Ugh, Christian intervention @ my house tonight! Live!

[AreaCode707]

I loved my high school youth group and wouldn't trade those memories and experiences for the world. A lot of my very best friends are people I met there.

I didn't get real connected to a Christian group in college. I visited a few but eh, none of them struck me as people I wanted to hang out with.

So youth groups work for some people at some stages of their life, and not for others. I'm not sure why some people are getting so worked up over this.

 

[zinfamous]

This thread seems to have "aroused" a lot of interest.

yeah, I get a stiffy sometimes thinking about all the fun we had in our youth group. :sneaky:

 

[darkswordsman17]

So youth groups work for some people at some stages of their life, and not for others. I'm not sure why some people are getting so worked up over this.

Its because of both different perceptions and different experiences. You can't understand because you had a positive experience. Others have had a not at all positive experience. Then you get people like Phineas and Malak who act like people only bash because its religion, and others that bash it because of what they've seen it be.

The people I knew mostly didn't like it, in large part because they were forced to go to it and felt it was a waste of time. The ones that did like it did so because their friends were there and so they just hung out while ignoring the rest. The ones that kept with it through high school did it because they got to get out of school to go on trips to events.

 

[IcePickFreak]

I get angry too. But I am not a Christian because some prick told me I was going to hell otherwise. You can't ever assume that anyone on this earth is perfect or doesn't make mistakes. There are a lot of terrible churches out there, and I'd rather people not go to church at all if they can't find a good one. Being a Christian isn't about church, but having a group of people that you can count on is definitely necessary. Luckily in most parts of the world, even where it is illegal to be Christian, you can find such a group.

So you're saying Anthony the Great isn't really Saint Anthony because he was all about prayer and lived in isolation for 13 years with only prayer to keep him from the devils temptations of boredom, laziness, and masturbation? I mean other than the odd person sliding food thru the door he didn't talk to anyone, what a horrible Christian.

Us non-worthy ones find hobbies where we meet and socialize with other people instead of making up a reason.

"Oh no I'm going to hell because I missed bowling Wednesday with Patty, Bill, Sue, and Mike!" is essentially what you've reduced Christianity to.

 

[Malak]

So you're saying Anthony the Great isn't really Saint Anthony because he was all about prayer and lived in isolation for 13 years with only prayer to keep him from the devils temptations of boredom, laziness, and masturbation? I mean other than the odd person sliding food thru the door he didn't talk to anyone, what a horrible Christian.

Us non-worthy ones find hobbies where we meet and socialize with other people instead of making up a reason.

"Oh no I'm going to hell because I missed bowling Wednesday with Patty, Bill, Sue, and Mike!" is essentially what you've reduced Christianity to.

Way to take things to the ridiculous extreme just to formulate some semblance of an insult.

As to Anthony, I have no reason to call him a saint, that's a catholic tradition. The word saint isn't in my bible. And his story only seems to strengthen what I said, not argue against it.

 

[Evadman]

youth

he's 22

Since when is 22 youth?

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

So you're saying Anthony the Great isn't really Saint Anthony because he was all about prayer and lived in isolation for 13 years with only prayer to keep him from the devils temptations of boredom, laziness, and masturbation? I mean other than the odd person sliding food thru the door he didn't talk to anyone, what a horrible Christian.

Us non-worthy ones find hobbies where we meet and socialize with other people instead of making up a reason.

"Oh no I'm going to hell because I missed bowling Wednesday with Patty, Bill, Sue, and Mike!" is essentially what you've reduced Christianity to.

Nothing against St. Anthony, but St. Paul, the writer of a good deal of the NT tells Christians that they should meet together and encourage one another.

Christianity recognizes that we are social beings and need interaction with others.

 

[AreaCode707]

Its because of both different perceptions and different experiences. You can't understand because you had a positive experience. Others have had a not at all positive experience. Then you get people like Phineas and Malak who act like people only bash because its religion, and others that bash it because of what they've seen it be.

