Two satellites collide in orbit

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
We haven't even got a colony off the planet and we are already filling orbit with junk.
17,000 pieces of junk that we put there all circling at thousands of miles per hour.
At least we are consistent. Pollute the water, air, land, and space.



http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...sc/satellite_collision
CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla. ? Two big communications satellites collided in the first-ever crash of two intact spacecraft in orbit, shooting out a pair of massive debris clouds and posing a slight risk to the international space station.

NASA said it will take weeks to determine the full magnitude of the crash, which occurred nearly 500 miles over Siberia on Tuesday.

"We knew this was going to happen eventually," said Mark Matney, an orbital debris scientist at Johnson Space Center in Houston.

NASA believes any risk to the space station and its three astronauts is low. It orbits about 270 miles below the collision course. There also should be no danger to the space shuttle set to launch with seven astronauts on Feb. 22, officials said, but that will be re-evaluated in the coming days.

The collision involved an Iridium commercial satellite, which was launched in 1997, and a Russian satellite launched in 1993 and believed to be nonfunctioning. The Russian satellite was out of control, Matney said.

The Iridium craft weighed 1,235 pounds, and the Russian craft nearly a ton.

No one has any idea yet how many pieces were generated or how big they might be.

"Right now, they're definitely counting dozens," Matney said. "I would suspect that they'll be counting hundreds when the counting is done."

As for pieces the size of micrometers, the count will likely be in the thousands, he added.

There have been four other cases in which space objects have collided accidentally in orbit, NASA said. But those were considered minor and involved parts of spent rockets or small satellites.

Nicholas Johnson, an orbital debris expert at the Houston space center, said the risk of damage from Tuesday's collision is greater for the Hubble Space Telescope and Earth-observing satellites, which are in higher orbit and nearer the debris field.

At the beginning of this year there were roughly 17,000 pieces of manmade debris orbiting Earth, Johnson said. The items, at least 4 inches in size, are being tracked by the U.S. Space Surveillance Network, which is operated by the military. The network detected the two debris clouds created Tuesday.

Litter in orbit has increased in recent years, in part because of the deliberate breakups of old satellites. It's gotten so bad that orbital debris is now the biggest threat to a space shuttle in flight, surpassing the dangers of liftoff and return to Earth. NASA is in regular touch with the Space Surveillance Network, to keep the space station a safe distance from any encroaching objects, and shuttles, too, when they're flying.

"The collisions are going to be becoming more and more important in the coming decades," Matney said.

Iridium Holdings LLC has a system of 65 active satellites which relay calls from portable phones that are about twice the size of a regular mobile phone. It has more than 300,000 subscribers. The U.S. Department of Defense is one of its largest customers.

The company has spare satellites, and it is unclear whether the collision caused an outage. An Iridium spokeswoman had no immediate comment.

Initially launched by Motorola Inc. in the 1990s, Iridium plunged into bankruptcy in 1999. Private investors relaunched service in 2001.

Iridium satellites are unusual because their orbit is so low and they move so fast. Most communications satellites are in much higher orbits and don't move relative to each other, which means collisions are rare.

Iridium Holdings LLC, is owned by New York-based investment firm Greenhill & Co. through a subsidiary, GHL Acquisition Corp., which is listed on the American Stock Exchange. The shares closed Wednesday down 3 cents at $9.28.
 

AMCRambler

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2001
7,718
31
91
I guess NASA better get to work on shield generators or better hull plating, lol.

SHIELDS!!!!
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,997
31,568
146
Yet another piece of Russian junk f**king up a perfectly functional, and productive, piece of property.

I imagine all of the other useless and impoverished Russian satellites are going to gang-up and start collectivising their neighboring productive and economically stable international satellites.

The bourgeoise satellites that resist will be banished to the Gulag, or shattered into thousands of tiny space bits.
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Originally posted by: sao123
Awesome Video simulation of the crash...



with as many perpendicular orbits as we have, im surprised this doesnt happen mroe often.

