Two honest questions for Biden supporters

[Blackjack200]

Don't want to make this a poll because I wanted people to respond freely. I won't argue or challenge your answer, just honestly curious on this.

1. Do you primarily support Biden because you believe he has a better chance than Sanders of beating Trump in the general election? For example, if you were presented with convincing evidence that the opposite was true, would you change your vote? (I don't have this evidence, it's just a thought exercise)

2. If "yes" to #1, do you believe that's specifically the case for Biden, or do you think any; most; or all of Sanders's other major primary opponents would have also had a better chance against Trump?

To be upfront, my own answer if this question was reversed is "no". My support of Sanders is not based on how I think he would fare against Trump (I know, not a big surprise).

 

[UberNeuman]

I think you need to support the person you believe in.

 

[woolfe9998]

1. Yes and yes. Evidence that would convince me would be Sanders getting historic record turnout of millennial voters in the primary, which did not happen.

2. Most, yes.

 

[esquared]

1) Biden has a better chance than Bernie in beating the orange menace.
Fat ass cheeto must be defeated at all costs. The country, may not survive, if we get another 4 years
of his "perfect phone calls and 10/10 virus responses".

2. I think that of all the candidates, Biden stood the best chance. We will not beat the orange menace
without full/majority support of the African Americans voters. Only Biden has this majority/plurality support.
African American women, single-handedly, turned out in force to take out Roy Moore when he ran for senator in that special election
in Alabama.
We all better hope its just like that.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/retropolis/wp/2017/12/16/long-before-sinking-roy-moores-candidacy-black-women-in-alabama-have-been-a-force/

 

[Perknose]

1. Yes and Yes. We simply MUST prevent Trump from winning a second term, at all costs. THIS is a national emergency.

2. Being a well known, white, male moderate who also has tremendously strong support in the African American community, Biden had/has the very best chance by far of all the Dem candidates of defeating Trump. You may not like this state of affairs, but that's the state of socio-political consciousness in America at this time. Times are changing and things are shifting, due to demographics, but here in 2020, Biden is our Great White Hope. He is also a thoroughly decent human being. That counts for me.

 

[HomerJS]

1. Yes
2. My early 1st choice was Mayor Pete. He failed to gain traction in the black community which is required to make it pas the primary. I think that could change for the future if he spent off season time with a few issues critical to us such as voting rights. Show up often and people will give you a chance.

Sanders would have been the walking dead in the general. Very easy to lampoon. "Bernie wants to raise your taxes to give free college and free healthcare to illegals". That alone would sink him

 

[Fanatical Meat]

1) I voted Bernie on Super Tuesday because at the time Biden appeared to be running on fumes, I was wrong.....
2) I’m comfortable with Biden, I realize he will disappoint with some things but not all things. I feel Biden is a good middle choice that many can get behind and to defeat a President maximum support will be required.
2.1) I do not want another 4 years of “Fuck You Libs” coming from the White House.

 

[UNCjigga]

1. Yes, I believe Biden has a better path to victory vs. Trump. Biden has demonstrated increased turnout in Michigan and North Carolina—states we need to win. He’s demonstrated a broad coalition of voters, from working class whites to blacks to college educated and boomers. Conversely, the primary data we have thus far shows that while Sanders is winning the youth vote, youth are not turning out in larger numbers.

2. I would have assumed Warren would have an easier path to beat Trump *IF* she became the nominee. I don’t know of any other candidate who could draw out both moderates and progressives. She has better policy cred, she’s younger and quite a shrewd debater. But alas, she’s also a woman which means she has Hillary syndrome vs. Trump and she couldn’t win a single state in a crowded field.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

OP you should check this link out

4 takeaways from Joe Biden's sweep of Arizona, Florida and Illinois

Former Vice President Joe Biden has a near-insurmountable lead over Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders after sweeping Tuesday's primaries in Arizona, Florida and Illinois.

www.cnn.com

 

[ch33zw1z]

1. Yes, I believe Biden has a better path to victory vs. Trump. Biden has demonstrated increased turnout in Michigan and North Carolina—states we need to win. He’s demonstrated a broad coalition of voters, from working class whites to blacks to college educated and boomers. Conversely, the primary data we have thus far shows that while Sanders is winning the youth vote, youth are not turning out in larger numbers.

