U.S. Manufacturing up.

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,306
3
0
OP, you still have a chance to redeem yourself. Redemption will include atonement, apology, and posting of charts that look beyond a few quarters. Include how manufacturing has "grown" in the last two decades and bonus points if you include its change over time as a percentage of the GDP.

I'll do it for you:

772484-130489188705039-Ronald-Rutherford_origin.jpg
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
probably means more people are working at fast food joints than ever before

That may be the case but has nothing to do with manufacturing (Bush tried that and was kicked back). Manufacturing dropped so low from 2007-2009 that there was literally no place to go but up a little. Let's see long term results before popping the cork....
 

Schadenfroh

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2003
38,416
4
0
Include how manufacturing has "grown" in the last two decades and bonus points if you include its change over time as a percentage of the GDP.
Manufacturing causes pollution, low-skilled jobs and a heap of other problems. In America, we value our quality of life, environment, plants and animals over dirty, polluting, electricity draining, factories ran by corrupt corporate overlords that would use our children's blood to toil shackled to assembly lines if they could. That is why we are becoming a pure service economy with small, hometown farmers. Much better to work in a farmer's market selling locally grown produce than to work in a coal mine or a crowded assembly line breathing in deadly fumes.

All of the R&D will be conducted here (high-paying science and engineering jobs), then we hand the plans over to countries that waller in their own filth by expanding their manufacturing capabilities. Let them destroy their own scenic landscapes, deplete all of their natural resources and chop down all their trees.

The organic movement is really taking off, soon all of our communities will grow their own food, so there will be no need to have those big mechanized farms that produce poison rather than food. To heck with growing it that way to export, we should not even be sending that kind of food to starving children overseas.

With solar panels, wind, organic local farming, bicycles and all of the high-tech R&D jobs we could possibly ever want from companies Apple Computer, we will lead the world in quality of life. Who needs heavy industry or industrialized farming?

Once our society is corrected via wealth redistribution and social engineering methods on the part of our federal government, everyone will have an equal opportunity to become a scientist or engineer. If not for our society's failures, the minds of the next generation would have the same potential to do great things and become great scientists. Everyone is born with the same physical and mental potential, to think otherwise would lead us down a path of hate. We just lead them astray at an early age due to their exposure to nationalism, racism, sexism, tobacco, violence, profanity, pornography, religion or a host of other ills.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
31,545
9,904
136
Manufacturing causes pollution, low-skilled jobs and a heap of other problems. In America, we value our quality of life, environment, plants and animals over dirty, polluting, electricity draining, factories ran by corrupt corporate overlords that would use our children's blood to toil shackled to assembly lines if they could. That is why we are becoming a pure service economy with small, hometown farmers. Much better to work in a farmer's market selling locally grown produce than to work in a coal mine or a crowded assembly line breathing in deadly fumes.

All of the R&D will be conducted here (high-paying science and engineering jobs), then we hand the plans over to countries that waller in their own filth by expanding their manufacturing capabilities. Let them destroy their own scenic landscapes, deplete all of their natural resources and chop down all their trees.

The organic movement is really taking off, soon all of our communities will grow their own food, so there will be no need to have those big mechanized farms that produce poison rather than food. To heck with growing it that way to export, we should not even be sending that kind of food to starving children overseas.

With solar panels, wind, organic local farming, bicycles and all of the high-tech R&D jobs we could possibly ever want from Apple Computer, we will lead the world in quality of life. Who needs heavy industry or industrialized farming?

not necessarily. you can have skilled, well-paying manufacturing jobs, but that does mean your costs will be higher. see germany.

the reason we have no manufacturing is because we have short-term capitalism. everyone looks to see how they can improve profits *now.* sure, it might send GDP up, but GDP is an estimate of *total* wealth, not how it's distributed. and yes, the "middle class" has largely been the group that's been screwed by all this. not to mention there's been an obvious decline in product quality by the attempt to make "barely good enough" product for the american market (tainted children's toys, drywall, etc.)

the longer-term effect of doing this, of course, is that by shipping manufacturing overseas, you are gutting your own country from the inside out. there's virtually no way you can compete with a 10x cost in labor difference, so once one person goes, everyone else has to start following.

i would rather have tariffs, a strong domestic manufacturing base, and higher prices, than to see our own companies destroy this country.

james goldsmith called it 17 years ago: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PQrz8F0dBI
 

DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
Manufacturing causes pollution, low-skilled jobs and a heap of other problems. In America, we value our quality of life, environment, plants and animals over dirty, polluting, electricity draining, factories ran by corrupt corporate overlords that would use our children's blood to toil shackled to assembly lines if they could. That is why we are becoming a pure service economy with small, hometown farmers. Much better to work in a farmer's market selling locally grown produce than to work in a coal mine or a crowded assembly line breathing in deadly fumes.

