Times Of Israel Publishes Op-Ed About 'When Genocide Is Permissible', Then Deletes It

[emperus]

"Market."
"School."
"Shelter."
It's nice that you get to use these labels instead just because Hamas has no dedicated...
Base
Weapons cache/depot
Stronghold
...which can't also have one of those labels applied.

That's their advantage and you have been ridiculously suckered in where it is impossible for them to retaliate at all without your selective outrage.

Iron Dome is extremely expensive (well over $100,000 per activation not counting the infrastructure and support personnel) and NOT an on-going solution.


The "victims" are the ones being fired at indiscriminately. Israel's actions are the very definition discriminating.

It was a UN shelter. A UN shelter. It reminds me of how Israel bombed a US carrier and claimed it was an accident.

You're nothing but a troll. What's funny is your arguments in this thread are doing nothing more than making me more Angry at Israel. And I'm sure it has the same effect on many others.

 

[emperus]

"Market."
"School."
"Shelter."
It's nice that you get to use these labels instead just because Hamas has no dedicated...
Base
Weapons cache/depot
Stronghold
...which can't also have one of those labels applied.

That's their advantage and you have been ridiculously suckered in where it is impossible for them to retaliate at all without your selective outrage.

Iron Dome is extremely expensive (well over $100,000 per activation not counting the infrastructure and support personnel) and NOT an on-going solution.


The "victims" are the ones being fired at indiscriminately. Israel's actions are the very definition discriminating.

I'm not sure whether you are an American, but you should study up on the American Revolution. Where do you think soldiers hid their weapons and stores? Where do you think the soldiers fought out of?

I was just reading the wiki on Paul Revere's midnight ride and found this.

One week later, on April 14, General Gage received instructions from Secretary of State William Legge, Earl of Dartmouth (dispatched on January 27), to disarm the rebels, who were known to have hidden weapons in Concord, among other locations, and to imprison the rebellion's leaders, especially Samuel Adams and John Hancock. Dartmouth gave Gage considerable discretion in his commands.[37][38] Gage issued orders to Lieutenant Colonel Francis Smith to proceed from Boston "with utmost expedition and secrecy to Concord, where you will seize and destroy... all Military stores.... But you will take care that the soldiers do not plunder the inhabitants or hurt private property." Gage did not issue written orders for the arrest of rebel leaders, as he feared doing so might spark an uprising

 

[irishScott]

Huffington Post now officially anti-Semitic?

They're a liberal outlet and make no real effort to contest that. Liberals are typically anti-Israel and sympathetic to Palestinians.

 

[irishScott]

I'm not sure whether you are an American, but you should study up on the American Revolution. Where do you think soldiers hid their weapons and stores? Where do you think the soldiers fought out of?

I was just reading the wiki on Paul Revere's midnight ride and found this.

And if the Declaration of Independence stated "Great Britain shall remain until Americans eliminate it, and all who die to kill Englishmen shall be forever rewarded in heaven!" you might have a point.

There's a big difference between hiding amongst a civilian population and using them as human shields.


Equating 18th century American Revolutionaries to Hamas is laughable.

 

[CZroe]

You're right: that is funny. No matter what anyone says to chamge your mind, you are so focused on hating Israel that you just double-down the hate. Pathetic.

I'm not sure whether you are an American, but you should study up on the American Revolution. Where do you think soldiers hid their weapons and stores? Where do you think the soldiers fought out of?

I was just reading the wiki on Paul Revere's midnight ride and found this.

US American through and through. In case you ask to imply foreign influence, I am not of any middle-eastern ethnicity and the only Jewish people I've ever known were when I lived in San Diego for a few years. That's also the only time I've ever spent out of the country (about an hour in TJ).

Now, why do you think your American Revolution example contradicts my position on the issue? It doesn't. It supports it. And don't forget who LOST that war.

Israel is justified in attacking the source just as our enemies would have been. Similarly, our population generally supported the revolution and any with alternate loyalties would not have stores such things in their home.

If you are trying to imply that Hamas is similarly justified then you are seriously deluding yourself about the origins of the conflict and who is entitled to what.

