Trump is banking that a majority of the public are idiots, dont fact check and thus will believe the lies he tells

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
29,391
2,736
126
im watching Trump live on TV and he's talking about his pending impeachment.
he's goes off msg (as usual) and spewing garbage about how he and Republican party are setting records in something or another and no one has ever seen #s like this before.

he thinks the majority of the public are uninformed idiots.
sure, other politicians also think this but he's the 1st major politician to blatantly tell outright outrageous lies and basically say to the public you're stupid and gullible.

and unfortunately, he's getting away with it. :(

no matter how many times credible news organizations call him out on his statements without listing proof and/or even proving what he said is a lie, the poll #s aren't moving against him.
 
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thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,944
2,173
126
People already know he's a liar...they don't care.

Apparently they're going to use librul tears to heat their homes and pay for medicare.
 
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soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
136
he thinks the majority of the public are uninformed idiots.
Unfortunately they are. I listened to some of the calls on C-Span and you wouldn't believe what they think, even some who "claim" to be Democrats.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,671
28,824
136
People already know he's a liar...they don't care.

Apparently they're going to use librul tears to heat their homes and pay for medicare.
Do they care if anyone lies to them on Trump levels or does not caring only apply to Trump?

Does that mean once Trump is gone they will go back to caring about things for which they gave Trump a pass? Won't that be tough for all the phony evangelicals?
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,944
2,173
126
Does that mean once Trump is gone they will go back to caring about things for which they gave Trump a pass? Won't that be tough for all the phony evangelicals?
They won't miss a beat...Trump was the Dem's fault anyway...or something.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
70,165
28,812
136
Trump is far from the first president to tell blatant lies. Reagan raised it to an art form, contradicting himself within single sentences.
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
2,872
136
Well duh. But actually I think it's not simply intelligence. A lot of smart folks will relentlessly defend something tied to their identity way outside of reality. Actually, being smarter can be a disadvantage in some cases since it would be easier for them to create faulty logic to try and maintain internal consistency or prey on the inherent faults of those challenging them to avoid examining their own beliefs. I wonder if ego-strength actually correlates with intelligence*, at least past a certain point.

*Intelligence is a complicated concept, not necessarily easy to capture in a measurable way, and there is plenty of reason to consider ego-strength a form of intelligence.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,581
50,768
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Well duh. But actually I think it's not simply intelligence. A lot of smart folks will relentlessly defend something tied to their identity way outside of reality. Actually, being smarter can be a disadvantage in some cases since it would be easier for them to create faulty logic to try and maintain internal consistency or prey on the inherent faults of those challenging them to avoid examining their own beliefs. I wonder if ego-strength actually correlates with intelligence*, at least past a certain point.

*Intelligence is a complicated concept, not necessarily easy to capture in a measurable way, and there is plenty of reason to consider ego-strength a form of intelligence.

Yes I think this is a good point, people don't swallow his lies because they are stupid (for the most part), they do it because of identity reasons. This of course makes their hatred of identity politics kind of ironic.

Everyone does this to some extent, just think about your reaction to a statement from someone you like vs. someone you hate, it could be the exact same words but depending on the source provoke dramatically different reactions.
 
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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
2,872
136
Yes I think this is a good point, people don't swallow his lies because they are stupid (for the most part), they do it because of identity reasons. This of course makes their hatred of identity politics kind of ironic.

Everyone does this to some extent, just think about your reaction to a statement from someone you like vs. someone you hate, it could be the exact same words but depending on the source provoke dramatically different reactions.

It's an important and necessary human mental function. We are stronger as a species organizing into groups. It's no surprise we're inherently programmed with biases to maintain group identifications. I often try to teach that, to me, there is no best way a human mind works. The healthiest minds are the ones with flexibility.

But I also think there is a lesson learned from applying this to Trump. What matters to Trump supporters is not Trump the person. It's Trump the symbol. And destroying a symbol that's mentally important to a person is a hard, hard task. Best is to identify what the symbol represents and try to provide a healthier alternative. This is also the reason why, after Trump is gone from the public spotlight, those who are his most ardent supporters today won't look back at it and recognize their own hypocrisy or even have completely false memories of their own impressions at the time.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,581
50,768
136
It's an important and necessary human mental function. We are stronger as a species organizing into groups. It's no surprise we're inherently programmed with biases to maintain group identifications. I often try to teach that, to me, there is no best way a human mind works. The healthiest minds are the ones with flexibility.

