UK Seeks Ability to Block Websites Nationwide Without Notice

TruePaige

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2006
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Francis Davey writes about it at his site http://www.francisdavey.co.uk/2009/12/government-wants-new-powers-to-block.html

Just over a week ago I wrote a fairly dry legal analysis of the Digital Economy Bill. I spotted an extremely serious provision — clause 11 — in the version being discussed in the House of Lords. Having looked at the amendments (which you can find on the Bill's document page) I am worried that no-one in Parliament appears to be taking the problem serious.

What is the problem with clause 11 that I am getting so alarmed about it? It amends the Communications Act 2003 to insert a new section 124H which would, if passed, give sweeping powers to the Secretary of State. It begins:

(1) The Secretary of State may at any time by order impose a technical obligation on internet service providers if the Secretary of State considers it appropriate in view of—

Pausing there. Note that this says nothing at all about copyright infringement. For example the power could be used to:

* order ISP's to block any web page found on the Internet Watch Foundation's list
* block specific undesireable sites (such as wikileaks)
* block specific kinds of traffic or protocols, such as any form of peer-to-peer
* throttle the bandwidth for particular kinds of serivce or to or from particular websites.

In short, pretty much anything.

I do not exagerrate. The definition of a "technical obligation" and "technical measure" are inserted by clause 10:

A "technical obligation", in relation to an internet service provider, is an obligation for the provider to take a technical measure against particular subscribers to its service.

A "technical measure" is a measure that— (a) limits the speed or other capacity of the service provided to a subscriber; (b) prevents a subscriber from using the service to gain access to particular material, or limits such use; (c) suspends the service provided to a subscriber; or (d) limits the service provided to a subscriber in another way.

As you can see blocking wikileaks is simply a matter of applying a technical measure against all subscribers of any ISP.

Surely something must limit this power you ask? It seems not. The Secretary of State may make an order if "he considers it appropriate" in view of:

(a) an assessment carried out or steps taken by OFCOM under section 124G; or (b) any other consideration.

Where "any other consideration" could be anything. To their credit the Tories do seem to have realised that this particular alternative is overly permissive. Lord Howard of Rising and Lord de Mauley have proposed (in the first tranche of amendments proposed that the "or" be replaced by an "and".

What astonishes me is that there is no obligation for the Secretary of STate to even publish such an order, let alone subject it to the scrutiny of Parliament, yet he could fundamentally change the way the internet operates using it. Other orders made under other parts of the Bill will have to be made by statutory instrument and most will require Parliamentary approval. Not this one.

The only other amendment that has so far been tabled that might restrict the powers of the Secretary of State under clause 11 appears in a third tranche proposed by the liberal democrat Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer which deletes the paragraph (b) from the definition of a technical measure (i.e. "limits the service provided to a subscriber in another way") which does put some bounds, although not very tight bounds on what an imaginative Secretary of State might do.

The government is not at all imaginative. In their explanatory notes they envisage:

The government envisages that the criteria for taking a technical measure against a particular subscriber would be the same as the criteria used to determine whether the subscriber' s alleged infringements are included in a copyright infringement list under the initial obligations. So a technical measure would be applied if a subscriber had been linked to a number of CIRs sufficient to place them on a serious infringers list.

Note very well: they expect to use the power against the guilty and the innocent (of copyright infringement) equally.

The problem, I think, is that people are skim-reading the Bill and thinking that this part has to do with copyright infringement. Clause 11 is nestled between provisions about notifications of copyright infringement (the "strikes" idea) and the technical obligations code. People seem to be assuming that the Clause 11 power will only get used in that context but there is nothing in the Bill to make that so. As fellow blogger Julian Todd pointed out the government froze the funds in the Landsbanki bank using powers contained in the Anti-terrorism, Crime and Security Act 2001. A future government might well think "that's a useful power" and use it for almost anything. Let us hope that the Lords wake up to this fast. I have much less hope of the Commons.


Full, unabated control to do as he pleases over the internet for UK residents in the hands of one man sounds Orwellian.

If you hear a little static coming through your speakers next time you are online that is just the wires rubbing together from the rock fisted grip the UK has on your communications.

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200910/ldbills/001/10001.13-19.html#j158
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200910/ldbills/001/10001.i-ii.html
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
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You just don't understand the culture of the UK. The public is already used to be treating like peasants and having power concentrated onto one person - the Queen (may the Lord forever shine upon her magnificence).

You need to apply 19th century values to the UK, not 21st nor 20th century values.
 

coloumb

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,069
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China already does this... really sucks when you can't access youtube, facebook, etc... and other deviant websites as well. :)
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
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I thought we had this going on in the US as well. Obama trying to get passed some "shut down the internet if I say so" provision regarding security?
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
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I thought we had this going on in the US as well. Obama trying to get passed some "shut down the internet if I say so" provision regarding security?

But it's for your safety! You don't love terrorists do you? :eek:

Crackpot stuff like this gets proposed in Congress all the time. The difference between the UK and the US is that here it gets shot down (rightfully) pretty quickly. I guess the British just love being subservient to the government. Weird.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
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But it's for your safety! You don't love terrorists do you? :eek:

Crackpot stuff like this gets proposed in Congress all the time. The difference between the UK and the US is that here it gets shot down (rightfully) pretty quickly. I guess the British just love being subservient to the government. Weird.

I was trying to tie what Obama was doing with the craziness of the uk. The uk is already lost. Let's not follow their footsteps.
 

TruePaige

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2006
9,874
2
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I was trying to tie what Obama was doing with the craziness of the uk. The uk is already lost. Let's not follow their footsteps.