2. I would have assumed Warren would have an easier path to beat Trump *IF* she became the nominee. I don’t know of any other candidate who could draw out both moderates and progressives. She has better policy cred, she’s younger and quite a shrewd debater. But alas, she’s also a woman which means she has Hillary syndrome vs. Trump and she couldn’t win a single state in a crowded field.

Ditto. I voted Sanders in the primary, but it looks like Biden in the gen.

 

[Uhtrinity]

I've always liked Biden and think he is the best to beat Trump (best vs poll numbers). Do I find him an exciting candidate? Not really, but he means well and is qualified for the job. I also like Bernie a lot, but I don't think he can make most of his platform happen. Biden can as he is a bit more moderate, though Bernie and the other candidates have pulled him a bit more to the left. Same thing for most of the other dem candidates this cycle, I could have easily gotten any of them other than maybe Gabbard.

 

[ewdotson]

The whole "perceived electability" thing is certainly a significant factor. I was in the group of voters who was waffling between Biden and Warren. (I was in the Harris/Warren camp before Harris dropped out.) It's a shame given what a good president I think Warren would be, but her struggles in the primary spoke for themselves.

To be honest though, I doubt that there's all that much of a true "electability" differential between the various candidates. I'll admit that part of the reason Sanders ranked towards the bottom of the field for me is that I find that the cult of personality around him viscerally repulses me. I *do* appreciate how he's dragged the Democratic party to the left though. I'm basically fine with incremental change since I think that's the best we can hope for regardless of which Dem might end up in the Oval Office (given the way that Congress [doesn't] work). And while I know you have grave doubts about this, I do think Biden *will* give us that incremental change in the right direction. Because the party *has* changed.

That said, I'll very much echo what some of the other folks here have said. Another significant factor in my Biden vote was explicitly to amplify the votes of Southern Black women. As an Alabamian, I saw everything squared described first hand. And I'll note that while I'm sure you weren't in this category, I saw a lot of folks who were all "trust Black women" up until it became clear that a significant majority of them weren't all that interested in their favored candidate, at which point they switched over to a lot of patronizing criticism. Which was a *really* shitty take.

 

[UNCjigga]

It looks like Bernie is under tremendous pressure to drop out—not from the Party/DNC, but from states with upcoming primaries who’d prefer to cancel them. He’s assessing his campaign and is likely to suspend, if not outright drop out.

 

[Moonbeam]

Decent and intelligent people like Biden are the reason we are where we are at today, with a Trump Presidency. The left abandoned its roots in the working poor and politically economic and socially disadvantaged to cater to the hope of the middle class that they would become members of the 1%. They bought into the notion that appealing to fear engendered greed and the need for good political propaganda that supports it is the only way to win. It's the middle class that votes and politics is the art of the possible, and what is possible to people with small moral values isn't much. So the race to the bottom began, with the Republicans far out ahead, and the Democrats mightily struggling to catch up. Vote Democrat and you can still be rich, we will do what we can also just to pretend we will regulate wall street business. Let the best of our psychopath business school graduates light our down path. We give you two doors to the slaughter house. There's one of the far right and one somewhat left of it. And never mention that word socialism.

I would say fuck you all, but you beat me to it. Oh and be sure to buy toilet paper before the next guy. Have to go now. I think I hear a hog call. Close the curtains if you can. It might be upsetting watching all the piggies eat each other alive.

 

[eelw]

Canadian here. So not just restoring Obama level of normalcy, Biden will be able to repair damage with relationships with other countries. Obama/Trudeau friendship restored. No longer the saying “our country’s ties lie deeper than the two current leaders”. They will no longer have to bite their tongue when they are sitting beside the orange monkey in the Oval Office when he makes a moronic comment.

But baby steps. EO everything in past 3 years and then slowly listen to what Bernie has to say.

 

[JEDIYoda]

• Yes and Yes. We simply MUST prevent Trump from winning a second term, at all costs. THIS is a national emergency. -- it was easier to copy and paste!!

 

[Thump553]

Why won't Bernie supporters see reality? His campaign is over, he lost fair and square (the votes came from people not the Establishment).

The place Bernie should be now is back in the Senate getting some input in on the GOP one trillion dollar unfunded giveaway.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

This election is about Trump, the Democrat candidate for the Presidency is irrelevant.

Anyone who believes this is about policy is fooling themselves.