But I also think there is a lesson learned from applying this to Trump. What matters to Trump supporters is not Trump the person. It's Trump the symbol. And destroying a symbol that's mentally important to a person is a hard, hard task. Best is to identify what the symbol represents and try to provide a healthier alternative. This is also the reason why, after Trump is gone from the public spotlight, those who are his most ardent supporters today won't look back at it and recognize their own hypocrisy or even have completely false memories of their own impressions at the time.

Yes, I remember how after Obama was elected and the entire Bush Administration had basically collapsed into national disgrace it was amazing how many conservatives claimed to never have really supported him to begin with despite their fervent support just a few years earlier.
 

ShookKnight

Senior member
Dec 12, 2019
646
658
96
Let's cut the crap. His supporters know exactly what he is doing. And, they are OK with it, because it is pissing the 'right' people off.

One of these deplorables summed things up perfectly by stating; "He isn't hurting the right people". Excuse me bitch? Can you keep your bile down for a few seconds?

They can no longer save face and lie about their true intentions - because their current actions and past behavior are gross contradictions. I am not even talking about white lies and inconsistencies. These are flat out lies, followed by denial when called out, followed by downplaying and then they release / absolve each other of any wrong doing.

These aren't people who are looking for some greater good. Or what is best for this nation. They are looking to harm, punish, hurt and even kill those who are just plain opposite and different.

Liberals aren't the ones sending pipe bombs to former presidents. Liberals aren't the ones running over and murdering protesters. Liberals aren't throwing acid in people's faces. Liberals aren't the ones who allow pedophiles, rapists, murderers, traitors and greedy pieces of shit run free with no restraints.

And NONE of this is done due ignorance or unwillingness.
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
11,492
3,161
136
It will be interesting watching a Donald Trump second term.
They have a full plate on their to-do list.

To ban all abortion because if Donald Trump can't do at least THAT, then why the hell did the far right evangelist stick with trump in the first place?
The Wall.
Get even with democrats for the impeachment attempt.
Do something to harm the LGBTQ community. That is on the Mike Pence to-do list.
Dismantle the FBI.
Invite communist dictators into the Whitehouse.
Pass another tax cut for billionaires.
Install another Trumpie on the US Supreme Court to replace RBG.
And that is just the first year.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Given that I live in the south, a good chunk of the people that I know are pro-Trump. One of them brought up the impeachment at lunch the other day, and that sparked quite a conversation. Honestly, it pretty much boiled down to the same rhetoric that you'd hear back in 2016. It was that idea that "He doesn't sound like a politician. He says what's on his mind, and I like that." They're not trying to vote for someone competent at the job. They're voting for a personality.

When one suggested that he was a "great president", I asked a simple question, "What has he done to make him great?" There weren't really any great examples that couldn't just be easily retorted.
 

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
11,562
1,741
126
Doesn't matter. People don't care because most are fed up with Washington. I still think going after Trump was a HUGE mistake that will come back to bite the Dems. I guess something had to bo done, but lets get real. The Republicans were never going to vote to impeach Trump. Not in 10,000 years. Never! Now, we have an emboldened Trump whose going to seek revenge. And, this is where he is at his best. He's going to play the victim and his fan base is going to eat it up. The question is will he be able to convert the undecided voters. If he can do that he's a repeat 2020 POTUS.

I fully expect Trump to be a repeat president. I also expect to see a HUGE downturn by 2022-23. With automation on the horizon, the trade war with China Trump is going to be ill equipped to change our economic course. This will be a very good time to own a business, and to save as much money as possible. You want to be in a position to invest as much as possible.
 

thraashman

Lifer
Apr 10, 2000
11,103
1,550
126
The type of people who ever believed Trump and believe him now are unfortunately below human level intelligence. They're somewhere around the level of a howler monkey. Except somehow much, much more annoying when they're making sounds.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,205
10,865
136
im watching Trump live on TV and he's talking about his pending impeachment.
he's goes offtopic (as usual) and spewing garbage about how he and Republican party are setting records in something or another and no one has ever seen #s like this before.

he thinks the majority of the public are uninformed idiots.
sure, other politicians also think this but he's the 1st major politician to blatantly tell outright outrageous lies and basically say to the public you're stupid and gullible.

and unfortunately, he's getting away with it. :(

no matter how many times credible news organizations call him out on his statements without listing proof and/or even proving what he said is a lie, the poll #s aren't moving against him.
How do you think he got elected in the first place. Oh, but Hillary.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,114
136
I disagree with trying to put them all in one category, because I think there are essentially two categories of Trump supporters.

