Unemployment increases to 9.8% after poor jobs report

[MotF Bane]

"Lies, damned lies, and statistics."

 

[sactoking]

Oh and maybe we can all get those great times under Bush/Republicans like CC and some of you think since its "worse" now than before back...

Just a head's up that you might want to not use Clusterstock's "Chart of the Day". Every one I've seen quoted here (all of 2) has been intellectually dishonest. First there was the one in the Federal employee wage freeze thread which plotted federal wages against private sector wages but only used "goods producing" jobs in the private sector with no definition of what that entails. Now there's this one which shows monthly gains/losses yet is presented in a manner as to indicate that it's aggregate gains/losses. In other words it's presented in a manner to show that the Obama admin is "undoing" the job losses caused by the Bush admin when it actually shows that there were approximately equal numbers of jobs lost in the last year of Bush as there were in the first year of Obama. There are actually so many problems with the way this data is presented that I don't even know where to start in listing them.

On second thought, maybe it's not the Clusterstock charts that are dishonest but instead the manner in which it's presented on ATP&N. I've never looked at the source site to know in what context it's presented there.

 

[bamacre]

What disappoints me is the stupid masses who want to point fingers at the "other party." This isn't the result of Democrat or Republican policies, this is the result of policies both parties have embraced, and for many years.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

You to?

Ha ha you do know that picture proves my point. Long term jobs/market conditions are not over night. i.e. all that is based on the previous 4-10+ years.

Common sense, so rare it’s a super power.

Don't put lipstick on a pig and then expect people to buy your bullshit partisan spin.

 

[DesiPower]

That literally doesn't make any sense.

I scoff at the 10yr graphs. Here's a 60yr graph.

OK, agreed that our debt is not at dangerous levels yet, but don't you agree that money spent by federal govt today doesn't stay here and bleeds out to cheap labor countries and we eventually don't gain anything from it?

 

[Scotteq]

Oh and maybe we can all get those great times under Bush/Republicans like CC and some of you think since its "worse" now than before back...

Just a head's up that you might want to not use Clusterstock's "Chart of the Day". Every one I've seen quoted here (all of 2) has been intellectually dishonest. First there was the one in the Federal employee wage freeze thread which plotted federal wages against private sector wages but only used "goods producing" jobs in the private sector with no definition of what that entails. Now there's this one which shows monthly gains/losses yet is presented in a manner as to indicate that it's aggregate gains/losses. In other words it's presented in a manner to show that the Obama admin is "undoing" the job losses caused by the Bush admin when it actually shows that there were approximately equal numbers of jobs lost in the last year of Bush as there were in the first year of Obama. There are actually so many problems with the way this data is presented that I don't even know where to start in listing them.

On second thought, maybe it's not the Clusterstock charts that are dishonest but instead the manner in which it's presented on ATP&N. I've never looked at the source site to know in what context it's presented there.

What disappoints me is the stupid masses who want to point fingers at the "other party." This isn't the result of Democrat or Republican policies, this is the result of policies both parties have embraced, and for many years.

OMG!! COMMON SENSE!! :thumbsup:

 

[bamacre]

OK, agreed that our debt is not at dangerous levels yet

Yes it is. Very much so. You can't see it because very low interest rates create that illusion. If interest rates are increased, to fight inflation, then the interest payments on our debt soar. I don't even want to scare you with adding our unfunded liabilities into that equation.

 

[Jiggz]

wait. so up until now they have been receiving the tax cuts and breaks etc.. yet they were creating jobs in china, india etc.. but as soon as we extend the tax cuts to the wealthy they will start creating jobs here?

So you'd rather raise their taxes and expect a different result? Seriously? You actually think that raising their taxes will create more jobs here? Hello?

 

[EagleKeeper]

Not sure where your numbers are from, the charts I'm seeing show the market in the red all day so far and presently mildly negative. But definately this week's rally is now stalled and I'll admit my call was wrong. Why it was wrong I don't know-90% of the time that would have been a good call. Perhaps the overall rally is stronger than I've been thinking. Calling the market is like weather forecasting, sometimes it moves completely contrary to where every indicator expects it to go.

The numbers came from my portal (sponsored by Scottrade) - offset by 20 mnutes
Presently they are showing a slight split.
stock price $ change % change
DJIA 11,351.74 -10.67 -0.09
NASDAQ 2,582.14 +2.79 +0.11
S&P 500 1,219.96 -1.57 -0.13

Maybe the market can shrug off the news or it was already previously factored

 

[HomerJS]

This. and then the braindead liberals wants to spend more money in the "short term" to grow the economy in the long term. Hey fvcktrds, jobs are being shipped overseas like there is no tomorrow. Unless you stop that and start bringing jobs back, you will never lower unemployment coz most ppl dont know anything better to do and cant be "trained" in "high skill" jobs either thanks to the public school system.

How about ending tax breaks for companies who ship jobs overseas?

Oh yeah there was a vote on that. Guess who blocked it??

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE68R40I20100928

 

[Zebo]

Merry Christmas Overpaid Fools!!!!


You bail out Wall Street......Wall Street outsources you!

 

[bamacre]

Merry Christmas Overpaid Fools!!!!


You bail out Wall Street......Wall Street outsources you!

Yup. And I'm surprised we didn't get a thread about this new bailout information...
http://money.cnn.com/2010/12/01/news/economy/fed_reserve_data_release/index.htm?hpt=T2

$9 trillion. :|

 

[JockoJohnson]

All you do is ramble and then deflect.
Still waiting for your proof that this whole mess happened in the last 2 years and had nothing to do with the Republican rule for 6+ years.

