Toshiba lost $$$$ on the A2 promo

[Zorro]

Text

 

[bctbct]

I just took mine out of the box. Its huge.

 

[JackBurton]

The guy is pulling numbers out of his ass. He sounds like a complete Blu-Ray b!tch. I tell you what, I bet Toshiba is losing less money on the $99 A2s than Sony is on their PS3s.

 

[JackBurton]

Originally posted by: bctbct
I just took mine out of the box. Its huge.

??? Apparently you've never seen the first gen HD-DVD players or the current Blu-Ray players.

 

[venkman]

Lol, $600!?!!? Is he serious? Does this mean he Toshiba is losing money on the super high end XA2? Since Blu Ray players are more expensive to produce, does that mean every Sony, Samsung, Panasonic, and Sharp player below that price is losing money also?

Why don't people think before they post?

 

[bctbct]

Originally posted by: JackBurton

Originally posted by: bctbct
I just took mine out of the box. Its huge.

??? Apparently you've never seen the first gen HD-DVD players or the current Blu-Ray players.

naw, I just bought this because it was a good deal, not really a tech guy.

 

[mugs]

No way - a company lost money clearing out old products? :Q I thought Target was making money on all of the clearance items I buy, like the $7.50 Xbox 360 game I got yesterday. :laugh:

Originally posted by: JackBurton
The guy is pulling numbers out of his ass. He sounds like a complete Blu-Ray b!tch. I tell you what, I bet Toshiba is losing less money on the $99 A2s than Sony is on their PS3s.

Good point. :laugh:

 

[ProfJohn]

I am sure they are losing some money on them. But they are in a market share war and are willing to lose some money on the cheap ones in order to increase the size of the market for Discs etc.

I think Toshiba knew it had to do something to gain market share. Just look at the amount of Blue-Ray movies vs. HD DVDs out there. If they don't reverse that trend they are in big trouble.

The whole point of buying one of these things is to watch movies and if the movies aren't there people aren't going to buy them. Will be interesting to see if the additional 100,000 HD players that are out there will increase the number of movies one can buy at Target, Wal-Mart, Best Buy etc.

 

[alkemyst]

Not much in that article but speculation. Not to mention many items are sold for a loss to hardly any profit...the profit is in the accessories and games for many items.

 

[mrrman]

Im just looking for a deal and couldnt care if they lose/make $$$ on it

 

[Jadow]

They had 20 at my local WM and probably stll have a few. I passed, and have no problems passing. I'm waiting till this stupid fromat war is over till I spend 1 cent. I'm perfectly happy waiting. I have no urge to jump into HD.

 

[JackBurton]

Ok, no more linking to that site for ANYTHING. I just read through some of the comments, and I am convinced you've got to be retarded to become a member there. And the head retard is the guy that wrote the article.

 

[0roo0roo]

it was a limited deal on an older model right? regular player prices are still $200
old isupply data is pretty worthless.

 

[Mr Incognito]

If they are taking a loss they are counting on this paying off big time in the long run. Who knows.

 

[JackBurton]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
it was a limited deal on an older model right? regular player prices are still $200
old isupply data is pretty worthless.

Not even that. BestBuy's regular price for the HD-A2 is $179. CC has it as $177.99 as their regular price. The guy is a God damn retard, plain and simple.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: venkman
Lol, $600!?!!? Is he serious? Does this mean he Toshiba is losing money on the super high end XA2? Since Blu Ray players are more expensive to produce, does that mean every Sony, Samsung, Panasonic, and Sharp player below that price is losing money also?

Why don't people think before they post?

actually, he is serious, but those numbers likely mean nothing at this point in time.

blu-ray players are likely not more expensive to produce, they just seem to be more glitz in terms of quality. hell, the A2 didn't even have 1080p.

but yes, the A1 when launched, cost close to $700 yet they sold it for $500. This was how they were able to be cheaper than BD, versus the BD camp went for the profit method. Nobody has ever heard of a company taking a loss on electronics, besides consoles at launch, and I still find it baffling.
Toshiba drastically wants HD DVD to win, and seem to be willing to take great risks to get that to happen. The idea of licensing fees is quite compelling, apparently.
I wonder if Sony would sell their stand alone players at a loss if it weren't for the PS3 being sold at a loss.

However, I also doubt Sony is losing too much on the PS3s being sold currently, as the have improved chip production and lowered costs in that area, as well as lowered cost of all components across the board, notably the blue laser diode, and removed from old chips from the motherboard.

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: bctbct
Its huge.

blue lazers have to be mounted on sharks heads

the smallest sharks are relatively large, hence "Its huge"

 

[ballmode]

they wouldn't sell for that big of a loss especially a one day holiday sale?

 

[bonkers325]

they lose money on the entry-level non-progressive capable players. most people dont know/care about the difference between 1080i/p - but they will care about the miniscule difference once they become 'HD experts'. people ALWAYS want to upgrade, and selling a dvd player that outputs at a resolution that is not the best will ensure a market for their 1080p HD-DVD players in the future.

 

[Brainonska511]

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: venkman
Lol, $600!?!!? Is he serious? Does this mean he Toshiba is losing money on the super high end XA2? Since Blu Ray players are more expensive to produce, does that mean every Sony, Samsung, Panasonic, and Sharp player below that price is losing money also?

