Trump's Obsession With Coal

[woolfe9998]

Latest news is Trump killing Interior Department study about the health impact of certain coal mining techniques.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/22/politics/appalachian-coal-mining-health-study/index.html

But I'm more interested in the wider issue of why Trump wants to prop up an industry which has lost almost all its jobs to automation over the past several decades, and is now being supplanted by clean energy which is less expensive and on the rise.

https://cleantechnica.com/2016/12/2...-cost-of-wind-power-coal-nuclear-natural-gas/

Setting aside the issue of climate change - because too much heat is apparently a concern exclusively of elitist, out of touch liberals - how is propping up an industry which is being phased out by the market consistent with the philosophy of American free market conservatism? Aren't we supposed to let failing industries die?

Coal production is only a significant part of the economy in Wyoming and W. Virginia, two states which will never vote against Trump. I can't even see the political advantage.

 

[dank69]

This is why:
http://theweek.com/speedreads/719868/trump-accused-breaking-promise-coal-industry-ceo

 

[woolfe9998]

This is why:
http://theweek.com/speedreads/719868/trump-accused-breaking-promise-coal-industry-ceo

I don't know. If Trump is trying to prop up wealthy owners and shareholders of coal and related industries, it seems rather arbitrary. The clean energy industry is growing and they will become the next "monied interest" to curry favor. I think this is some sort of cultural thing where conservatives are against it if liberals are for it. Translating that to Trump, if Obama was for it, he's against it. It may just not be any more rational than that.

 

[dank69]

I don't know. If Trump is trying to prop up wealthy owners and shareholders of coal and related industries, it seems rather arbitrary. The clean energy industry is growing and they will become the next "monied interest" to curry favor. I think this is some sort of cultural thing where conservatives are against it if liberals are for it. Translating that to Trump, if Obama was for it, he's against it. It may just not be any more rational than that.

Yeah it is both. The Obama factor is the primary factor but the criticism is also a factor. Same thing happened with Charlottesville. He avoided criticizing the Nazis until the media wouldn't let him ignore it anymore, then put out a minimal statement against them, and then walked it right back when David Duke spoke out against him.

Everything he does it seems his primary concern is his image. Getting back at Obama and the liberals just stems from that.

 

[K1052]

I don't know. If Trump is trying to prop up wealthy owners and shareholders of coal and related industries, it seems rather arbitrary. The clean energy industry is growing and they will become the next "monied interest" to curry favor. I think this is some sort of cultural thing where conservatives are against it if liberals are for it. Translating that to Trump, if Obama was for it, he's against it. It may just not be any more rational than that.

That's already happened. Lots of R state electeds in the midwest and mountains would look very unfavorably into getting their wind industry cut into buy new coal subsidies. Also the Powder Basin mining interests who have much lower cost per ton and natural gas guys would line up against it.

 

[Blackjack200]

I don't know. If Trump is trying to prop up wealthy owners and shareholders of coal and related industries, it seems rather arbitrary. The clean energy industry is growing and they will become the next "monied interest" to curry favor. I think this is some sort of cultural thing where conservatives are against it if liberals are for it. Translating that to Trump, if Obama was for it, he's against it. It may just not be any more rational than that.

That's how special interests work. If you're a coal CEO, you try to protect your profits from cleaner, more economic energy sources by corrupting public officials. All the bullshit about the miners themselves is a ridiculous side show.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Interior Dept. halts study into Appalachian mining technique's likely health hazards
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/22/politics/appalachian-coal-mining-health-study/index.html

The Trump administration has halted a study of the health effects of a common mining technique in Appalachia, which is believed to deposit waste containing toxic minerals in ground waters.

SO
MUCH
WINNING!!!!!

 

[brycejones]

Interior Dept. halts study into Appalachian mining technique's likely health hazards
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/22/politics/appalachian-coal-mining-health-study/index.html



SO
MUCH
WINNING!!!!!

The good news is the GOP has a plan. It is focused on patient centered healthcare so if any of those people does get sick from the vapors (can't say it was the coal industry since the study was never completed) they will be able to choose all the health care they can afford on their less than $10 an hour job.

 

[fskimospy]

I don't know. If Trump is trying to prop up wealthy owners and shareholders of coal and related industries, it seems rather arbitrary. The clean energy industry is growing and they will become the next "monied interest" to curry favor. I think this is some sort of cultural thing where conservatives are against it if liberals are for it. Translating that to Trump, if Obama was for it, he's against it. It may just not be any more rational than that.

