To Keep bulking to Cut? (pics)

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brikis98

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Jul 5, 2005
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Get strong and fast for football. And looking great would just be icing on the cake.
These goals are not useful for making a decision on whether you should bulk or cut because they are not quantifiable. It is much more useful to have concrete, measurable goals for what you define as "strong" and "fast". That, combined with where you are now in relation to those goals makes it easier to decide if you should continue to bulk, stay the same weight or cut. For example, "I want to squat 400lbs and I currently squat 300lbs" would be a strength goal where bulking more would be very helpful. On the other hand, "I want to run a 5.0 second 40 and I currently run it in 6.0 seconds" would be a speed goal where bulking would not help but cutting might.
 

Pantlegz

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Jun 6, 2007
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I would keep bulking if I were you, stronger legs will make you more explosive just mix it up and do conditioning and endurance training too.

whats you current height/weight?
 

puqdew

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Jun 22, 2009
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I would keep bulking if I were you, stronger legs will make you more explosive just mix it up and do conditioning and endurance training too.

whats you current height/weight?

Please re-read OP

My legs are actually my strongest body parts :).
 
Mar 22, 2002
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Please re-read OP

My legs are actually my strongest body parts :).

As they should be. Continue making them stronger. To be perfectly honest, I'd bulk until I got sick of my body fat % and then cut. What kind of weight training program are you on though? If you're on the "each body part once a week" kinda thing, you're not doing yourself any favors. You need to do compound lifts - squats, bench, shoulder press, weighted pullups, deadlift, rows. On top of that, you should be doing plyometrics and sprints for speed.
 

puqdew

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Jun 22, 2009
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As they should be. Continue making them stronger. To be perfectly honest, I'd bulk until I got sick of my body fat % and then cut. What kind of weight training program are you on though? If you're on the "each body part once a week" kinda thing, you're not doing yourself any favors. You need to do compound lifts - squats, bench, shoulder press, weighted pullups, deadlift, rows. On top of that, you should be doing plyometrics and sprints for speed.

All listed above are already in my workout :)

I do a basic chest/tri, back/bi, shoulder/trap, legs/abs split
 

KoolDrew

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
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If your goal is to truly get bigger and faster for football, you should be concentrating on that, not dieting down. As such, your routine should also be strength oriented. You shouldn't be doing a bodybuilding type split.

What's your current weight on squat, bench, deadlift, etc?
 

yelo333

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Dec 13, 2003
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I don't have any advice, but I had to jump in here. You're 16 and have already achieved those results? Great work, keep it up!

Out of curiosity, what kind of weights are you moving around for the major lifts?
 
Mar 22, 2002
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All listed above are already in my workout :)

I do a basic chest/tri, back/bi, shoulder/trap, legs/abs split

Doing a split is pointless. You can get much more neuromuscular adaptation and hypertrophy if you do full body workouts. Refer to the link crt posted. That will get you stronger faster guaranteed. Drop the split stuff. Allowing your body to recover for a full week actually decreases the response of adaptations.
 

brikis98

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Jul 5, 2005
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rb.

What do you think I should do? I'm lost

Ok, that's a start. As an rb, in terms of fitness, your primary concerns are most likely:

1. Speed & agility (to avoid tackles): work on sprints (20 yard, 40 yard, 100m, 200m), plyometrics, and agility drills. Extra bodyweight here is typically counterproductive.
2. Strength & power (to break/absorb tackles): work on squats, deadlifts, bench press, overhead press, cleans and snatches. Extra bodyweight here is typically *very* helpful.
3. Stamina/endurance (to not get gassed immediately): work on your "metcon" by doing interval training, timed workouts, gassers, burpees, rowing, stadiums, etc. Extra bodyweight here is typically counterproductive.

Look at the list above. Most likely, some of those items are strengths for you, while others are weakness. Most 16 year olds, for example, are fairly small compared to the upperclassmen, so their biggest weakness is #2. This means bulking up while building their gym numbers is the priority. On the other hand, some 16 year olds are too damn fat and need to cut down to get better at #1 and #2. Figure out what you need to do.

BTW, what are you currently doing for training now? What does your diet look like?
 

Koing

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
Oct 11, 2000
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If your goal is to truly get bigger and faster for football, you should be concentrating on that, not dieting down. As such, your routine should also be strength oriented. You shouldn't be doing a bodybuilding type split.

What's your current weight on squat, bench, deadlift, etc?

If your serious about improving performance I'd be willing to bet you want to push up those numbers and other numbers as high as possible. Cutting is NOT THE WAY TO DO THAT for you. Cutting is for vanity (nothing wrong with that) sake unless your a lot overweight and that your not.