Why don't people think before they post?

actually, he is serious, but those numbers likely mean nothing at this point in time.

blu-ray players are likely not more expensive to produce, they just seem to be more glitz in terms of quality. hell, the A2 didn't even have 1080p.

but yes, the A1 when launched, cost close to $700 yet they sold it for $200. This was how they were able to be cheaper than BD, versus the BD camp went for the profit method. Nobody has ever heard of a company taking a loss on electronics, besides consoles at launch, and I still find it baffling.
Toshiba drastically wants HD DVD to win, and seem to be willing to take great risks to get that to happen. The idea of licensing fees is quite compelling, apparently.
I wonder if Sony would sell their stand alone players at a loss if it weren't for the PS3 being sold at a loss.

However, I also doubt Sony is losing too much on the PS3s being sold currently, as the have improved chip production and lowered costs in that area, as well as lowered cost of all components across the board, notably the blue laser diode, and removed from old chips from the motherboard.

Just because something was expensive at launch doesn't mean it remains expensive to produce. Economies of scale make things cheaper. And BD players are more expensive to produce because of the blue laser and glass lens that need to be used compared with that of HDDVD. I highly doubt that Toshiba was losing that much money by the recent sale price of a product they were clearing out. Plus, in a format war, they stand to gain much more in the long run by losing some money in the short run.

 

[JasonCoder]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

I think Toshiba knew it had to do something to gain market share. Just look at the amount of Blue-Ray movies vs. HD DVDs out there. If they don't reverse that trend they are in big trouble.

If I look at Netflix, they have 50 more blu-ray titles than HD-DVD. The numbers are roughly 400 vs. 350. That's 12.5% more blu-ray than HD-DVD. According to the Wall Street Journal, each format only has about 190 exclusive titles respectively so that seems to be a wash.

No doubt the pressure of somewhat sagging HD-DVD sales led at least in a small part to the super hot deal on this player. The question is whether or the market penetration will lead more studios to release for HD-DVD and keep the existing exclusive formats.

Should definitely be an interesting show.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: Brainonska511

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: venkman
Lol, $600!?!!? Is he serious? Does this mean he Toshiba is losing money on the super high end XA2? Since Blu Ray players are more expensive to produce, does that mean every Sony, Samsung, Panasonic, and Sharp player below that price is losing money also?

Why don't people think before they post?

actually, he is serious, but those numbers likely mean nothing at this point in time.

blu-ray players are likely not more expensive to produce, they just seem to be more glitz in terms of quality. hell, the A2 didn't even have 1080p.

but yes, the A1 when launched, cost close to $700 yet they sold it for $200. This was how they were able to be cheaper than BD, versus the BD camp went for the profit method. Nobody has ever heard of a company taking a loss on electronics, besides consoles at launch, and I still find it baffling.
Toshiba drastically wants HD DVD to win, and seem to be willing to take great risks to get that to happen. The idea of licensing fees is quite compelling, apparently.
I wonder if Sony would sell their stand alone players at a loss if it weren't for the PS3 being sold at a loss.

However, I also doubt Sony is losing too much on the PS3s being sold currently, as the have improved chip production and lowered costs in that area, as well as lowered cost of all components across the board, notably the blue laser diode, and removed from old chips from the motherboard.

Just because something was expensive at launch doesn't mean it remains expensive to produce. Economies of scale make things cheaper. And BD players are more expensive to produce because of the blue laser and glass lens that need to be used compared with that of HDDVD. I highly doubt that Toshiba was losing that much money by the recent sale price of a product they were clearing out. Plus, in a format war, they stand to gain much more in the long run by losing some money in the short run.

bolded the statement that agreed with you in the first place.
just like I mentioned the fact that the PS3's manufacturing costs have come down, I acknowledge the idea that Toshiba's HD DVD players have likely come down. I have no clue how much they cost now.
but how much are they really different in terms of cost? I can pretty much bet comfortably that both Sony and Samsung are selling their players for a profit, Sony especially so since they cannot afford to have 2 things on the marketplace losing money. Both devices use the same 405nm blue-violet laser, just aperture is different, as well as the lens. So the laser assemblies are different, but that cannot have THAT much of an impact on cost, when all the market places cited the blue laser diode itself as what was causing the high prices, also due to low production volume.
a lens and the assembly cannot cost that much. If you figure, Sony will have a $399 standalone player out this christmas, and it may cost them $299. I bet the HD DVD machines Toshiba sells for $200 probably cost $200-250 to produce. Not that much of a difference, and is consistent with how the two companies have been playing this out.

 

[biggestmuff]

Except for the iSupply 'fact', that entire post is speculation on his part.

 

[JackBurton]

Originally posted by: bonkers325
they lose money on the entry-level non-progressive capable players. most people dont know/care about the difference between 1080i/p - but they will care about the miniscule difference once they become 'HD experts'. people ALWAYS want to upgrade, and selling a dvd player that outputs at a resolution that is not the best will ensure a market for their 1080p HD-DVD players in the future.

Ok, let's all get this clear, for movie/film 1080i is EQUAL to 1080p. If you have a decent 1080p HDTV, you are watching a PERFECT 1080p picture coming from your HD-DVD HD-A2 player. The HD-DVD player will output a 1080i signal and your HDTV will deinterlace the picture and convert it to 1080p with NO picture quality loss. All the frames and all the resolution will be intact, just as it were outputted at 1080p.

 

[sswingle]

Originally posted by: bctbct
I just took mine out of the box. Its huge.

Its almost the exact same size as my first DVD player.