 

[CZroe]

It was a UN shelter. A UN shelter. It reminds me of how Israel bombed a US carrier and claimed it was an accident.

You're nothing but a troll. What's funny is your arguments in this thread are doing nothing more than making me more Angry at Israel. And I'm sure it has the same effect on many others.

And they were responding to an attack or cache of enemy weapons from NEAR a "UN shelter." Even if you weren't missing a word there and it really was inside the shelter, that activity has no business bein in a genuine UN shelter operation there and it simply had to be addressed in exactly the way Israel addressed it. UN shelters and not supposed to be untouchable sanctuaries or bases of operations for Hamas. If i was fired on from within what I thought was a UN shelter I would do exactly what Israel did: retaliate. Thankfully, they try to give advanced warning to potential innocent bystanders... unlike Hamas.

 

[Ichinisan]

...Let me ask you, if someone fires a weapon(a weapon that in all effect is useless seeing the number of Israeli casualties) from your child's middle school or elementary. You know it is a middle school and that children are currently there, do you think the Police would send in a drone to destroy it without first evacuating the children?

So Israel should do nothing until there are [x] innocent civilian casualties before trying to do anything about those attacking the innocents?

So I guess you're saying a few innocent casualties is OK?

Maybe there should be greater harm before they kill a few thousand people?

Sounds like I guessed correctly. You think there is an acceptable number of civilian casualties. You think Israel should allow some to die before they do anything to stop it.

Would the Israeli government have some liability for the deaths of its own citizens if it does absolutely nothing to stop the endless rockets from being fired from Gaza?

So which is it? Are civilian casualties acceptable or not?

 

[Ichinisan]

That's the stupid line of reasoning that a lot of Israeli apologists are left to now a days. There is a gulf between doing nothing and bombing a UN SHELTER that the UN warned you 17 times is a UN Shelter. But I'm sure you know that. And I just wonder why you are acting like you don't. Does pretending to be clueless make the murder of children that much more palatable?

Which actions would fall within this "gulf" you describe?

 

[Ichinisan]

It was a UN shelter. A UN shelter. It reminds me of how Israel bombed a US carrier and claimed it was an accident.

Serious accidents never happen. Never ever.

 

[Ichinisan]

I'm not sure whether you are an American, but you should study up on the American Revolution. Where do you think soldiers hid their weapons and stores? Where do you think the soldiers fought out of?

I was just reading the wiki on Paul Revere's midnight ride and found this.

In this case, the "rebels" don't believe in "Britain's" right to exist and they want to kill every last "Englishman" in the name of "Christianity" or "religious freedom."

Yeah. That analogy doesn't really line up.

 

[Ichinisan]

You're nothing but a troll. What's funny is your arguments in this thread are doing nothing more than making me more Angry at Israel. And I'm sure it has the same effect on many others.

If you examined he situation a little deeper, you'd realize the real reason you're getting angry: You're losing an argument because your reasoning is invalid and your facts are flawed / biased. You could simply realize that you've been arguing the wrong position.

 

[emperus]

If you examined he situation a little deeper, you'd realize the real reason you're getting angry: You're losing an argument because your reasoning is invalid and your facts are flawed / biased. You could simply realize that you've been arguing the wrong position.

You must have misunderstood. You have not even made an argument that I can even lose. Everything you state is emotional and indefensible unless you were Sadam Hussein or Hitler.

 

[emperus]

And they were responding to an attack or cache of enemy weapons from NEAR a "UN shelter." Even if you weren't missing a word there and it really was inside the shelter, that activity has no business bein in a genuine UN shelter operation there and it simply had to be addressed in exactly the way Israel addressed it. UN shelters and not supposed to be untouchable sanctuaries or bases of operations for Hamas. If i was fired on from within what I thought was a UN shelter I would do exactly what Israel did: retaliate. Thankfully, they try to give advanced warning to potential innocent bystanders... unlike Hamas.

SO, because someone fired form "near" a Un school then it is defensible to destroy a UN school. ANd that logic makes sense to you? That in itself is a war crime. But the only war crimes the Israeli's seem to care about are the ones that help them in whatever cause they are after.