What do you sprint 40-60m in? Whats your vertical jump like? These are measurements of athletical performance.

If you want performance I'd seek a better training split then a bodybuilding one. You can still do bodybuilding exercises in your routine but if you can't at least jump 28inches you need to put a lot of effort in to getting more explosive.

Congrats on your results so far! I was a skinny 16yr old!

Koing
 

KoolDrew

Lifer
Jun 30, 2004
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I didn't even realize you're only 16 yrs old either. At 16, unless you're overweight I wouldn't worry about cutting at all. You're still growing. Just concentrate on getting bigger and stronger.
 

MrEgo

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Jan 17, 2003
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I was a 5'8"/135 cross-country runner in high school. 10 years later, at age 27, I'm up to 190 since I've been hitting the weight room hard. Granted, I don't have my endurance for distance running like I used to, but I am much more explosive and fast than I was in high school.

I can feel my upper body pushing my momentum when I sprint. I could not feel that happening when I was just skin and bones. Other benefits to developing your upper body include durability and your ability to carry tacklers with you. Running backs are much more prone to injuries when they're frail, and I'm sure you know that. Yards after contact is another big statistic for you, and obviously you would have an easier time carrying guys with you if you put on some muscle mass in the right areas.
 

EightySix Four

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Jul 17, 2004
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Don't mean to thread hijack, but I've been wondering when to start cutting as well. I'm now 6'5, 230lbs, and yesterday I did 200lb 5x5 squat (I hadn't touched a weight in a long time before starting, so I started at bar on everything). I'm not really doing this for any reason but to get back in reasonable shape and to be ready for spring break/summer vacation. I started around 200lbs and I am not used to having much body fat so I've become a bit self conscious about it. Is stopping to cut going to slow my gains when I go back to 5x5?

As to the OP, I'm not nearly as well versed at overall body health as these guys, but I know football, and I wouldn't stop bulking until spring training. Spring training and summer workouts will get you trim and in running condition so you want to go into them with as much muscle mass as possible. It's not uncommon for highschool players to lose 10&#37; of their body weight from beginning of season to end. Even if you lose a step in speed, your ability to explode through the hole and the yards after contact will go up enough to make up for it.

You would be surprised at the amount of college recruited running backs that don't run 4.4 40's. That's what redshirt year is for, improving your physical ability. They do like to take running backs that are strong and able to hit though, because even if they don't get faster in the off season, they make good defensive players.

Work hard on explosive exercises, such as powercleans (MAKE SURE YOUR FORM IS GOOD). These lifts will improve your ability to drop your shoulders and push through crowds, as well as making it incredibly tough for defensive backs to bring you down.

Good luck.
 
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Koing

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
Oct 11, 2000
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I was a 5'8"/135 cross-country runner in high school. 10 years later, at age 27, I'm up to 190 since I've been hitting the weight room hard. Granted, I don't have my endurance for distance running like I used to, but I am much more explosive and fast than I was in high school.

I can feel my upper body pushing my momentum when I sprint. I could not feel that happening when I was just skin and bones. Other benefits to developing your upper body include durability and your ability to carry tacklers with you. Running backs are much more prone to injuries when they're frail, and I'm sure you know that. Yards after contact is another big statistic for you, and obviously you would have an easier time carrying guys with you if you put on some muscle mass in the right areas.

By that you mean you were using your arms properly right?!!! Apart from your arms your upperbody is relatively useless in terms of making you run faster. Your arms are a big factor besidesy our legs in being able to run.

All good sprinters will be able to do a decent amount of pull ups. The faster your arms move the faster your legs move and the better your ability to handle your own bodyweight which running is all about. A lot of sprint coaches will use this as a barometer of how a person can sprint besides track time.

crazySOB297, yes follow his strategy. You have to 'peak' correctly for your season!

Koing
 

ZOOYUKA

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Jan 24, 2005
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Squat, Deadlift, Bench Press, Shoulder Press, Dips and Pullups. Add some running to the mix and the rest will take care of itself.
 

brikis98

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Jul 5, 2005
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Don't mean to thread hijack, but I've been wondering when to start cutting as well. I'm now 6'5, 230lbs, and yesterday I did 200lb 5x5 squat (I hadn't touched a weight in a long time before starting, so I started at bar on everything). I'm not really doing this for any reason but to get back in reasonable shape and to be ready for spring break/summer vacation. I started around 200lbs and I am not used to having much body fat so I've become a bit self conscious about it. Is stopping to cut going to slow my gains when I go back to 5x5?
What are your goals? If it is to get as strong as possible, then don't bother with cutting. A 200lb 5x5 squat at a bodyweight of 230lbs is still very much in the beginner stages, so you still have a TON of room for progress. Eating enough food will allow you to make that progress much faster.
 

