more fuel on the fire.
If all it takes is a federal presence for the fire to start raging, it means there was ample kindling in Portland to begin with.

Trump knows exactly what he is doing. Put a federal presence in front of federal property, and the anti-government element is going to come out of the woodwork.

For the record, there should not be a federal law enforcement presence in Portland. If the mayor of Portland wants to abdicate his responsibilities and the local populace is willing to tolerate rioting as a form of political expression, let them have exactly what they want.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
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While I agree that damaging and vandalizing federal property is wrong and those responsible should be arrested, it in no way justifies violence against peaceful protesters.

Those police responsible should be fired, arrested, and charged with crimes. The officials in charge of the police response should be investigated to see if their orders led to these crimes and if so, they should be fired or potentially charged as well.
When the peaceful protest becomes a screen to enable the vandals, how would you like law enforcement to respond?
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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If all it takes is a federal presence for the fire to start raging, it means there was ample kindling in Portland to begin with.

Trump knows exactly what he is doing. Put a federal presence in front of federal property, and the anti-government element is going to come out of the woodwork.

For the record, there should not be a federal law enforcement presence in Portland. If the mayor of Portland wants to abdicate his responsibilities and the local populace is willing to tolerate rioting as a form of political expression, let them have exactly what they want.

We're heading for a "Tank Man" moment.


If it's not a bunch of Mom's it's going to be something else that eventually gets enough public dismay that this looks very, very bad under a political lens.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,993
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If all it takes is a federal presence for the fire to start raging, it means there was ample kindling in Portland to begin with.

Man, the size of your brain, you must be the smartest person on the planet? Not kidding!



"4-42. The urban (terrorist) approach is an approach in which insurgents attack government and symbolic targets (for example an important religious building) to cause government forces to overreact against the population. The insurgents want the government’s repressive measures to enrage the people so that they rise up and overthrow the government. Although this type of method may develop popular support against a government that is particularly brutal or corrupt, it may only result in shallow support for the insurgency. The population may only see the insurgency positively because of the brutal response, not because they identify with the insurgency. "


Closing arguments :
 
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