All of the R&D will be conducted here (high-paying science and engineering jobs), then we hand the plans over to countries that waller in their own filth by expanding their manufacturing capabilities. Let them destroy their own scenic landscapes, deplete all of their natural resources and chop down all their trees.

The organic movement is really taking off, soon all of our communities will grow their own food, so there will be no need to have those big mechanized farms that produce poison rather than food. To heck with growing it that way to export, we should not even be sending that kind of food to starving children overseas.

With solar panels, wind, organic local farming, bicycles and all of the high-tech R&D jobs we could possibly ever want from Apple Computer, we will lead the world in quality of life. Who needs heavy industry or industrialized farming?

oLOLOLOL

Is this straight out of the democrats handbook for why pushing for the exporting of jobs from the US is okay? Hey everyone free research jobs for everyone and if we run out then you can be a cashier at a fast food place which is equally as good. iNirvana is just around the corner being sold at the local Apple Store, never mind the made in China sticker on it.
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
Manufacturing causes pollution, low-skilled jobs and a heap of other problems. In America, we value our quality of life, environment, plants and animals over dirty, polluting, electricity draining, factories ran by corrupt corporate overlords that would use our children's blood to toil shackled to assembly lines if they could. That is why we are becoming a pure service economy with small, hometown farmers. Much better to work in a farmer's market selling locally grown produce than to work in a coal mine or a crowded assembly line breathing in deadly fumes.

All of the R&D will be conducted here (high-paying science and engineering jobs), then we hand the plans over to countries that waller in their own filth by expanding their manufacturing capabilities. Let them destroy their own scenic landscapes, deplete all of their natural resources and chop down all their trees.

The organic movement is really taking off, soon all of our communities will grow their own food, so there will be no need to have those big mechanized farms that produce poison rather than food. To heck with growing it that way to export, we should not even be sending that kind of food to starving children overseas.

With solar panels, wind, organic local farming, bicycles and all of the high-tech R&D jobs we could possibly ever want from Apple Computer, we will lead the world in quality of life. Who needs heavy industry or industrialized farming?

Not sure if serious or not. Everyone can be an engineer is so....right? See my sig (3rd line down if so).

Edit: Nevermind, I just re-read part of what you posted. I need new batteries in my reading and sarcasm meters.
 
Last edited:

Murloc

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2008
5,382
65
91
Manufacturing causes pollution, low-skilled jobs and a heap of other problems. In America, we value our quality of life, environment, plants and animals over dirty, polluting, electricity draining, factories ran by corrupt corporate overlords that would use our children's blood to toil shackled to assembly lines if they could. That is why we are becoming a pure service economy with small, hometown farmers. Much better to work in a farmer's market selling locally grown produce than to work in a coal mine or a crowded assembly line breathing in deadly fumes.

All of the R&D will be conducted here (high-paying science and engineering jobs), then we hand the plans over to countries that waller in their own filth by expanding their manufacturing capabilities. Let them destroy their own scenic landscapes, deplete all of their natural resources and chop down all their trees.

The organic movement is really taking off, soon all of our communities will grow their own food, so there will be no need to have those big mechanized farms that produce poison rather than food. To heck with growing it that way to export, we should not even be sending that kind of food to starving children overseas.

With solar panels, wind, organic local farming, bicycles and all of the high-tech R&D jobs we could possibly ever want from Apple Computer, we will lead the world in quality of life. Who needs heavy industry or industrialized farming?
sounds like utopia.

I think that no one is gonna give up cheap fast food forever. Rich countries have always produced big quantities of food in mechanized farms.

Anyway there's still space for manufacturing in developed countries, and that is stuff that has lots of added value. High technology stuff. It doesn't have to be dirty, you can run a robotized plant producing solar panels using nuclear power. You get pricey stuff that requires pricey engineering and pricey machinery.
Leave the clothes to the chinese, and voilà. They can't do some of the stuff developed countries can.

In Switzerland there is almost no classical mass manufacturing like building materials, metallurgy, and clothing, but we export lots of stuff, in the automotive sector for example. Or watches.
 

boomerang

Lifer
Jun 19, 2000
18,890
642
126
Manufacturing causes pollution, low-skilled jobs and a heap of other problems. In America, we value our quality of life, environment, plants and animals over dirty, polluting, electricity draining, factories ran by corrupt corporate overlords that would use our children's blood to toil shackled to assembly lines if they could. That is why we are becoming a pure service economy with small, hometown farmers. Much better to work in a farmer's market selling locally grown produce than to work in a coal mine or a crowded assembly line breathing in deadly fumes.