The people I knew mostly didn't like it, in large part because they were forced to go to it and felt it was a waste of time. The ones that did like it did so because their friends were there and so they just hung out while ignoring the rest. The ones that kept with it through high school did it because they got to get out of school to go on trips to events.

I had a negative experience going to 4H, that I was forced to go to and where mostly people ignored me or were cliquish and deliberately unfriendly. Oh, and if I stopped going I got annoying "recruiting" calls, roughly akin to the OP's topic (though not directly parallel, admittedly.) Still, it was one group where I lacked interest in the topic and had nothing in common with the attendees. I don't hate the organization for it and I don't have the need to respond with bashing.

People who want religious types to live and let live often don't do a very good job of it in return.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

I had a negative experience going to 4H, that I was forced to go to and where mostly people ignored me or were cliquish and deliberately unfriendly. Oh, and if I stopped going I got annoying "recruiting" calls, roughly akin to the OP's topic (though not directly parallel, admittedly.) Still, it was one group where I lacked interest in the topic and had nothing in common with the attendees. I don't hate the organization for it and I don't have the need to respond with bashing.

People who want religious types to live and let live often don't do a very good job of it in return.

I don't know what 4H is, but ANY organisation that cannot just leave you alone is worth blasting for their practice.

Especially if you have expressed your lack of interest and they want to have an intervention with you because of it. Interventions should be reserved for close family and friends to get REAL problems into the open.

I'm also fairly certain that you agree with me on this.

 

[zinfamous]

Nothing against St. Anthony, but St. Paul, the writer of a good deal of the NT tells Christians that they should meet together and encourage one another.

Christianity recognizes that we are social beings and need interaction with others.

Saul/Paul was also a gay-hating racist sonofabitch. He came around well after Jesus was dead, so anything he says really, honestly, shouldn't be taken that seriously. Not that the message above is bad, but Paul is, at best, a tertiary source when it comes to Jesus' message.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

Its because of both different perceptions and different experiences. You can't understand because you had a positive experience. Others have had a not at all positive experience. Then you get people like Phineas and Malak who act like people only bash because its religion, and others that bash it because of what they've seen it be.

The people I knew mostly didn't like it, in large part because they were forced to go to it and felt it was a waste of time. The ones that did like it did so because their friends were there and so they just hung out while ignoring the rest. The ones that kept with it through high school did it because they got to get out of school to go on trips to events.

My son likes it because there are fun activities, and the kids and leaders are nice. He really admires how devoted they are and how openly they talk about their faith.

He goes because he wants to, not because I force him.

He's going to this particular youth group because he met some of the kids when he was volunteering at a faith based community health care outreach, and they invited him.

He's had an opportunity to play in the worship band and he's enjoyed that too.

 

[Malak]

Its because of both different perceptions and different experiences. You can't understand because you had a positive experience. Others have had a not at all positive experience. Then you get people like Phineas and Malak who act like people only bash because its religion, and others that bash it because of what they've seen it be.

I think a lot would admit they do only bash it because it is religion. I have been very vocal about my dislike of religion as well. I'm not stupid enough to believe all youth groups, or churches for that matter, are worth going to.

The people I knew mostly didn't like it, in large part because they were forced to go to it and felt it was a waste of time. The ones that did like it did so because their friends were there and so they just hung out while ignoring the rest. The ones that kept with it through high school did it because they got to get out of school to go on trips to events.

I only went to youth group because of my friends there too. Statistically, youth groups do not retain kids beyond high school. It is because parents treat youth groups just like school. They shove their kids in it and tell them they need to go because it is good for them, but can offer no actual explanation why and don't do anything to support the idea at home.

Luckily, my parents didn't force me. Once I was old enough to be home alone, I could stay home if I wanted to. But once you know God is there, it can be difficult to stay away. Hard to find God when the church you go to has nothing to do with him though, and it isn't surprising if people had bad experiences.