In sum, we can divide the supporters into two camps: those who have mental deficiencies, and those who have moral deficiencies.

Most of Trump's supporters are poorly educated white people. And contrary to what many people said in another thread about the topic of low education among his supporters, there is a strong population wide statistical correlation between education and IQ. Poorly educated and/or low IQ people tend not to trust politicians who say things that confuse them. They think they're being duped. Trump's "plain talk" (referred to in a post above) is easily mistaken for honesty by such people. They don't fact check first because some of them aren't very good at it, and second, because they have no inclination to. Their trust in Trump is instinctive. Just as is their trust of people like Hannity and Limbaugh who tell them that all of Trump's misdeeds are manufactured by democrats and the "liberal media." If people they instinctively trust tell them it's so, then it's so.

I think the skepticism which undergirds the assumption that all these people know Trump is a liar and don't care is one of personal incredulity. Those of us who don't support Trump simply can't believe that anyone would actually accept his bullshit as fact. To us, it's plainly obvious. But not to them. These are the same people who already believed in magical sky fairies and all kinds of outlandish conspiracy theories long before Trump ever came around. If they can believe in sky fairies, they can believe in Trump.

So far as the educated people who support Trump, which BTW includes all the GOP who sit in Congress, I have three words for such people, from the DSM: anti-social personality disorder. Because anyone who knows that the POTUS is corrupt, lying scumbag and continues to support him is very likely himself a corrupt, lying scumbag. And, BTW, these are the same corrupt, lying scumbags who are duping and manipulating the poorly educated Trump voters I already discussed.

Because we are a materialistic, greed-based culture, we breed sociopaths in large quantities. Accordingly, they form an important voting bloc and pool of candidates for a corrupt political party,.
 
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dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,635
3,507
136
Doesn't matter. People don't care because most are fed up with Washington. I still think going after Trump was a HUGE mistake that will come back to bite the Dems. I guess something had to bo done, but lets get real. The Republicans were never going to vote to impeach Trump. Not in 10,000 years. Never! Now, we have an emboldened Trump whose going to seek revenge. And, this is where he is at his best. He's going to play the victim and his fan base is going to eat it up. The question is will he be able to convert the undecided voters. If he can do that he's a repeat 2020 POTUS.

I fully expect Trump to be a repeat president. I also expect to see a HUGE downturn by 2022-23. With automation on the horizon, the trade war with China Trump is going to be ill equipped to change our economic course. This will be a very good time to own a business, and to save as much money as possible. You want to be in a position to invest as much as possible.

Yang knows how to deal with it. IMO we'd see more change with him than with Obama. Assuming Turtle is voted out of power.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,896
7,426
136
Many if not most of Trump's supporters are emotionally dependent on him.

He gave them "the feels" they were yearning for during those eight indescribably painful years of emotional drought, of the languishing they suffered through while that undeserving "who does he think he is" black guy sat in the Oval Office.

Trump arrived and told them everything they wanted to hear and then some to win his popularity contest in '16. His lies were like soothing salve that healed the emotional wounds that Obama struck them with. His hollow promises gave them hope. His racism brought out the nation's most despicable, vile creatures from hiding and they rejoiced and they expressed themselves in ugly ways while Trump blessed them with his approval. He made his supporters feel a kinship with Russians and their leader Putin.

From then on his followers kept begging him for more emotional support. They looked at the outside world as a threat to their chronic dependency on Trump's ability to make them feel as if they were protected and nurtured by him, as if they were in control of the nation.

He is their security blanket, the pacifier they suck on, their sage, their ideologist.