All of the R&D will be conducted here (high-paying science and engineering jobs), then we hand the plans over to countries that waller in their own filth by expanding their manufacturing capabilities. Let them destroy their own scenic landscapes, deplete all of their natural resources and chop down all their trees.

The organic movement is really taking off, soon all of our communities will grow their own food, so there will be no need to have those big mechanized farms that produce poison rather than food. To heck with growing it that way to export, we should not even be sending that kind of food to starving children overseas.

With solar panels, wind, organic local farming, bicycles and all of the high-tech R&D jobs we could possibly ever want from companies Apple Computer, we will lead the world in quality of life. Who needs heavy industry or industrialized farming?

Once our society is corrected via wealth redistribution and social engineering methods on the part of our federal government, everyone will have an equal opportunity to become a scientist or engineer. If not for our society's failures, the minds of the next generation would have the same potential to do great things and become great scientists. Everyone is born with the same physical and mental potential, to think otherwise would lead us down a path of hate. We just lead them astray at an early age due to their exposure to nationalism, racism, sexism, tobacco, violence, profanity, pornography, religion or a host of other ills.
I think one more term with Obama at the helm and all this will be the norm. Eh, maybe two more terms.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
some pertinent links on the subject. As I have said for a long time, productivity is the key to competing with low wages companies. Rapidly rising wages in china is making is making them much less attractive.

http://www.bcg.com/media/PressReleaseDetails.aspx?id=tcm:12-75973

Within the next five years, the United States is expected to experience a manufacturing renaissance as the wage gap with China shrinks and certain U.S. states become some of the cheapest locations for manufacturing in the developed world, according to a new analysis by The Boston Consulting Group (BCG).

With Chinese wages rising at about 17 percent per year and the value of the yuan continuing to increase, the gap between U.S. and Chinese wages is narrowing rapidly. Meanwhile, flexible work rules and a host of government incentives are making many states—including Mississippi, South Carolina, and Alabama—increasingly competitive as low-cost bases for supplying the U.S. market.

“All over China, wages are climbing at 15 to 20 percent a year because of the supply-and-demand imbalance for skilled labor,” said Harold L. Sirkin, a BCG senior partner. “We expect net labor costs for manufacturing in China and the U.S. to converge by around 2015. As a result of the changing economics, you’re going to see a lot more products ‘Made in the USA’ in the next five years.”


http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2011/05/manufacturing-stages-comeback.html

The chart above helps tell the story of manufacturing's comeback this year. Compared to the overall real growth rate of the U.S. economy during the first quarter of 2011 at 1.8%, the manufacturing sector is growing at 9%, or five times faster than the overall economy (based on the annual growth rate of Industrial Production: Manufacturing series from the Federal Reserve).

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...lifies-surge-in-productivity-across-u-s-.html

“Manufacturing is leading the whole economy,” said Paulsen, whose firm oversees about $340 billion. U.S. manufacturers “had to find religion. They’ve really cleaned up their balance sheets. What is left is the cream of the crop.”

...

Foreign companies increasingly see the attraction of having operations in America. Siemens is spending $170 million to expand a gas-turbine factory in Charlotte, North Carolina, that will manufacture the turbines “at the end of the year cheaper than we can make them in Shanghai,” Spiegel said. “It’s a good time to be adding new production capability in the U.S.”
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
31,545
9,904
136
some pertinent links on the subject. As I have said for a long time, productivity is the key to competing with low wages companies. Rapidly rising wages in china is making is making them much less attractive.

http://www.bcg.com/media/PressReleaseDetails.aspx?id=tcm:12-75973




http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2011/05/manufacturing-stages-comeback.html



http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...lifies-surge-in-productivity-across-u-s-.html

i'll believe the shift back to USA when i see it. AFAIK, companies are now looking to find the next cheapest place after china (vietnam is kinda popular) since chinese wages are rising so quickly.
 

sMiLeYz

Platinum Member
Feb 3, 2003
2,696
0
76
Who knows what is going to happen in 2015, but if the Yuan keeps appreciating and the dollar remains low you will see a real protracted boom in manufacturing in the US.

But this is a validation of Bernanake's quantitative easing policies, that he was able to force the Chinese to appreciate the yuan through inflationary pressures.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
i'll believe the shift back to USA when i see it. AFAIK, companies are now looking to find the next cheapest place after china (vietnam is kinda popular) since chinese wages are rising so quickly.

That is entirely possible, but at the same time US manufacturing has really leaned out and is much better geared to compete against low wages areas.