 

[Bateluer]

Dog dare you to walk in on them wearing nothing but a glass of bourbon.

This requires Youtube. Preferably with some Satanic memorabilia in the video. :

 

[preslove]

Saul/Paul was also a gay-hating racist sonofabitch. He came around well after Jesus was dead, so anything he says really, honestly, shouldn't be taken that seriously. Not that the message above is bad, but Paul is, at best, a tertiary source when it comes to Jesus' message.

Given how much what paul says varies from what we think the historical jesus said/stood for, I personally think that in a world inhabited by powerful supernatural gods and demons, its more likely that some evil spirit/satan is who actually spoke to paul and knocked him off his donkey on the road to damascus. Of course, I don't believe in supernatural beings and other fairy tales.

 

[IcePickFreak]

Way to take things to the ridiculous extreme just to formulate some semblance of an insult.

As to Anthony, I have no reason to call him a saint, that's a catholic tradition. The word saint isn't in my bible. And his story only seems to strengthen what I said, not argue against it.

How am I taking it to ridiculous extremes? You stated your opinion pretty clearly, which was a pretty bold statement.

 

[TheVrolok]

Sounds like somebody being trained to only enjoy the things their teachers tell them to. I prefer living life and learning from my mistakes, rather than being trained creature of my parents.

So then being an angsty non-conformist troublemaker is a novel idea? I most likely fit more into your upbringing than Malak's, but man, it's just a different side of the same coin.

 

[TheVrolok]

You know, the person least qualified to be objective about something is the guy who is actually drinking the kool-aid.

I would agree with Malak and I'm an atheist... perhaps borderline deist.

 

[rasczak]

oh my, i'm glad I got the chicken pox at sunday school. My mom never let me go again.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

So then being an angsty non-conformist troublemaker is a novel idea? I most likely fit more into your upbringing than Malak's, but man, it's just a different side of the same coin.

Thinking for yourself rather than being brainwashed into a religion from childhood that you get to keep for the rest of your days is a bad thing?

You don't have to be an angsty non-conformist to think for yourself, one day, you might understand that.

 

[TheVrolok]

Thinking for yourself rather than being brainwashed into a religion from childhood that you get to keep for the rest of your days is a bad thing?

You don't have to be an angsty non-conformist to think for yourself, one day, you might understand that.

What are you talking about..? Who said anything about being an angsty non-comformist as the only way to think for oneself? Did it ever occur to you that some people chose religion.. dare I say it.. voluntarily?

 

[preslove]

What are you talking about..? Who said anything about being an angsty non-comformist as the only way to think for oneself? Did it ever occur to you that some people chose religion.. dare I say it.. voluntarily?

It's pretty rare, in the modern age. People may switch denominations, but actually adopting a completely new religion is not a common occurrence. Just leaving the church is a lot more common.

 

[TheVrolok]

It's pretty rare, in the modern age. People may switch denominations, but actually adopting a completely new religion is not a common occurrence. Just leaving the church is a lot more common.

You may be right, the rest of ATOT seems to agree, but do you have any data whatsoever that supports this belief? That people are rarely voluntarily religious? It's a pretty ballsy statement to make.

 

[PhineasJWhoopee]

Thinking for yourself rather than being brainwashed into a religion from childhood that you get to keep for the rest of your days is a bad thing?

In your opinion, what constitutes "brainwashing" a child?

 

[preslove]

You may be right, the rest of ATOT seems to agree, but do you have any data whatsoever that supports this belief? That people are rarely voluntarily religious? It's a pretty ballsy statement to make.

Religiosity and church attendance has been declining for a long time. If more people were adopting christianity, the major religion of the us, then the trend would be reversed. Basically, old school, main line protestantism is shrinking in the US, with some moving towards hardcore evangelism, but the rest not attending church.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_tren.htm

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Well fun is subjective, but what you described doesn't sound fun at all. Concerts, card games, and tping houses tends to be more universally fun

So you had fun being a douche?