Question Undervolting, PBO, AutoOC on Ryzen 5000

[aleader]

I recently installed a Ryzen 5600X on my B550 MSI Gaming Plus MB. I have 32GB Corsair Vengeance LPX at 3200. I just updated the BIOS as it has the newest AGESA 1.1.9.0 which allows undervolting with the Curve Optimizer. After following the instructions from this guy's video, I was able to get it to -24mv stable:

I am just testing it with Cinebench as it crashes consistently when it isn't stable (i.e. at -25mv). I'm not sure if there are others that I should test with, but I also had CoreTemp running while testing so I could see what was going on. It made no difference to stability or the scores if CoreTemp was enabled or not. Max temps were 68C and it boosted to about 4,568MHz max (all cores). I'm going to try gaming with it today.

Of note, when I went ahead and updated to the latest AMD chipset drivers, suddenly Cinebench started crashing even at -24mv. I reverted back one driver to where I was...no more crashes. I always let it run through all of the passes as it would sometimes crash near the end after pass 7 or 8.

The Multicore test in Cinebench showed improvement from 11,131 to 11,696 after under-volting. Single thread showed no improvement, which I've read is to be expected when enabling PBO. I'm wondering now about OC and if it's worth it. I'd only be looking for single thread boosts for old-engine, single thread utilized intensive games I play like DCS World. I don't care about any other performance increases except for gaming, which we all know still usually only utilizes a single core.

I keep seeing 'PBO vs AutoOC'. I thought PBO was AutoOC? Does PBO not always need to be enabled in order to OC? I assume I would set the PBO limits to 'Motherboard' and add a boost override of up to 200MHz? Is this considered 'AutoOC'? There isn't much out there yet for the 5000 series.

 

[PJVol]

Sorry for being harsh, but you'd better look into 5000 builders thread, instead of watching useless videos for tldr-sticklers. At least, from 5-10 pages back there, you'll get a much more knowlegde, try to read, not watch.

 

[aleader]

Sorry for being harsh, but you'd better look into 5000 builders thread, instead of watching useless videos for tldr-sticklers. At least, from 5-10 pages back there, you'll get a much more knowlegde, try to read, not watch.

I don't have a clue what you're talking about. If you're saying I should read through 100's of pages in the 5000 builders thread until I find something that resembles an answer...I don't have as much time on my hands as you obviously do. I did a search for PBO and AutoOC and came up with nothing on this site that would help me.

 

[amrnuke]

I don't have a clue what you're talking about. If you're saying I should read through 100's of pages in the 5000 builders thread until I find something that resembles an answer...I don't have as much time on my hands as you obviously do. I did a search for PBO and AutoOC and came up with nothing on this site that would help me.

The search has plenty of results.

Go into the Ryzen 5000 builders thread
Click the search bar at the top - a box will open below
In the drop-down where it says "Everywhere" select "This thread"
Type PBO in the search bar
Click Search

There are two pages of listed results just from that thread.

Also... there are only 32 pages in that thread, not hundreds. Page 20 would be as good a place to start as any. det0x's posts have been particularly helpful as far as a "template" for where to start, though pretty much everyone in there is quite productive in their replies.

 

[aleader]

The search has plenty of results.

Go into the Ryzen 5000 builders thread
Click the search bar at the top - a box will open below
In the drop-down where it says "Everywhere" select "This thread"
Type PBO in the search bar
Click Search

There are two pages of listed results just from that thread.

Also... there are only 32 pages in that thread, not hundreds. Page 20 would be as good a place to start as any. det0x's posts have been particularly helpful as far as a "template" for where to start, though pretty much everyone in there is quite productive in their replies.

I meant to say 'posts', not pages. I didn't even realize that the 'builders' thread was about hardcore overclocking for extreme hobbyists I went in there where you suggested, and yes, Detox's posts are about the closest thing to an answer that exists in there, but I still didn't get any. Most of those posts are 'here's my results' and a bunch of memory timing posts.

Guys, I'm asking VERY basic questions here that could have been answered already if so much time hadn't been spent telling me the 'right' way to post and/or how to search 🙄 Drives me nuts when people take the time to post 'go search for it yourself' instead of answering the question. What is the purpose to a forum then? Is this just a database for searches?

I still don't know what 'AutoOC' means and I don't see anything in my BIOS that even resembles it. I've googled this, nothing that I can find to explain it. The posts I did find were from 2018 and 2019. Is this referring to Ryzen Master (which I don't use)? Is there even any point? From what I've seen in benchmarks on reputable sites (HW Unboxed, GN) there doesn't seem to be, but there are no details on how they are OC.

I was overclocking my i5 4670k and 4790k's for years, so I'm not a noob to this, but Ryzen is very different. I did see noticeable gains in actual gameplay when I OC my 4670k to 4.5GHz for instance. For Ryzen is this just a hobby for no real-world performance gains? If so, I'm not going to bother.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

I just did this at the max 30 on my 5900X. Cinebench ran fine and improved from 20100 to 22000. I haven't had a chance to actually stress test it yet though.

