Unarmed black 17 year old shot by Neighborhood watch captain in gated community...

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classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
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Again they had no evidence that refuted his story/claim of self defense so the prosecutor turned it away.

You keep saying that, but that is incorrect. You can have evidence and it not be enough to get a conviction. Big difference.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Do you have any idea how overreaching that law would have to be?


Again, let's not make this "9/11" all over again.

You mean using it to justify a war for political power and divert trillions of dollars in spending to favored places? Not much chance of that.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
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So with every other potential piece of evidence that may be out there, they would have shared it but not this.

That defies logic

They're not supposed to be releasing jack shit and they shouldn't have. But with what's released it's a clear case of self defense against a vicious attack.
 

Puddle Jumper

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
2,835
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"mob" "popular opinion" "standing up for the constitution"

Just admit it. You don't like black people and this is how you dehumanize them and trivialize their very real concerns about injustice in this country.

Just admit it. You don't like Hispanic or white people and this is how you dehumanize them and trivialize their very real concerns about due process in the legal system.
 

classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
15,219
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Look at the police reports. If you need a link LMK.

They did arrest Zimmerman, they cuffed him, they detained him, they took him into custody. They interrogated him. They have his gun in evidence still.

I should think it rather obvious that a PD has procedures to track what they are doing, who spent what time on what, who was brought in there and why, on suspicion of what etc.

The info is, in part, tracked with codes indicating what type of possible offense was being investigated.

It's a management thing, a liability thing etc. If some guy shows up at the ER and claims the police beat the crap of him what are they going to say in the absence of such records? "Uh, we don't know. We don't keep records."

Fern

I can't dispute any of that..............
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
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Do you have any idea how overreaching that law would have to be?


Again, let's not make this "9/11" all over again.

Or they could just state stand your ground only applys to residence and automobile.

They could put an in public exclusion, fact is there are numerous things they could do.
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
17,303
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londojowo.hypermart.net
You keep saying that, but that is incorrect. You can have evidence and it not be enough to get a conviction. Big difference.

They don't have evidence/testimony that refutes his claim of self defense nor establishes probable cause to charge him with manslaughter. Based on what has been reported, some of the evidence/testimony corroborates his claim of self defense.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
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They're not supposed to be releasing jack shit and they shouldn't have. But with what's released it's a clear case of self defense against a vicious attack.

Austin Brown the 13 year old Saw Someone matching the description of Zimmerman on the ground seconds before the shot.

he didnt make any mention of Martin on top or near him when the shot rang out. If that account is accurate Self defesne has real problems.
 

classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
15,219
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They're not supposed to be releasing jack shit and they shouldn't have. But with what's released it's a clear case of self defense against a vicious attack.

Well obviously, lol, there is some cracks in your slam dunk theory. But hey how's things at Roswell?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
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You're confusing two different things here. This has to do with what an officer on the scene put in a police report. It has nothing to do with Chris Serino who wasn't brought into the case until they had Z in custody. According to the news reports, he filed an affidavit on 2/26 stating that he did not believe Z's story.

Gee Wolfe, read the link.

Here's the title of the article:

Report: Lead investigator wanted to arrest Zimmerman for shooting unarmed teen Trayvon Martin

http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...to-arrest-zimmerman-for-shooting-unarmed-teen

This is exactly on point.

And by "affidavit" is it not possible, even likely, that other report was referring to a police report? The police report signature portion carries some language like "I swear and affirm the above is true and correct". (I have a old CART, that the best I can make out.)

In any case, it's clear the prosecutor's office is saying the report is false.

Fern
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,708
514
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So anyone else curious what brought about the difference of opinion between the homocide investigator and the state attorney's office?

Seems weird. Or maybe it's more common but it's just never brought to most peoples' attention.
 

classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
15,219
1
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Gee Wolfe, read the link.

Here's the title of the article:



http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...to-arrest-zimmerman-for-shooting-unarmed-teen

This is exactly on point.

And by "affidavit" is it not possible, even likely, that other report was referring to a police report? The police report signature portion carries some language like "I swear and affirm the above is true and correct". (I have a old CART, that the best I can make out.)

In any case, it's clear the prosecutor's office is saying the report is false.

Fern

Its only clear in your mind....................
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
Austin Brown the 13 year old Saw Someone matching the description of Zimmerman on the ground seconds before the shot.

he didnt make any mention of Martin on top or near him when the shot rang out. If that account is accurate Self defesne has real problems.

The police have Z's shirt. I would assume that if it didn't have blood on it they would have arrested him.
 

classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
15,219
1
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So anyone else curious what brought about the difference of opinion between the homocide investigator and the state attorney's office?

Seems weird. Or maybe it's more common but it's just never brought to most peoples' attention.

No that is not common.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Austin Brown the 13 year old Saw Someone matching the description of Zimmerman on the ground seconds before the shot.

he didnt make any mention of Martin on top or near him when the shot rang out. If that account is accurate Self defesne has real problems.