EightySix Four

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Jul 17, 2004
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What are your goals? If it is to get as strong as possible, then don't bother with cutting. A 200lb 5x5 squat at a bodyweight of 230lbs is still very much in the beginner stages, so you still have a TON of room for progress. Eating enough food will allow you to make that progress much faster.

My goals are too be "in shape." I'm not looking to power lift, or to be the strongest guy out there, though the refound strength has been great. Injuries put me out of sports a long time ago so despite how bad I'd like to go back, that won't happen. I was atheletic/muscular in high school and then I lost it all after getting hurt and then dropped to nearly 180lbs bw.

I did that 200lb 5x5 starting from bar weight in less than 2 months, and gained the 30lbs in the same time frame. I'm not really used to having the extra fat on me from all the extra eating and half assing GOMAD, so it has been bothering me a bit and pushing me to want to cut.

If I start cutting and then go back to it, will it lower my potential gains?

Also, if I don't start cutting, should I jump my weight up in deadlift if it feels to easy?
 
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brikis98

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Jul 5, 2005
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My goals are too be "in shape."
Again, this is hard to quantify, and therefore hard to figure out how to achieve. What is "in shape" for you? Is it being able to squat a lot? Run really fast? Run really far? Low body fat percentage? It is much easier to make a diet/exercise plan if you write out your goals in concrete, measurable numbers.

I did that 200lb 5x5 starting from bar weight in less than 2 months, and gained the 30lbs in the same time frame. I'm not really used to having the extra fat on me from all the extra eating and half assing GOMAD, so it has been bothering me a bit and pushing me to want to cut.
30lbs in 2 months is too fast. The human body just can't build muscle anywhere near that fast, so a lot of that weight gain is going to be fat. Hell, at that rate you'd add 180lbs in a year, which should be a warning sign that you are overdoing it. If the extra fat is affecting your ability to achieve your "in shape" goals, then yea, you may need to cut.

If I start cutting and then go back to it, will it lower my potential gains?
While you cut, you'll find it harder to make gains in strength, but in the long term, that isn't going to somehow limit your max squat, it'll just take you longer to get there. And once you get back to eating maintenance or bulking, you'll make gains faster again.

Also, if I don't start cutting, should I jump my weight up in deadlift if it feels to easy?
Just follow the 5x5 routine. If you finish all 5 reps of deadlift, go up in 10lbs the next workout. Do that for a few workouts and I'm sure it'll stop feeling easy soon. Jump up too much weight too early and you might stall and have to waste time deloading and working your way back up.
 

EightySix Four

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Jul 17, 2004
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Again, this is hard to quantify, and therefore hard to figure out how to achieve. What is "in shape" for you? Is it being able to squat a lot? Run really fast? Run really far? Low body fat percentage? It is much easier to make a diet/exercise plan if you write out your goals in concrete, measurable numbers.


30lbs in 2 months is too fast. The human body just can't build muscle anywhere near that fast, so a lot of that weight gain is going to be fat. Hell, at that rate you'd add 180lbs in a year, which should be a warning sign that you are overdoing it. If the extra fat is affecting your ability to achieve your "in shape" goals, then yea, you may need to cut.


While you cut, you'll find it harder to make gains in strength, but in the long term, that isn't going to somehow limit your max squat, it'll just take you longer to get there. And once you get back to eating maintenance or bulking, you'll make gains faster again.


Just follow the 5x5 routine. If you finish all 5 reps of deadlift, go up in 10lbs the next workout. Do that for a few workouts and I'm sure it'll stop feeling easy soon. Jump up too much weight too early and you might stall and have to waste time deloading and working your way back up.

Oh I know the 30lbs is not in muscle, it's from the overeating I was doing to start the bulking process. It's exactly how stronglifts recommends doing it, gain the muscle and fat, then lose the fat. I'm just not sure when I'm supposed to start working on that side.

As far as what my goals are for being in shape, I have a hard time pinning down goals because I don't really have any targets. I'm not trying to be a body builder, I don't really have a target weight, I'm not shooting for playing any sports, and I don't have a gym partner that I can be competitive with.

As far as the deadlifting, I do follow the plan and go up in weight as planned. It was hard the first 2 weeks or so, but ever since then it has seemed like I'm working myself far harder on squats then deadlift. I don't have to strain nearly as much to get the deadlift done, and it doesn't affect how sore or tired I am after doing them.
 
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