Unarmed black 17 year old shot by Neighborhood watch captain in gated community...

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Sep 7, 2009
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Nobody disagrees that if Zimmerman stayed in his car and listened to the 911 officer they both would be alive right now. The people who are defending Zimmerman also aren't defending his actions based on whether or not what he did was a good or bad idea, just how they hold up against Florida law.


While we're stretching, how about this one..


Zimmerman stays in his car, and a hoodrat thug (what trayvon at least APPEARED to be) kicks down someone's door and takes them hostage.



Zimmerman stays in his car, hoodrat thug gets away, the next night comes back and breaks into someone's house




...or what actually hapapened, which gives us one less hoodrat thug off the streets. At this point we KNOW trayvon was a small time drug dealer, we KNOW he was involved in robberies, we KNOW he had gang tattoos, and based on these facts I'm fine with getting to pay for one less person through our penal system.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
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"going against the commands given to him and set out to confront TM"

This is where I hope the grand jury puts its focus in weighing evidence.

We know if he doesnt follow or get out of his his car with his loaded 9mm, the eventual confrontation doest take place. Was it reckless for him to pursue? given he thought martin was on drugs and potentially armed?

We will find out.

EHH??? What??

What grand jury? Last I heard no charges could be brought to bear against him at all. Again, his legal defense of self defense precludes any other charges except ones that prove it wasn't self defense.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
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If in fact he continued pursuit after being told not to continue the pursuit. The only evidence so far shown is his testimony that he stopped pursuit. Unless other evidence, such as eye witness testimony or forensic evidence shows otherwise, then they can't even charge him with negligence at all. Hence my original statement still stands.

And your desire to charge him for "something" because you think he may be lying has no baring at all in this case. I'm not saying he isn't lying, but unless there is proof contrary to that, it is all the law has to go on.

Also, that whole charge only works in states other than Florida. Again with Florida, negligence and recklessness can not be charged AT ALL if the claimant can claim a legal justification for someone dying. In this case the legal claim is self defense. Without being able to thwart that claim first in Florida, no other charge can be made against him.


"your desire to charge him for "something" because you think he may be lying "

No my desire is for the grand jury to examine evidence to determine is Zimmerman was reckless in his pursuit of Martin.
 

Puddle Jumper

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
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It's the same in my state and many others, this isn't special to FL.

I highly recommend each and every one of you look up your self defense laws for your state. I bet you'll be surprised.

I am hoping this case doesn't become an excuse for politicians to undermine the stand your ground laws in other states, especially since it now seems that the use of force by Zimmerman was justified.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
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While we're stretching, how about this one..


Zimmerman stays in his car, and a hoodrat thug (what trayvon at least APPEARED to be) kicks down someone's door and takes them hostage.



Zimmerman stays in his car, hoodrat thug gets away, the next night comes back and breaks into someone's house




...or what actually hapapened, which gives us one less hoodrat thug off the streets. At this point we KNOW trayvon was a small time drug dealer, we KNOW he was involved in robberies, we KNOW he had gang tattoos, and based on these facts I'm fine with getting to pay for one less person through our penal system.


Another question I have, one I'm sure has been answered but I haven't bothered to look through all the posts yet is that was TM part of this neighborhood? I mean did he live there at all? Did he even have any grounds for being in that gate community in the first place?
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
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While we're stretching, how about this one..




.or what actually hapapened, which gives us one less hoodrat thug off the streets. At this point we KNOW trayvon was a small time drug dealer, we KNOW he was involved in robberies, we KNOW he had gang tattoos, and based on these facts I'm fine with getting to pay for one less person through our penal system.

I think this is disgusting!
 
Sep 7, 2009
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Another question I have, one I'm sure has been answered but I haven't bothered to look through all the posts yet is that was TM part of this neighborhood? I mean did he live there at all? Did he even have any grounds for being in that gate community in the first place?


He was caught with drug paraphernalia with intent to sell, and got caught stealing jewelry in miami where his mom lives. His mom sent him to live with Dad for awhile, and Dad's new wife lived in the community.
 
Sep 7, 2009
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"your desire to charge him for "something" because you think he may be lying "

No my desire is for the grand jury to examine evidence to determine is Zimmerman was reckless in his pursuit of Martin.


Shouldn't your desire be to determine who was reckless, and why this all came out? I.E. desire to find justice?

Your bias towards charging zimmerman with something... anything... is so abundantly clear throughout this thread.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
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He was caught with drug paraphernalia with intent to sell, and got caught stealing jewelry in miami where his mom lives. His mom sent him to live with Dad for awhile, and Dad's new wife lived in the community.

Ummm, that statement has me confused. Did the father not live with the new wife yet? If not, why again was he there? If the Dad lived with the new wife and TM was staying with them, then at least TM has justification for being in the neighborhood.
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
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Ummm, that statement has me confused. Did the father not live with the new wife yet? If not, why again was he there? If the Dad lived with the new wife and TM was staying with them, then at least TM has justification for being in the neighborhood.

His Father lived there with his girlfriend,Trayvon was staying with them at the time.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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He was caught with drug paraphernalia with intent to sell, and got caught stealing jewelry in miami where his mom lives. His mom sent him to live with Dad for awhile, and Dad's new wife lived in the community.

and Zimmerman attacks police officers, beats his girlfriends and eats little children. Since you want to go there.
 
Sep 7, 2009
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Ummm, that statement has me confused. Did the father not live with the new wife yet? If not, why again was he there? If the Dad lived with the new wife and TM was staying with them, then at least TM has justification for being in the neighborhood.



I haven't seen any trustworthy data on this.


I believe Trayvon was justified being in this neighborhood, which is what makes it extremely bizarre to me that he RAN AWAY when asked what he was doing there.