What chipset drivers are you talking about? I don't see an update since October.

PBO vs AutoOC: https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3491-explaining-precision-boost-overdrive-benchmarks-auto-oc

Page 19 - AMD Ryzen 5000 Builders Thread

Page 19 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

forums.anandtech.com

 

[amrnuke]

I meant to say 'posts', not pages. I didn't even realize that the 'builders' thread was about hardcore overclocking for extreme hobbyists I went in there where you suggested, and yes, Detox's posts are about the closest thing to an answer that exists in there, but I still didn't get any. Most of those posts are 'here's my results' and a bunch of memory timing posts.

Guys, I'm asking VERY basic questions here that could have been answered already if so much time hadn't been spent telling me the 'right' way to post and/or how to search 🙄 Drives me nuts when people take the time to post 'go search for it yourself' instead of answering the question. What is the purpose to a forum then? Is this just a database for searches?

I still don't know what 'AutoOC' means and I don't see anything in my BIOS that even resembles it. I've googled this, nothing that I can find to explain it. The posts I did find were from 2018 and 2019. Is this referring to Ryzen Master (which I don't use)? Is there even any point? From what I've seen in benchmarks on reputable sites (HW Unboxed, GN) there doesn't seem to be, but there are no details on how they are OC.

I was overclocking my i5 4670k and 4790k's for years, so I'm not a noob to this, but Ryzen is very different. I did see noticeable gains in actual gameplay when I OC my 4670k to 4.5GHz for instance. For Ryzen is this just a hobby for no real-world performance gains? If so, I'm not going to bother.

Googling "what is AutoOC" (first link for me) finds you a description of what AutoOC is (and PBO!) at Gamers Nexus.
Googling "pbo autooc 5600x" (first link for me) finds you a run of benchmarks on the 5600X and description of how they work and what they do at HardwareTimes. They also have a link describing AutoOC and PBO in that article.

PBO expands the PPT, EDC, TDC to the chip as long as it stays within motherboard limits (or user-defined limits) and as long as it stays under a certain temperature. This often permits faster all-core frequency. This is useless for your requested use case.

AutoOC is set as the frequency offset, and will largely affect single-core or lightly threaded frequency peaks. In all the BIOSes I've seen, enabling AutoOC actually requires enabling PBO first.

In MSI's BIOS, AutoOC is either enabled by default, or it's separately labeled as "Max CPU Boost Clock Override" (I don't have an MSI board, I just googled it).

Taking the 5600X from stock to finely-tuned will of course produce real world gains, depending on the application/game; whether that's noticeable to you will depend on a lot more than just the chip and tuning.

(As an aside, quite daring of you to chastise us when you are asking us to do the work for you. The reason we antagonize those who won't do the basic work for themselves is because it shows a lack of interest, and fills the board with reiterations of the same questions. You want an easy answer, and it seems suspicious that 5-10 minutes of Googling and reading on my part was enough time to find the answers AND write them out to you.)

 

[Shmee]

There should be an option in your MSI BIOS, same area as where you enable PBO2, where you can specify +max boost or something. Usually in 25MHz increments IIRC. This was on my MSI X570 Meg Ace with the 5800X at least. I was able to get mine to boost past 4.9GHZ, but it was not completely stable. I believe I settled for a -17 offset, and disabled the extra boost. It is stable now like it was at stock, but runs a bit cooler it seems due to the -offset. My 5800X boosts up to about 4.85GHz anyway by default, though this depends on indvidiual chip, board, and I suspect BIOS used. This is fine for me for now, though I may tweak it more next time I update BIOS.

 

[therealmongo]

Use the latest Y-Cruncher and specifically tests 15/16 to do a quick tests to determine if the CO values you are choosing are actually "stable".

You will be suprised with the results.

@aleader the reason peeps are asking you to read up information already posted is because from what you have wrote you dont have a grasp of the basics.

The Internet is full of information regards what PBO is and the differences between PBO vs PBO2, this information is freely available.

PBO is a form of "Auto OC" but its not black and white, hence the reason people are unlikely going to start explaining in detail to a poster what these are when with a simple search will relieve detailed informtion.

The first article linked above will answer your question regards what PBO needs to work and how you can "define" your motherboard limits.

As to actually using CO to achieve what you want, be prepared to invest some time into it, seeing you dont want to invest time into reading the basics im unsure how far you will go in achieving what you seek.

 

[therealmongo]

delete

 

[aleader]

Googling "what is AutoOC" (first link for me) finds you a description of what AutoOC is (and PBO!) at Gamers Nexus.
Googling "pbo autooc 5600x" (first link for me) finds you a run of benchmarks on the 5600X and description of how they work and what they do at HardwareTimes. They also have a link describing AutoOC and PBO in that article.