I genuinely don't think he thinks about politics or policy in that way. The coal people like him and are his friends/on his team, therefore he wants to use the power of government to reward them. The renewable energy people hate him and are the enemy, therefore they need to be punished.

I genuinely think if somehow tomorrow the coal people decided they hated him and the solar industry started holding pro-Trump rallies he would start going after coal and pumping up renewables. All he cares about is himself.

 

[pauldun170]

From that CNN article.

The Interior Department acknowledged in a statement that it had "put on hold" $1 million in funding for the two-year project as part of a review of its grants, which is focused on "responsibly using taxpayer dollars."

Isn't the whitehouse pulling this on all grants that might have that "Black President" smell to it?
Labeling it as a review to see if it passes the Trump\Pence (WWJD) test? Tell people its for "responsible use of taxpayer money" or something?
If Obama started a program to develop a warp drive and we had working prototypes Trump probably would have halted work on that as well.
Doesn't say whether it officially shitcanned or not. Just says "sit on your hands and screw people over for a little while. Maybe we will turn spigot after everyone fills out their loyalty oath.

 

[K1052]

I genuinely don't think he thinks about politics or policy in that way. The coal people like him and are his friends/on his team, therefore he wants to use the power of government to reward them. The renewable energy people hate him and are the enemy, therefore they need to be punished.

I genuinely think if somehow tomorrow the coal people decided they hated him and the solar industry started holding pro-Trump rallies he would start going after coal and pumping up renewables. All he cares about is himself.

Too bad for them the people Trump appointed will never bail out appalachian coal. Pruitt loves fracking more than a mother loves her children and Perry has been in the pocket of drillers and increasingly wind developers for a long time.

 

[woolfe9998]

I genuinely don't think he thinks about politics or policy in that way. The coal people like him and are his friends/on his team, therefore he wants to use the power of government to reward them. The renewable energy people hate him and are the enemy, therefore they need to be punished.

I genuinely think if somehow tomorrow the coal people decided they hated him and the solar industry started holding pro-Trump rallies he would start going after coal and pumping up renewables. All he cares about is himself.

Sadly, this is probably accurate.

Trump can't save coal though. Solar and wind are cheaper. It's just a matter of building it, and that's being done aggressively. The sooner these coal miners who are clutching at Trump like a security blanket realize this, the better.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Vouching for coal will basically get you tons of rural support that depend on it. Not surprising, since it's a topic and area that all liberals want to shun and throw under the bus

Not that I support this - it's ultimately the dumbest shit of all time. Coal is losing because it costs way too much to produce when there are way better means to get oil/gas via fracking. No matter what, no one is going to buy coal for substantially more cost than what you can get with natural gas. It's the definition of insanity to think otherwise.

 

[zinfamous]

Vouching for coal will basically get you tons of rural support that depend on it. Not surprising, since it's a topic and area that all liberals want to shun and throw under the bus

Not that I support this - it's ultimately the dumbest shit of all time. Coal is losing because it costs way too much to produce when there are way better means to get oil/gas via fracking. No matter what, no one is going to buy coal for substantially more cost than what you can get with natural gas. It's the definition of insanity to think otherwise.

Coal represents something like 10% or less of the actual jobs in West Virginia, Kentucky, wherethefuckever, yet campaigning and lobbying groups want you and I to think that this entire region will fall to ashes as soon as coal is gone. It's a ludicrous proposition, and literally millions of dollars are spent simply on perpetuating this absurd lie...simply so that a handful of people can maintain power and endless profits on the tiny remaining shreds of the industry that remain for them.

I'd bet that well over half the so-called rural people that do give support to the GOP, because of coal-based arguments, have no actual ties to coal. They just see "Regular folks like me!" that are probably suffering, legitimately, and assume that they are next (it's easy when you convince them that the big evil enemy--The GUBMENT!--literally hates them and exists only to steal their houses and kick their dogs).

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Coal represents something like 10% or less of the actual jobs in West Virginia, Kentucky, wherethefuckever, yet campaigning and lobbying groups want you and I to think that this entire region will fall to ashes as soon as coal is gone. It's a ludicrous proposition, and literally millions of dollars are spent simply on perpetuating this absurd lie...simply so that a handful of people can maintain power and endless profits on the tiny remaining shreds of the industry that remain for them.

I'd bet that well over half the so-called rural people that do give support to the GOP, because of coal-based arguments, have no actual ties to coal. They just see "Regular folks like me!" that are probably suffering, legitimately, and assume that they are next (it's easy when you convince them that the big evil enemy--The GUBMENT!--literally hates them and exists only to steal their houses and kick their dogs).