But these violations of civil liberties are disgusting. Horribly unnerving.

I have some people I chit chat with in the UK, one from Italy recognizes the problem, the life long UK citizens don't get it though...when you are used to living in a box, a slightly smaller box doesn't seem so bad.

Dystopia, eat your heart out!
 
Jun 26, 2007
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Again, like you have been told a lot before, this is a suggestion to a bill that might or might not even be presented.

You do know that those kinds of things are presented in every nation around the globe and that there are examples of them presented in the US that reminds you of Nazism or Stalinism?

From an official this would be a good thing to report, from a blog about something that might be presented by someone to pass three levels...

You're up to your old tricks again and it's just as pathetic now as it was the last time.

I do understand how you want to deflect from the idiotic reasoning behind sending MORE soldiers to Afghanistan though.

Obama is going down the same fucking drain and unfortunantly, come the 10/1 - 10 i'll be there defending his reatardedness.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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I was trying to tie what Obama was doing with the craziness of the uk. The uk is already lost. Let's not follow their footsteps.

Actually, we are not living in constant fear, which is why i, unlike you, don't have to wonder if i need to keep a chambered round in my gun on by my side at home, or wether someone will attack.

It must be hell to live in such fear at all times, i'm not even that scared when i'm in a war zone.

THIS is what brought on Iraq war, well that and a sheitload of forged evidence by Tony.

I will make no exuses for him, my hope is that he ends up homeless and i get to give him the treatment he saw fit for others.

Fucking pufta.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
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Actually, we are not living in constant fear, which is why i, unlike you, don't have to wonder if i need to keep a chambered round in my gun on by my side at home, or wether someone will attack.

Of course you're living in fear you chicken shit little pussy. If you weren't, your government wouldn't be trying to keep tabs on everyone living there at all times. Your whole island is full of little girls who piss themselves at the thought of anything remotely scary.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
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Of course you're living in fear you chicken shit little pussy. If you weren't, your government wouldn't be trying to keep tabs on everyone living there at all times. Your whole island is full of little girls who piss themselves at the thought of anything remotely scary.

You mean like warrantless wiretaps, information tapping from all sources at all times including a legal IP register, the Patriot act?

Seriously, you're a slave who wishes he wasn't a slave so much that he looks to other nations decisions to justify his own slavery.

The truth is, none of that has passed in the UK and it never will, it will have to pass three other instances, as it is, it's a suggestion not even presented yet.

Your restictions are already in action.

We, as a population ousted Blair for his lying to go to war, what did you do?

You cowered some more and elected a saviour from terror.

You may think you are a nation of hardarses but there are only two in the world, the UK and ... Austalia.

You're pathetic.
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
12,404
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But these violations of civil liberties are disgusting. Horribly unnerving.

I have some people I chit chat with in the UK, one from Italy recognizes the problem, the life long UK citizens don't get it though...when you are used to living in a box, a slightly smaller box doesn't seem so bad.

Dystopia, eat your heart out!

That's because the Italians eventually overthrew their monarchy but the British continue to be crushed by their barbaric caste system. The people accept their positions as peasants while in Italy that would be a foreign concept today.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
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You mean like warrantless wiretaps, information tapping from all sources at all times including a legal IP register, the Patriot act?

Seriously, you're a slave who wishes he wasn't a slave so much that he looks to other nations decisions to justify his own slavery.

The truth is, none of that has passed in the UK and it never will, it will have to pass three other instances, as it is, it's a suggestion not even presented yet.

Your restictions are already in action.

We, as a population ousted Blair for his lying to go to war, what did you do?

You cowered some more and elected a saviour from terror.

You may think you are a nation of hardarses but there are only two in the world, the UK and ... Austalia.

You're pathetic.

Australia is no longer a free country and the UK hasn't been for a long time. And I've never seen a brit who wouldn't get his ass kicked by your average American Redneck.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
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I was trying to tie what Obama was doing with the craziness of the uk. The uk is already lost. Let's not follow their footsteps.

This is why net neutrality is such a bad thing. As soon as you allow government to assert its regulatory authority over the internet, it is only one step away from filter content.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
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Australia is no longer a free country and the UK hasn't been for a long time. And I've never seen a brit who wouldn't get his ass kicked by your average American Redneck.

As a person proud to be a redneck I can confirm what you say. Some of the guys I know might not be well educated but they spend their lives working hard, getting drunk after work, and beating the crap out of people. The funny thing is one guy I know is mean as hell to people , works as a bouncer , but he loves kittens and cats. Weird to see him pummel someone one minute then pet a cat and talk to it the next minute.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
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This is why net neutrality is such a bad thing. As soon as you allow government to assert its regulatory authority over the internet, it is only one step away from filter content.

They can already take control of it under the homeland security laws, they just need a valid reason so they can't just block a site because they don't like it, needs to be a threat somehow.

They will never stop the spread of information though. Wifi is too easy to setup and can run without the internet if you get enough people.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
0
0
They can already take control of it under the homeland security laws, they just need a valid reason so they can't just block a site because they don't like it, needs to be a threat somehow.

They will never stop the spread of information though. Wifi is too easy to setup and can run without the internet if you get enough people.

That is what they said about radio/tv when the federal government started licensing frequencies (a good thing) but now use that authority to regulate content (a bad thing)
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,168
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Cant have anyone like Doctor Michael Savage bringing up things like the truth?? Only government lies will be accepted on the Internet. When the State is controlling the press you have no democracy at all.