PBO expands the PPT, EDC, TDC to the chip as long as it stays within motherboard limits (or user-defined limits) and as long as it stays under a certain temperature. This often permits faster all-core frequency. This is useless for your requested use case.

AutoOC is set as the frequency offset, and will largely affect single-core or lightly threaded frequency peaks. In all the BIOSes I've seen, enabling AutoOC actually requires enabling PBO first.

In MSI's BIOS, AutoOC is either enabled by default, or it's separately labeled as "Max CPU Boost Clock Override" (I don't have an MSI board, I just googled it).

Taking the 5600X from stock to finely-tuned will of course produce real world gains, depending on the application/game; whether that's noticeable to you will depend on a lot more than just the chip and tuning.

(As an aside, quite daring of you to chastise us when you are asking us to do the work for you. The reason we antagonize those who won't do the basic work for themselves is because it shows a lack of interest, and fills the board with reiterations of the same questions. You want an easy answer, and it seems suspicious that 5-10 minutes of Googling and reading on my part was enough time to find the answers AND write them out to you.)

I have already looked at those articles (they are coloured links because I have already read through them when I googled it). The HW Times article is 4th in my list. I know what PBO is, I didn't ask that if you take the time to read my original post. I will have another look at the GN article. I read it when I bought my 3600, but I figured it was out of date for the 5000 series.

Your google (I'm assuming in the US) must be different from mine (Canada), because I don't get that answer at all for 'Max CPU Boost Clock Override' when I google 'Auto Oc Msi.' THANK YOU for the answer. I did come across MANY threads however, mostly from early 2019 or older (useless to me), but I didn't see any posts on there chastising people and telling them to 'just google it'...and this was on Reddit!

Walls of text that could have just been a few line answers, but thanks to those that took the time. Had I come on here and asked "What's this 'overclocking' and how do I do it," I could understand the responses. I think my questions are quite specific, but apparently too dumb for this forum. I'll remember next time when I have a question to just 'google it' and let the geniuses on the 'Elite' forum here be...😉

 

[aleader]

delete

Exactly the attitude I'm talking about...

 

[aleader]

I just did this at the max 30 on my 5900X. Cinebench ran fine and improved from 20100 to 22000. I haven't had a chance to actually stress test it yet though.

What chipset drivers are you talking about? I don't see an update since October.

PBO vs AutoOC: https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3491-explaining-precision-boost-overdrive-benchmarks-auto-oc

Page 19 - AMD Ryzen 5000 Builders Thread

Page 19 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

forums.anandtech.com

Thanks, good answer! I have read that article about a year ago, but came away thinking it wasn't worth it to OC the 3000 series (I likely skipped to the results). This article should probably be 'stickied' in the OC forum so us noobs don't bother others asking dumb questions I've come away thinking it isn't worth it to OC for single-threaded performance anyways.

These are the Chipset drivers I was talking about, Ver. 2.10.26.336 from Dec. 11, 2020:

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/MPG-B550-GAMING-PLUS#down-driver&Win10 64

 

[Gideon]

The problem is that nobody has really bothered to make a comprehensive guide. The Optimum-Tech one is OK if you're not upping power levels. Several reddit posts on r/AMD are also decent:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/jsktqs

And overclockers.co.uk has an OK thread on the subject:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/jrsz7x

But I'm afraid if you want a simple guide, you have to be the first one to make it :/

 

[aleader]

Yes, I read those ones too, but the simple question I had was what is he referring to when he says 'Auto OC.' Overclocking Ryzen is quite complex compared to Haswell. This is probably also the reason that overzealous moderators shouldn't be deleting threads with 'simple' questions. Had a thread with these basics existed on this site (not digging through the 'Builders' thread) and been stickied where it belongs, I likely wouldn't have had these questions.

I'm sensitive to these types of things as I have been lurking in military sim forums since the '90s, and there are many (ok, only a few) of similar attitude in those. I bristle when a new player comes on the DCS forum and asks a question and gets 'go read the 650 page manual'. The poster takes the time to write a diatribe on why they should read the manual instead of just answering the question. I always ask what I would do if it was in my office and a new student/employee asks me a basic question (it happens all the time). I have never said 'go back to your desk and read the noob manual and then come ask me a question'. That would be...uncivilized.

 

[amrnuke]

I'm sensitive to these types of things as I have been lurking in military sim forums since the '90s, and there are many (ok, only a few) of similar attitude in those. I bristle when a new player comes on the DCS forum and asks a question and gets 'go read the 650 page manual'. The poster takes the time to write a diatribe on why they should read the manual instead of just answering the question. I always ask what I would do if it was in my office and a new student/employee asks me a basic question (it happens all the time). I have never said 'go back to your desk and read the noob manual and then come ask me a question'. That would be...uncivilized.

No, this is different. But I doubt you see why.

Since you have twice in this thread claimed to have previously read the GamersNexus article, I see no need for you to have asked the questions in your original post, and I assume you've gone ahead and tried to enable PBO and set your max core boost frequency offset to the highest allowed. What results did that get you?