Trump the Populist -- Seizing Land for The Wall

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ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
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By changing to ways the land could legally be used it became a taking. Just as this President is using the legal means to take property to use for the wall. Sorry if my interjections on the subject hurt your widdle feelings.
That might be a taking it it were private land. It's not a taking when the government owns it. I know that Trump doesn't seem to know the difference between his private business and his public office but it's really not all that hard a concept.
 
Jul 9, 2009
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That might be a taking it it were private land. It's not a taking when the government owns it. I know that Trump doesn't seem to know the difference between his private business and his public office but it's really not all that hard a concept.
So the people that had use of that land before the change in designation are just shit out of luck ? You know the people that used to be able to get wood, use vehicles, prospect, rock hound, use 4 wheel drive vehicles, hunt, fish etc.
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,414
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So the people that had use of that land before the change in designation are just shit out of luck ? You know the people that used to be able to get wood, use vehicles, prospect, rock hound, use 4 wheel drive vehicles, hunt, fish etc.
Did any of those people have a property right in the land?
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
68,854
26,646
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So the people that had use of that land before the change in designation are just shit out of luck ? You know the people that used to be able to get wood, use vehicles, prospect, rock hound, use 4 wheel drive vehicles, hunt, fish etc.
Did any of those people have a property right in the land?
Valid, existing mining claims would be honored as specified in the monument proclamations. The States of Utah and Nevada would continue to manage fish and wildlife, as specified in the proclamation. Roads are allowed. If Taj can demonstrate a property right in collecting wood from public lands he'll score one point. Otherwise, he'll still batting a perfect zero.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.go...on-establishment-gold-butte-national-monument

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.go...on-establishment-bears-ears-national-monument
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
13,209
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250k for a thousand acres of prime land in MD. That's not fair market in any real universe. How that was calculated from what I understand was that the price was based on the lowest possible valued land type when the location was actually worth many millions.

I don't know where you live but if you were given 5 or 10 dollars for every hundred worth of true market value you wouldn't be talking about emotional attachment would you?

Regarding Trump- the particular scenario was described and you considered it "fair" and so there's no problem with Trump doing it, at least by your statement.

I think Eminent Domain was an "at need" power and not a trick to acquire valuable property cheaply. Need and true fair market value.

YMMV.

?! That is totally not what I said. What you are saying is that the land owners are not compensated for by fair market value in practice (for which I am 100% behind them in support), not that the policy of compensation by fair market value is a flawed concept. I argued that Eminent Domain is laid out in the Constitution (yet attacked by ordinarily Constitution-loving folks for whatever reason), and that compensating for emotional attachment would open a pandora's box that no one would be happy about.

My personal view is that Eminent Domain is a neutral tool. It can be put to good use (which often goes unnoticed as you can imagine), or can be abused. It can be abused by stiffing landowners (which also goes often unnoticed, but at least people seem keenly aware of), or abused by lavishly compensating well-connected landowners (which goes totally unnoticed, unfortunately).

Thus it is of paramount importance that we elect responsible politicians and demand transparency if we were to ensure this Constitutional governing tool is not abused. And we elected Trump..
 
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flexy

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
8,464
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Trump is going to have His wall. It's His wall. All of it. A monument to Himself that speaks to everything it symbolizes. His own Little Great Wall of China, only a lot better. It will stand for centuries to come, a legacy to Trump's awesome vision for our future and a standard bearer for the values His nation and His people represent.

Should the wall ever be built, it will be torn down maybe as early as after the next elections. It will either be torn down officially, or "not so officially" by various groups/people in time...among the reasons the wall will be torn down, and only one of them, is that America will do everything to get rid of this most-awful memory of her most-awful period in politics history. It's actually ironic that I have no doubt in my mind that the wall will be torn down, before it is even built :)
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,478
6,901
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Should the wall ever be built, it will be torn down maybe as early as after the next elections. It will either be torn down officially, or "not so officially" by various groups/people in time...among the reasons the wall will be torn down, and only one of them, is that America will do everything to get rid of this most-awful memory of her most-awful period in politics history. It's actually ironic that I have no doubt in my mind that the wall will be torn down, before it is even built :)

Ala the Berlin Wall, if Trump's Wall gets the wrecking order, I'd like to go down there and have a few whacks at "Trump's Great Wall That Mexico Never Paid For" myself, and send Trump a nugget or two. It would be good for my soul. ;)

If anything, it would be to get revenge on the GOP and Trump for taking away the health care from those millions of folks who had it under the ACA and revenge for myself as the predicted exorbitant rise in deductibles and co-pays is going to hit me where it hurts.

And I'm still wondering if those folks from the Rust Belt learned a thing or two about putting their trust in a guy who was already known to be a pathological liar yet voted for him anyway.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
37,734
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If anything, it would be to get revenge on the GOP and Trump for taking away the health care from those millions of folks who had it under the ACA and revenge for myself as the predicted exorbitant rise in deductibles and co-pays is going to hit me where it hurts.

And I'm still wondering if those folks from the Rust Belt learned a thing or two about putting their trust in a guy who was already known to be a pathological liar yet voted for him anyway.

That sounds very hopey-changey. Dare to dream I guess.
 
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