I remember asking my science teacher about this in 4th grade. He laughed at me and said there was plenty of space in orbit. F'k you Mr 4th grade science teacher man. F'k you.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
They really need to come up with a solution for the junk before it gets worse. At the rate we are going there will be so much junk up there that you will not be able to have anything up there without it being hit.
I read that china made it a lot worse when they blew up that satellite last year. Right now there is no accountability for what is up there, litter all you want. Got an old satellite you don't need, no problem, just launch another and forget about the old one.

If you want to see how congested it really is with just satellites, they have aviewer here:
http://science.nasa.gov/realti...track/3d/JTrack3D.html


It shows just 900 of the 2500 up there and it looks like a mess to have to watch.

 

tk149

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2002
7,253
1
0
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: sao123
Awesome Video simulation of the crash...



with as many perpendicular orbits as we have, im surprised this doesnt happen mroe often.

I remember asking my science teacher about this in 4th grade. He laughed at me and said there was plenty of space in orbit. F'k you Mr 4th grade science teacher man. F'k you.

LOL! I asked the same question and got the same answer!
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,246
2
0
Originally posted by: Modelworks
They really need to come up with a solution for the junk before it gets worse. At the rate we are going there will be so much junk up there that you will not be able to have anything up there without it being hit.
I read that china made it a lot worse when they blew up that satellite last year. Right now there is no accountability for what is up there, litter all you want. Got an old satellite you don't need, no problem, just launch another and forget about the old one.

If you want to see how congested it really is with just satellites, they have aviewer here:
http://science.nasa.gov/realti...track/3d/JTrack3D.html


It shows just 900 of the 2500 up there and it looks like a mess to have to watch.

Yeah but compared to say the Square footage of the immediate low, medium and high orbits to the volume of the satellites how much space is really taken up? Thats like saying "theres a ton of ships in the ocean, way too many, we need to get rid of some ships" every time two collide.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
Originally posted by: RichardE



Yeah but compared to say the Square footage of the immediate low, medium and high orbits to the volume of the satellites how much space is really taken up? Thats like saying "theres a ton of ships in the ocean, way too many, we need to get rid of some ships" every time two collide.


It isn't the satellites in use that is the problem, it is all the junk , like from satellites that are not in use. Right now they have to track 20,000 pieces of junk + satellites to make sure nothing is going to collide. And as this collision showed they can't keep track 100%.

The problem is accountability, right now there is none.
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
12,656
207
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the most important question right now is how do we clear out all the space junk?
 

AeroEngy

Senior member
Mar 16, 2006
356
0
0
Originally posted by: Modelworks
Originally posted by: RichardE



Yeah but compared to say the Square footage of the immediate low, medium and high orbits to the volume of the satellites how much space is really taken up? Thats like saying "theres a ton of ships in the ocean, way too many, we need to get rid of some ships" every time two collide.


It isn't the satellites in use that is the problem, it is all the junk , like from satellites that are not in use. Right now they have to track 20,000 pieces of junk + satellites to make sure nothing is going to collide. And as this collision showed they can't keep track 100%.

The problem is accountability, right now there is none.

The problem is the stuff that is to small to track. We might be tracking 20,000 objects but we can not track the stuff that is the size of a baseball or smaller that can still take out functioning satellites.

Ever see the pictures of small paint chips embedded inches deep in the space shuttles windshield. Very small objects moving very fast are equally dangerous.

This problem has been modeled and some suggest that if mitigation measures are not rigorously implemented and the number of satellites increase at the current rate then these collisions/explosions can have a cascade effect rendering certain regions of space unusable.
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
12,656
207
106
Originally posted by: Zaitsev
Originally posted by: RichardE
Originally posted by: sao123
the most important question right now is how do we clear out all the space junk?

beam them back! :D

Appropriate answer is nuke them from orbit.

The correct answer is we need a way to successfully de-orbit all the space junk so it can all fall on our heads. Its raining Saturn V stages...
 

Alone

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2006
7,490
0
0
No biggie. We have a spare for the Iridium 33 up there, as well as some on land ready to go.