Nothing else matters. Nothing.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,971
13,488
136
Ill release my tax returns after election
- he did not
I will testify under oath (mueller)
- he did not (he even went full retard on the written quiz).
I will corporate fully with investigation
- he did not (didnt turn over any docs at all and stopped everybody from testifying).
I will participate in impeachment proceedings
- nope he did not.

He just takes the two seconds of tv face time of him promising to do something ... Fox will air it. Fox will never hold him accountable for the lie.
So for the base. It works!
Fox is a disease.
Fox is enabling a con man to con America.
Muppets.
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
2,872
136
Let's cut the crap. His supporters know exactly what he is doing. And, they are OK with it, because it is pissing the 'right' people off.

One of these deplorables summed things up perfectly by stating; "He isn't hurting the right people". Excuse me bitch? Can you keep your bile down for a few seconds?

They can no longer save face and lie about their true intentions - because their current actions and past behavior are gross contradictions. I am not even talking about white lies and inconsistencies. These are flat out lies, followed by denial when called out, followed by downplaying and then they release / absolve each other of any wrong doing.

These aren't people who are looking for some greater good. Or what is best for this nation. They are looking to harm, punish, hurt and even kill those who are just plain opposite and different.

Liberals aren't the ones sending pipe bombs to former presidents. Liberals aren't the ones running over and murdering protesters. Liberals aren't throwing acid in people's faces. Liberals aren't the ones who allow pedophiles, rapists, murderers, traitors and greedy pieces of shit run free with no restraints.

And NONE of this is done due ignorance or unwillingness.

No doubt some do. Particularly the ones in power. Others have some level of awareness that they are able to dissociate from. But, otherwise, most Americans know very little about politics or politicians and intrinsically trust whatever they hear that lines up with their emotional experience. Trump takes those people and facilitates them feeling powerful by using primitive ego defenses to project away their weaknesses onto an imaginary foe.
 

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,538
759
146
I disagree with trying to put them all in one category, because I think there are essentially two categories of Trump supporters.

In sum, we can divide the supporters into two camps: those who have mental deficiencies, and those who have moral deficiencies.

Most of Trump's supporters are poorly educated white people. And contrary to what many people said in another thread about the topic of low education among his supporters, there is a strong population wide statistical correlation between education and IQ. Poorly educated and/or low IQ people tend not to trust politicians who say things that confuse them. They think they're being duped. Trump's "plain talk" (referred to in a post above) is easily mistaken for honesty by such people. They don't fact check first because some of them aren't very good at it, and second, because they have no inclination to. Their trust in Trump is instinctive. Just as is their trust of people like Hannity and Limbaugh who tell them that all of Trump's misdeeds are manufactured by democrats and the "liberal media." If people they instinctively trust tell them it's so, then it's so.

I think the skepticism which undergirds the assumption that all these people know Trump is a liar and don't care is one of personal incredulity. Those of us who don't support Trump simply can't believe that anyone would actually accept his bullshit as fact. To us, it's plainly obvious. But not to them. These are the same people who already believed in magical sky fairies and all kinds of outlandish conspiracy theories long before Trump ever came around. If they can believe in sky fairies, they can believe in Trump.

So far as the educated people who support Trump, which BTW includes all the GOP who sit in Congress, I have three words for such people, from the DSM: anti-social personality disorder. Because anyone who knows that the POTUS is corrupt, lying scumbag and continues to support him is very likely himself a corrupt, lying scumbag. And, BTW, these are the same corrupt, lying scumbags who are duping and manipulating the poorly educated Trump voters I already discussed.

Because we are a materialistic, greed-based culture, we breed sociopaths in large quantities. Accordingly, they form an important voting bloc and pool of candidates for a corrupt political party,.

I don't think it's as black and white as that. Many educated Republicans also seemingly believe and make similar dumbass arguments as the uneducated, low income Trumpanzees. For example, do you think many educated Republican voters think climate change denial is actually bogus? I don't. They genuinely believe it no matter what evidence you show, and they'll put up the same dumbass arguments uneducated Republicans will.

There's also the issue of senility for many GOP voters. Average age of Fox viewer is around something like ~70 yrs old. All those people get to vote even if their reasoning has declined significantly. it's so easy to manipulate these people.