No it doesn't. If martin was beating him and they seperated and martin so much as took a single step towards the guy on the ground self defense is still totally justified.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
Austin Brown the 13 year old Saw Someone matching the description of Zimmerman on the ground seconds before the shot.

he didnt make any mention of Martin on top or near him when the shot rang out. If that account is accurate Self defesne has real problems.

The story being attributed to Austin Brown as his eye witness testimony is third hand from a news source that makes no citations to its sources for it. Assuming the little blurb put out about his account is correct, it neither puts Martin on top of him or away from him. The info in the the ABC news article makes no mention of where TM is in relation to GZ from Austin's supposed testimony.

Until that full testimony has been released, I wouldn't be basing any legal opinion upon it.
 

micrometers

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2010
3,473
0
0
When all else fails throw out the race card.

You actually DOUBTED an ABC news report that was favorable to Martin. I'm sure you believe that Martin also stole the skittles based on that sketchy website with the fake fox news report.

Racism isn't overt, but it is evident in double standards like this.
 

micrometers

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2010
3,473
0
0
So anyone else curious what brought about the difference of opinion between the homocide investigator and the state attorney's office?

Seems weird. Or maybe it's more common but it's just never brought to most peoples' attention.

State attorney's office is more political? Also might be worried about conviction rates.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
76
Gee Wolfe, read the link.

Here's the title of the article:



http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...to-arrest-zimmerman-for-shooting-unarmed-teen

This is exactly on point.

And by "affidavit" is it not possible, even likely, that other report was referring to a police report? The police report signature portion carries some language like "I swear and affirm the above is true and correct". (I have a old CART, that the best I can make out.)

In any case, it's clear the prosecutor's office is saying the report is false.

Fern

Which part is false the part where he he did not believe Zimmerman's version of events, or the part the where Wolfinger tells him they dont have the evidence or both?
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,816
1,126
126
Your timeline is mixed up.

Z is following him in his vehicle as TM is talking to GF. She tells him to run and he does so. This is consistent with GZ's story that he lost TM who he was following in his vehicle has he ran behind some houses.

GZ gets out of the car while talking with 911 dispatch. He may have started to initially follow TM on foot, but at one point the dispatcher tells him not to follow. It is not clear if he started or continued to follow on foot after or prior to the dispatcher advise. GZ claims at that point he was looking for the street sign and was heading back to his vehicle.

Your timeline needs some love as well, I'll help you with the best I can and maybe I can clear some things up for you.

I think your start is pretty accurate based on Z's 911 call and the girls account.


At the:

1:38 into Z's call we hear the "these assholes always..." line, this is when M starts walking fast with Z following in vehicle

2:08 "shit he's running" (verified by GF account told him to run)

2:14 'ding ding' of interior bells/door slams shut (Z on foot now)

...So at 2:14 Z is on foot as evidence by running and heavy breathing.

2:23 "are you following him?"

2:25 "yep"

2:26 "ok... we don't need you to do that"

2:28 "ok" (Z agrees but does he stop?)

2:44 heavy breathing stops... you can hear first knocking on window/door (someone's house he know's? Not sure) So he is still outside on foot, 16 seconds after saying OK.

2:47 you can hear him knocking even louder now 'knock, knock, knock'

3:08 knocking very loud now So still outside on foot, 40 seconds after saying OK... still talking to dispatcher on phone giving directions to where he parked the truck...

3:30 what's your appt number?

3:33 it's a home it's 1950... (more knocking)

3:36 "oh crap I don't want to give it all out I don't know where this kid is..."
So still outside on foot searching for Martin, not wanting Martin to potentially overhear where Z lives, 1:08 seconds after saying OK.

3:42 dispatcher asks do you want to just meet with them at the mailboxes then...

3:44 "yeah that's fine"

3:48 "actually, could you have them call me and I'll tell them where I'm at?"

3:55 "do you know my number?"

4:02 dispatcher says I'll let them know to call you when they're in the area

4:05 "thanks"

So that's 1:37 seconds after he said OK he was still on foot. That's almost 2 minutes after he exited the truck and started running. Phone call ends and it doesn't sound like he is looking for any street signs or looking for his truck, or the parked truck meeting place would have been fine and he wouldn't be changing his mind and telling them to call him so he can give them his new location. He for sure wasn't in his truck...

We know that 1 minute goes by after Z's call ends and the fight and shot is fired and M is dead 70 yards away from his back door between rows of buildings some distance from Z's truck still.

Still have no idea other than Z's testimony who hit who first, but it all went down and was over pretty quick after the call ended.

EDIT: oh the audio link that matches the time stamps...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9A-gp8mrdw
 
Last edited:

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Eaxctly see if it corroborates he was on top of him.

Or if Austin browns account of seeing Zimmerman on the ground with no mention of martin is correct.

If that gunshot doesnt support Martin on top Zimmerman is done

Austin Brown originally described two people fighting and wished he did something to help them. His dad says he is traumatized so the father is handling relaying the testimony. The father went on record in the beginning saying Martin was innocent.

I wouldn't trust this testimony anymore than Crutcher's that keeps getting more detailed every time she tells it.