Tracking Nuclear Plant incidents in U.S. thread

[Ninjahedge]

You mean just like at Fukushima?

Didn't they have problems like their pump station (was it a pump station?) being below the flood line?

Didn't they find the staff negligent in their maintenance duties?

Not everything in this world is always "someone else's problem", and the sooner we all start to give a shit (without throwing it, that is) the better.

 

[Jaskalas]

Who cares if people from Chicago start dying? That is not even Illinois.

I hope you're not seriously suggesting that this could be the case.

You mean just like at Fukushima?

Let me know when one of the greatest earthquakes ever recorded hits Chicago, AND finishes off the backup supplies with a historic Tsunami.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Jask, Fuku has records of knowing that this was a distinct possibility. They also had things like water pumps in a vulnerable area (was it pumps or generator stations?).

They had been warned, and there was also instances of mismanagement.

If that plant was built right, these things would have been anticipated and designed for. The plant may not have been operational afterwards, but it would not have blown up either. You would not have had that kind of radioactive leakage.

Now, how does that apply here? The only way it applies is that they did not keep track and enforce the regulations already in place. The only way things keep running is when there are people that actually pay attention. If the public stops paying attension and requiring people to do their jobs, only a few people will actually still do what they should be doing without having to be told.

IOW, you get Homers.

BTW, Chicago is in a "Zone 0" for earthquakes. Which means, in general, that they just are not designed for. Getting a 3.8 in a "null" zone is nothing to sneeze at. If you do not DESIGN for something, you may have problems if it happens.

http://www.ivi-intl.com/pdfs/IVI_seismic_map_zones.pdf

 

[rcpratt]

BTW, Chicago is in a "Zone 0" for earthquakes. Which means, in general, that they just are not designed for. Getting a 3.8 in a "null" zone is nothing to sneeze at. If you do not DESIGN for something, you may have problems if it happens.

http://www.ivi-intl.com/pdfs/IVI_seismic_map_zones.pdf

What Chicago designs for is absolutely irrelevant in the case of this plant. That plant is designed and built to withstand many magnitudes greater than 3.8.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Do you do structural engineering?

My position still stands. If you do not raise questions, nobody bothers doing their job.

Do you feel threatened? Are you an inspector? If not, you really need to find something more important to worry about than someone on a BBS saying that it is important to keep everyone doing their job.

 

[rcpratt]

Yes, I feel oh-so threatened.

 

[QuantumPion]

Do you do structural engineering?

My position still stands. If you do not raise questions, nobody bothers doing their job.

Do you feel threatened? Are you an inspector? If not, you really need to find something more important to worry about than someone on a BBS saying that it is important to keep everyone doing their job.

You aren't raising a question. You are promulgating hysteria. If you have a question, then ask it. Otherwise get out of the way of the people that want to provide you with cheap, clean, safe energy.

 

[zinfamous]

Way back in the 90s when the world was bright and happy I used tritium tagged viruses in my grad research. We used to carry the samples in vials in lunch coolers as carry on luggage. No one cared. Now in these benighted times if we tried that the airport would probably be evacuated and folks would be rounded up for mass groping.

Am I the only one that sees this as positive change?

 

[dmcowen674]

Let me know when one of the greatest earthquakes ever recorded hits Chicago

It's not far from the New Madrid fault so it is entirely possible.

 

[Fern]

"A major research institution (MRI) has recently announced the discovery of the heaviest chemical element yet known to science. The new element has been tentatively named Governmentium. Governmentium has 1 neutron, 12 assistant neutrons, 75 deputy neutrons, and 224 assistant deputy neutrons, giving it an atomic mass of 312. These 312 particles are held together by forces called morons, which are surrounded by vast quantities of lepton-like particles called peons. Since governmentium has no electrons, it is inert. However, it can be detected as it impedes every reaction with which it comes into contact. A minute amount of governmentium causes one reaction to take over four days to complete when it would normally take less than a second. Governmentium has a normal half-life of three years; it does not decay, but instead undergoes a reorganization in which a portion of the assistant neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places. In fact, governmentium's mass will actually increase over time, since each reorganization will cause some morons to become neutrons, forming isodopes.

This characteristic of moron-promotion leads some scientists to speculate that governmentium is formed whenever morons reach a certain quantity in concentration. This hypothetical quantity is referred to as Critical Morass."

thanks to dmc

LOL

Fern

 

[Ninjahedge]

You aren't raising a question. You are promulgating hysteria. If you have a question, then ask it. Otherwise get out of the way of the people that want to provide you with cheap, clean, safe energy.

OMG, you sound like a sales brochure.

It ain't "clean". Having deadly waste produced that cannot be biologically decomposed or processed stored away for XXXX years is not "clean".

Clean-er than coal? Ya, but then again, burning cow dung is pretty close to that.

Can the crap (literally as well as figuratively) and take some medz for your hyper-sensitivity to anyone that has anything but godly praise for Nuclear Energy you shill.

 

[dmcowen674]

2-1-2012

http://news.yahoo.com/small-radiation-amount-could-escaped-plant-192144016.html

Small radiation leak at San Diego plant


The leak was detected Tuesday afternoon in Unit 3 at San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station, about 45 miles north of San Diego.

Also concerning was that "many" tubes that carry pressurized radioactive water were damaged, according to a spokesman for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission.

The tubes are part of equipment that is virtually new, having been installed in 2010.

According to the NRC, the tubes have an important safety role because they represent one of the primary barriers between the radioactive and non-radioactive sides of the plant. If a tube breaks, there is the potential that radioactivity from the system that pumps water through the reactor could escape into the atmosphere.