 

[vi edit]

Bernie claimed and the online buzz was that he could turn out the vote. He didn't.
Nearly every key state that Team Blue needs to take to secure the EC Biden thumped Bernie. This election could very well come down to which way NC swings. And I know which candidate has a better chance there.

Bernie had very little voter turnout in key demographics that secure EC wins. It's not that have unwavering support in Biden, I'm simply looking at the scoreboard.

 

[JEDIYoda]

This election is about Trump, the Democrat candidate for the Presidency is irrelevant.

Anyone who believes this is about policy is fooling themselves.

actually anybody who is worried about policy is probably going to vote for Trump.......lets be real!

 

[JEDIYoda]

Bernie claimed and the online buzz was that he could turn out the vote. He didn't.
Nearly every key state that Team Blue needs to take to secure the EC Biden thumped Bernie. This election could very well come down to which way NC swings. And I know which candidate has a better chance there.

Bernie had very little voter turnout in key demographics that secure EC wins. It's not that have unwavering support in Biden, I'm simply looking at the scoreboard.

With Bernie we could actually be seeing a Democratic Trump......
Nothing Bernie has said has came to pass....think about that one!!

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I think you need to support the person you believe in.

"Belief" won't get you a dime for a cup of coffee. You might think it does, of you don't regard the dismal folly of the Trump "presidency" as an existential threat in several dimensions, or if you really like your politics "WWWF"-style -- something no sane patriot 250 years past or hence would countenance. Well -- maybe Nathan Bedford Forrest or some such clown, but that's no sane patriot.

There is too much "belief" circulating within and without our politics. God is not part of the Constitution; it is a contract between "We the People" to form a "More perfect Union". God was only invoked in the Declaration of Independence because such was the tradition and habit of authors or statemen of the time who dealt with Sovereigns who might cling to the Divine Right of Kings. Hobbes did it; Locke did it. The authors of the Declaration did it.

Property is not "God-given" -- the rights are assigned by the State and the Law.

So Libertarianism, White Supremacism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, "So-shal-ism" are all ideologies, and people put their faith in ideologies -- lazy crutches for True Believers.

You can believe in people if they have a track-record for public service. Trump doesn't have a track-record of public service. Even his track-record for charitable activities is a fraud. Trump doesn't believe in anything, but his followers -- True Believers -- either believe in Trump, or hate everyone else.

You can "know" that you have different "toolboxes" to solve problems -- that's near-certain and not whimsical "belief".

If you want to belief in something regarding the day-to-day and long-term policies of self-governance, believe in three things:
-- Common Sense
-- The Constitution of the United States of America
-- The general Principle, namely -- The Rule of Law

The "Socialist" label makes Sanders vulnerable to the Fascist Incumbent, much practised in spinning the Big Lie. And Sanders, who carries the day with expounding Moral Issues of our time, is too inflexible in his old age. His inflexibility is woven together with Belief. For that, Biden has his better moments, and at least has a childhood disability to excuse for his occasional gaffes and confusion.

Win the White House. Win the Senate. Put the Wrongdoers behind bars. Forge a policy plan that folds Sanders, Biden and the rest into a solid proposal.

And hopefully, we shall all live another year to see it happen.

So -- Yes to #1. Changing at the last moment really isn't an option: The People -- chose Biden even if I voted for Bloomberg. I voted for Bloomberg, but I would be happy with many of Sanders' policy proposals.

As for #2 and the "rest of them", I suspect that some of them had a better chance than Sanders, and some of them bring the question to its brink, with marginal poll results over Trump. Warren may have been one of those. But -- I would be happy with many of her proposals!

Apparently, the Inner Circle of Demon-worshipping Trumpers believe Biden has the best chance to win, or they wouldn't have wasted resources and credibility on the "Ukrainian back-channel", and Trump wouldn't have risked prosecution during or after an impeachment or an electoral defeat.

We commend ourselves to the Almighty! Let slip the dogs of campaign war!

 

[hal2kilo]

Yes and yes.
Early voted for Warren, would have switched to Biden seeing the surge.

 

[Jhhnn]

This election is about Trump, the Democrat candidate for the Presidency is irrelevant.

Anyone who believes this is about policy is fooling themselves.

It's very much about policy. Small gubmint trickle down Capitalism has failed spectacularly.

 

[theeedude]

I am not a huge Biden fan, but Sanders is too much of a demagogue for me. I'd gladly vote for him over Trump though.