Eh, I don't live in rural areas, and comparing the number of jobs coal produces in the entire state isn't relevant facts. The question is simply are these coal jobs required to sustain livable rural areas or not - And I don't know the answer to that question.

A town can't survive off of just Walmart and McDonald jobs - so there has to be something to fill that void. If there isn't manufacturing or anything else similar, what else is there?

 

[Pens1566]

Less than 15k coal/related jobs in WV as of a few years ago.

 

[interchange]

Supporting coal makes him look like a good old fashioned American hero for the working class values of Republican voters.

It's a horrifically mistaken impression, but what about Trump's behavior has ever suggested that substance bears any relevance when image is good. Is it even possible that Trump himself doesn't know how wrong he is?

 

[fskimospy]

Eh, I don't live in rural areas, and comparing the number of jobs coal produces in the entire state isn't relevant facts. The question is simply are these coal jobs required to sustain livable rural areas or not - And I don't know the answer to that question.

A town can't survive off of just Walmart and McDonald jobs - so there has to be something to fill that void. If there isn't manufacturing or anything else similar, what else is there?

Interestingly enough, a far larger portion of WV's population works in health care than in coal, and lots of those are decent paying jobs. The Medicaid cuts that Trump/Republicans were proposing would not only have been devastating from a health perspective, the decline in federally financed health spending in WV would have been catastrophic from a jobs sense as well.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Interestingly enough, a far larger portion of WV's population works in health care than in coal, and lots of those are decent paying jobs. The Medicaid cuts that Trump/Republicans were proposing would not only have been devastating from a health perspective, the decline in federally financed health spending in WV would have been catastrophic from a jobs sense as well.

Again, what does the population of West Virginia (which includes large urban cities) have to do with rural areas that need jobs? A city can't survive off just Walmart and McDonald jobs.

 

[fskimospy]

Again, what does the population of West Virginia (which includes large urban cities) have to do with rural areas that need jobs? A city can't survive off just Walmart and McDonald jobs.

The largest city in West Virginia is Huntington, with a population of ~50,000 people. It's hard to think of any standard by which that counts as a 'large, urban city'.

Are you trying to say that health care jobs don't exist in rural areas? If so, what is this based on? I'm sure there are SOME rural areas where mining losses would affect them more significantly than health care losses but I'm aware of no evidence that this is generally true.

 

[JMC2000]

Again, what does the population of West Virginia (which includes large urban cities) have to do with rural areas that need jobs? A city can't survive off just Walmart and McDonald jobs.

Well, if you ask some Republicans (ones not from Appalachian areas), West Virginia is nothing more than rural coal towns.

Now, several warehousing and logistics companies are building massive facilities in some of those rural areas, mainly ones not on the side of a mountain, so there are jobs other than McDonald's and Walmart out there.

They're slowly popping up, but they are coming.

 

[Thebobo]

Interior Dept. halts study into Appalachian mining technique's likely health hazards
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/22/politics/appalachian-coal-mining-health-study/index.html



SO
MUCH
WINNING!!!!!

So sad. Ryan Zinke is a James Watt wanna be.

 

[brycejones]

Again, what does the population of West Virginia (which includes large urban cities) have to do with rural areas that need jobs? A city can't survive off just Walmart and McDonald jobs.

Why have coal jobs really disappeared? Do you see the trend ever reversing? If not instead of shitting on liberals for not caring what do you think should be done to provide sustainable employment in these areas instead of empty promises of jobs that will never come back?

 

[echo4747]

U.S. coal exports soar, in boost to Trump energy agenda, data shows:
who is buying much of this coal??? the UK and France (Paris climate accord countries)
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-coal-exports-idUSKBN1AD0DU

 

[Thebobo]

The largest city in West Virginia is Huntington, with a population of ~50,000 people. It's hard to think of any standard by which that counts as a 'large, urban city'.

Are you trying to say that health care jobs don't exist in rural areas? If so, what is this based on? I'm sure there are SOME rural areas where mining losses would affect them more significantly than health care losses but I'm aware of no evidence that this is generally true.

1 Charleston 50,404 51,400 −1.94% Kanawha
2 Huntington 48,807 49,138 −0.67% Cabell,



Love me some west by-god virginia, The good parts, Spruce knob, Dolly Sods, Otter creek Cranberry wilderness. WVA is what it is because of the collapse of the one horse industry, coal. And very dirty coal. The state and local politicians did nothing to help the residents in the transition away from coal.