 

[QuantumPion]

2-1-2012

http://news.yahoo.com/small-radiation-amount-could-escaped-plant-192144016.html

Small radiation leak at San Diego plant


The leak was detected Tuesday afternoon in Unit 3 at San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station, about 45 miles north of San Diego.

Also concerning was that "many" tubes that carry pressurized radioactive water were damaged, according to a spokesman for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission.

The tubes are part of equipment that is virtually new, having been installed in 2010.

According to the NRC, the tubes have an important safety role because they represent one of the primary barriers between the radioactive and non-radioactive sides of the plant. If a tube breaks, there is the potential that radioactivity from the system that pumps water through the reactor could escape into the atmosphere.

They suspect "at least one" tube rupture based on the leak rate. Probably between 1 and 3. Out of 10,000 tubes:

 

[CLite]

2-1-2012

http://news.yahoo.com/small-radiation-amount-could-escaped-plant-192144016.html

Small radiation leak at San Diego plant


The leak was detected Tuesday afternoon in Unit 3 at San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station, about 45 miles north of San Diego.

Also concerning was that "many" tubes that carry pressurized radioactive water were damaged, according to a spokesman for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission.

The tubes are part of equipment that is virtually new, having been installed in 2010.

According to the NRC, the tubes have an important safety role because they represent one of the primary barriers between the radioactive and non-radioactive sides of the plant. If a tube breaks, there is the potential that radioactivity from the system that pumps water through the reactor could escape into the atmosphere.

Lochbaum, the director of the nuclear safety project for the Union of Concerned Scientists (a group that is a nuclear industry watch dog) stated this event was fairly meaningless.

http://voiceofoc.org/countywide/this_just_in/article_254c4452-4d54-11e1-88d2-001871e3ce6c.html

Whenever generators are new or very old, leaks can occur, and engineers know to be alert for the problem, said David Lochbaum, director of the Nuclear Safety Project for the Union of Concerned Scientists.

Lochbaum said that as long as sensors detected the problem and the operators were prepared, "it's not the fault of [owner] Southern California Edison. It just happens" with new generators as they are being broken in.

Edison announced the "precautionary shutdown" Tuesday evening because "sensors installed for this purpose detected a possible leak in one of the unit's steam generator tubes."

Lara Uselding, a spokeswoman for the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission, said Wednesday there was no public danger. The leak was "very, very small, minuscule, almost undetectable," she said.

If people wanted to discuss broader topics about where the nuclear industry still faces significant long-term challenges then it'd be welcomed. However, posting meaningless operating events and then trying to weave them together as a tale of negligence in the US nuclear industry will only create troll threads.

 

[Fern]

Well, clearly we need more coal burning electrical power plants.

Fern

 

[Modelworks]

You don't want to know about every single incident report. It is volumes of data weekly. They have to report everything from 'employee was chewing gum' to ' employee brought coffee into control room' or 'suspicious liquid found in locker, found out to be whiskey'

 

[Modelworks]

You mean just like at Fukushima?

Didn't they have problems like their pump station (was it a pump station?) being below the flood line?

Didn't they find the staff negligent in their maintenance duties?

Not everything in this world is always "someone else's problem", and the sooner we all start to give a shit (without throwing it, that is) the better.

The problem with the plant was the sea wall not being tall enough, systems inside worked exactly as intended when power was restored. Had it not flooded from a Tsunami everything would have been fine. So barring an act of God I am not concerned about nuclear plants. I live not far from one and sleep just fine.

 

[Mark R]

Sorry, yeah, you are right. Did not mean to mislead.

And agreed on the large dosage needed. It is an alpha emitter, so until it gets inside your body it can do nothing to do (unless you wipe it on your eyes or other very soft tissue). Alpha radiation cannot penetrate the dead skin layer of your body.

It's a beta emitter - a tritium atom is smaller than an alpha particle, so it can't possibly emit one!

It's also a very weak beta emitter, so it isn't a health risk unless ingested in water form. Gaseous tritium isn't absorbed by the body, and dissipates very quickly in the atmosphere. However, in most nuclear plants, the tritium is in the form of water, so there are potential risks (although the level of tritium is very small). Most plants also feature tritium removal systems, that concentrate the tritium, and store it (preferably in gas form) until it decays.

 

[StrangerGuy]

The problem with the plant was the sea wall not being tall enough, systems inside worked exactly as intended when power was restored. Had it not flooded from a Tsunami everything would have been fine. So barring an act of God I am not concerned about nuclear plants. I live not far from one and sleep just fine.

Those are old 2nd-gen reactors. The most sensible thing to do now for clean energy is to be like China and build latest-gen reactors that are many times safer, but of course the energy-hungry American nuclearphobes won't allow such a good thing to happen.

 

[rcpratt]

I was channeling new fuel assemblies today, and a guy next to me dropped a torque wrench ~6' to the floor. Put it on the list.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Was it radioactive?

Did it escape into the environment?


If not, STFU.

 

[Born2bwire]

I was channeling new fuel assemblies today, and a guy next to me dropped a torque wrench ~6' to the floor. Put it on the list.

I once set off the hand and foot radiation monitors when exiting the building.

 

[Griffinhart]

I got to admit, it does feel like someone is just looking for something to worry about.

Fun fact though, According to Wikipedia, The entire world produces just under 13 TWh per year via solar energy, both PV and solar thermal combined. The Palo Verde Nuclear Generating Station in Arizona generates just under 30 TWh per year.