So by your logic it was Clinton's fault (and the Republican controlled Congress at the time) that caused the jobs to go down in the early part of this century?

 

[Zebo]

The numbers came from my portal (sponsored by Scottrade) - offset by 20 mnutes
Presently they are showing a slight split.
stock price $ change % change
DJIA 11,351.74 -10.67 -0.09
NASDAQ 2,582.14 +2.79 +0.11
S&P 500 1,219.96 -1.57 -0.13

Maybe the market can shrug off the news or it was already previously factored

Looking at the wall street casino is like a cancer patient looking at his acne that went away from chemo treatments.

 

[Michael]

Are there really businesses out there that stake their investments on 3% tax rates and the risk vs reward?

Is this really the scenario you imagine?

Sony CTO: We would like to make a new camera at a new facility. Our new proprietary technology will give us a far superior product for a great price with a nice take for us. How about it accountants?
Sony CFO: Sorry, we can't expand right now because taxes are going to go up 3%.
Sony CTO: Damn, all those jobs lost! If only our taxes would stay at their current levels that are detrimental to society! We could create so many jobs!

That is such a bad example of how that conversation would work.

It goes more like this:

"Taxes are up 3% so our bottom line is down 3% along with our cash flow

We need to maintain our net return on sales, so let's cut spending by 3% and relook at our capex plans. Rank our projects and we'll have a meeting to decide what to cut."

Michael

 

[JockoJohnson]

Oh and maybe we can all get those great times under Bush/Republicans like CC and some of you think since its "worse" now than before back...

Just a head's up that you might want to not use Clusterstock's "Chart of the Day". Every one I've seen quoted here (all of 2) has been intellectually dishonest. First there was the one in the Federal employee wage freeze thread which plotted federal wages against private sector wages but only used "goods producing" jobs in the private sector with no definition of what that entails. Now there's this one which shows monthly gains/losses yet is presented in a manner as to indicate that it's aggregate gains/losses. In other words it's presented in a manner to show that the Obama admin is "undoing" the job losses caused by the Bush admin when it actually shows that there were approximately equal numbers of jobs lost in the last year of Bush as there were in the first year of Obama. There are actually so many problems with the way this data is presented that I don't even know where to start in listing them.

On second thought, maybe it's not the Clusterstock charts that are dishonest but instead the manner in which it's presented on ATP&N. I've never looked at the source site to know in what context it's presented there.

Also, the people who made the chart for that site are fucktards. It states thousands of jobs lost -- and then proceeds to put numbers into the negative. So two negatives is a positive. The chart is going in the wrong direction, probably compiled by some moron fresh out of high school. If it were to state jobs created in the title and then have negative numbers, it would make sense.

Good job on picking a chart from a site run by retards.

 

[JockoJohnson]

How about ending tax breaks for companies who ship jobs overseas?

Oh yeah there was a vote on that. Guess who blocked it??

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE68R40I20100928

Again, Democrat controlled Congress. How did Obamacare pass but they couldn't get this through?

Bamacre is right, it's not just one side or the other---IT'S BOTH. Until the partisans retards realize that, this country is gonna stay fucked for a long time.

 

[jhbball]

Don't put lipstick on a pig and then expect people to buy your bullshit partisan spin.

You hate science because you're a conservative. How is that different?

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

You hate science because you're a conservative. How is that different?

I haven't the foggiest idea of what you're talking about...please explain.

 

[bamacre]

So by your logic it was Clinton's fault (and the Republican controlled Congress at the time) that caused the jobs to go down in the early part of this century?

You made me dig it up...

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30696361&postcount=156

 

[GoPackGo]

This all started with NAFTA and Clinton lifting the High-Tech restrictions on China. Also them having most favored trade nation status.

GM is making cars in Mexico...so US and therefore the US Taxpayer is paying for Jobs in Mexico.

Our manufacturing has been devastated over the last 20 years.

We have reaped what we have sown.

What I love is how people decry our dependence on foreign oil. We are now dependent on foreign everything.

 

[HomerJS]

Again, Democrat controlled Congress. How did Obamacare pass but they couldn't get this through?

Bamacre is right, it's not just one side or the other---IT'S BOTH. Until the partisans retards realize that, this country is gonna stay fucked for a long time.

Because they have shitty filibuster rules in the Senate. Those tards should actually have to standup and speak non-stop if they believe that much in a bill not being put up for a vote.

You would think this would be something a few members of the GOP could back seeing as too many working americans are getting screwed.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

You made me dig it up...

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30696361&postcount=156

That was an awesome interview with Sir James Goldsmith...thanks!

Especially Part 6 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDxufaKZLjc&NR=1

 

[Craig234]

This all started with NAFTA and Clinton lifting the High-Tech restrictions on China. Also them having most favored trade nation status.

GM is making cars in Mexico...so US and therefore the US Taxpayer is paying for Jobs in Mexico.

Our manufacturing has been devastated over the last 20 years.

We have reaped what we have sown.

What I love is how people decry our dependence on foreign oil. We are now dependent on foreign everything.

And yet you oppose the one faction who most supports your point, the progressives, and support the party that has so much 'sold out' to the interests you criticize.

Yes, the corporatist Dems, the compromising Dems, are very responsible for their part of the sellout policies. Listen to progressives attack them.

But criticizing them is the only part you're getting right in placing blame. You get the progressives and the Republicans wrong, named for your enemies.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

GM is making cars in Mexico...so US and therefore the US Taxpayer is paying for Jobs in Mexico.

Our manufacturing has been devastated over the last 20 years.

"It will be the poor in rich countries subsidizing the rich in poor countries." - Sir James Goldsmith (1994)