I wonder if he thought zimmerman was a cop, and once he realized he wasn't, he attacked zimmerman.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
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And I fiind your (and others) assumptions about what happened without ANY proof equally disgusting.

No I want a full investigation, you want to celebrate not having to pay for a "hoodrat"

I dont trust the local polices investigation, you scour the net to backup your position he was a terrible person and deserved to die.
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
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londojowo.hypermart.net
I think they are in the process of evaluating and that they are not done.

I don't think in order for Z to be found liable in the death they have to prove it wasnt self defense. I think they have to prove that Zimmerman's action were reckless and it ended in the need to shoot.


"Criminally negligent manslaughter
Criminally negligent manslaughter is variously referred to as criminally negligent homicide in the United States, gross negligence manslaughter in England and Wales. In Scotland and some Commonwealth of Nations jurisdictions the offence of culpable homicide might apply.
It occurs where death results from serious negligence, or, in some jurisdictions, serious recklessness."

Obviously you're ignoring what the new State's Attorney has stated about this case.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_...rge-zimmerman-may-not-be-easy-fla-prosecutor/

"The stand-your-ground law is one portion of justifiable use of deadly force," veteran prosecutor Angela Corey said. "And what that means is that the state must go forward and be able to prove it's case beyond a reasonable doubt... So it makes the case in general more difficult than a normal criminal case."
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
17,303
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londojowo.hypermart.net
Ummm, that statement has me confused. Did the father not live with the new wife yet? If not, why again was he there? If the Dad lived with the new wife and TM was staying with them, then at least TM has justification for being in the neighborhood.

The father did not live with the girlfriend in Sanford, he is a resident of Miami.
 

Geosurface

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2012
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...or what actually hapapened, which gives us one less hoodrat thug off the streets. At this point we KNOW trayvon was a small time drug dealer, we KNOW he was involved in robberies, we KNOW he had gang tattoos, and based on these facts I'm fine with getting to pay for one less person through our penal system.

I've agreed with what you've said up to this but you went too far here.

Please keep in mind that he might have straightened his act out, and I'm sure he did have plenty of good things about him.

I don't believe in the death penalty, if that gives you any insight into where I'm coming from.

It's easy to assume he would've just kept becoming more and more of a criminal and a thug (assault on bus driver if true, and assault on Zimmerman seem to indicate an increasing pattern of violence) but we don't know that's where he was headed. I mourn for the lost opportunity to find his way again in life.

Ultimately it would have been better for the cops to show up slightly earlier, or a neighbor to grow a pair, and T to be pulled off Z, and taken to jail that night. Hopefully it would've acted as a catalyst for T to change his behavior, and direction, and for Z to use more caution going forward.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
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Shouldn't your desire be to determine who was reckless, and why this all came out? I.E. desire to find justice?

Your bias towards charging zimmerman with something... anything... is so abundantly clear throughout this thread.

I do personally feel he was reckless in pursuit, but I dont know if given the evidecne or Florida law he can be charged with it.

I want a full investigation and thanks to the public outcry we will get it.

I dont think the shooting was racially motivated and think Zimmerman may have had a right to defend himself if his account is accurate and lines up with the evidence.

You on the other hand are disgusting in my opinion celebrating the death of a "hoodrat"

I think Zimmerman has more compassion for Martin and his family than you do.
 

Geosurface

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2012
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what makes it extremely bizarre to me that he RAN AWAY when asked what he was doing there.

I think you got your timeline mixed up, at the point where he ran they had not yet conversed, is my understanding. The only conversation was directly prior to the assault.
 
Sep 7, 2009
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I've agreed with what you've said up to this but you went too far here.

Please keep in mind that he might have straightened his act out, and I'm sure he did have plenty of good things about him.

I don't believe in the death penalty, if that gives you any insight into where I'm coming from.

It's easy to assume he would've just kept becoming more and more of a criminal and a thug (assault on bus driver if true, and assault on Zimmerman seem to indicate an increasing pattern of violence) but we don't know that's where he was headed. I mourn for the lost opportunity to find his way again in life.

Ultimately it would have been better for the cops to show up slightly earlier, or a neighbor to grow a pair, and T to be pulled off Z, and taken to jail that night. Hopefully it would've acted as a catalyst for T to change his behavior, and direction, and for Z to use more caution going forward.


This is truly outside the scope of this thread, but it is my personal opinion that once you're and adult and caught stealing jewelry, have gang tattoos up on your neck, are violently attacking people, and selling drugs that you will be of no positive benefit for society.
 

Puddle Jumper

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
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Those of us on Anandtech who believe George Zimmerman is guilty of wrongfully shooting an unarmed kid and that he should be held accountable are not alone. 73% of the participants of this poll think that George should be arrested.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/26/justice/florida-teen-shooting-poll/index.html

Thankfully the U.S. doesn't charge people based on public opinion. I would have voted that Zimmerman was in the wrong when this thread started but now that more information has come out it seems like the shooting was justified.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
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Obviously you're ignoring what the new State's Attorney has stated about this case.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_...rge-zimmerman-may-not-be-easy-fla-prosecutor/


I am not ignoring anything, I dont have the time or inclination to investigate caselaw and every avenue he could be charged in Florida.

I have stated time and time again, given florida law he may walk.

What I do want is to ensure its investigated for any liable wrongdoing.

The only thing I have actually stated as a core belief that is in Duty to retreat states I think he would be charged.

So while I post my opinion I concede its my opinion and have never stated otherwise merly looking at it from all angles.

What I do know for sure Had zimmerman stayed in his car and allowed the police to handle it Martin would be alive.
 

JS80

Lifer
Oct 24, 2005
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Not only is Zimmerman a Mexican he's a registered democrat. This gets better and better.