A US ship in the area. Try to destroy it.
A UN shelter in the area. Destroy it.

 

[CZroe]

SO, because because someone fired form "near" a Un school then it is defensible to destroy a UN school. ANd that logic makes sense to you? That in itself is a war crime. But the only war crimes the Israeli's seem to care about are the ones that help them in whatever cause they are after.

A US ship in the area. Try to destroy it.
A UN shelter in the area. Destroy it.

LOL! Read the article I was responding to (Dari's post when I asked for a credible source). They didn't destroy a school because they were attacked from a position near it, they attacked a position *near* it and idiots translated that to "ZOMG they attacked a UN School/Shelter! A UN SCHOOL/SHELTER, CORAL!" "Near" is what the article said. I am quoting it because you keep stupidly leaving it out. Now I see that you really are so twisted that you can't ecen figure out what "near" means even when I try to correct you. FFS, just stop before you make an even bigger fool of yourself.

 

[emperus]

And if the Declaration of Independence stated "Great Britain shall remain until Americans eliminate it, and all who die to kill Englishmen shall be forever rewarded in heaven!" you might have a point.

There's a big difference between hiding amongst a civilian population and using them as human shields.


Equating 18th century American Revolutionaries to Hamas is laughable.

Yeah, so we can all agree then that we as Americans hid weapons and fought out of homes and civilian areas. An understanding of history would easily make that point. I think that was the point even though you tried to go off on some remote tangent.

So, now maybe you can elaborate as to what the difference is between hiding weapons in civilian homes and using a civilian population as a human shield. Or you can elaborate as to why the American revolution was dissimilar to the Palestinian fight.

But, you probably won't be able to.

 

[Ichinisan]

A US ship in the area. Try to destroy it.
A UN shelter in the area. Destroy it.

LOL at self delusion!

So, what is Hamas doing the right way?

 

[emperus]

LOL! Read the article I was responding to (Dari's post when I asked for a credible source). They didn't destroy a school because they were attacked from a position near it, they attacked a position *near* it and idiots translated that to "ZOMG they attacked a UN School/Shelter! A UN SCHOOL/SHELTER, CORAL!" "Near" is what the article said. I am quoting it because you keep stupidly leaving it out. Now I see that you really are so twisted that you can't ecen figure out what "near" means even when I try to correct you. FFS, just stop before you make an even bigger fool of yourself.

Near, at or close to resulted in the school/shelter being hit and 10 deaths of people in the UN school/shelter. So they bombed a UN school/shelter. End of Discussion.

Or are you saying they were not either aware there was a UN shelter there or not aware how much destruction one of their mortars does?

 

[emperus]

LOL at self delusion!

So, what is Hamas doing the right way?

What are you arguing. They didn't try to destroy a US ship or destroy a UN school/shelter?

As to the US ship. Here is a history lesson.
http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/israel-attacks-uss-ilibertyi

During the Six-Day War, Israeli aircraft and torpedo boats attack the USS Liberty in international waters off Egypt's Gaza Strip. The intelligence ship, well-marked as an American vessel and only lightly armed, was attacked first by Israeli aircraft that fired napalm and rockets at the ship. The Liberty attempted to radio for assistance, but the Israeli aircraft blocked the transmissions. Eventually, the ship was able to make contact with the U.S. carrier Saratoga, and 12 fighter jets and four tanker planes were dispatched to defend the Liberty. When word of their deployment reached Washington, however, Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara ordered them recalled to the carrier, and they never reached the Liberty. The reason for the recall remains unclear

Back in the Mediterranean, the initial air raid against the Liberty was over. Nine of the 294 crewmembers were dead and 60 were wounded. Suddenly, the ship was attacked by Israeli torpedo boats, which launched torpedoes and fired artillery at the ship. Under the command of its wounded captain, William L. McGonagle, the Liberty managed to avert four torpedoes, but one struck the ship at the waterline. Heavily damaged, the ship launched three lifeboats, but these were also attacked--a violation of international law. Failing to sink the Liberty, which displaced 10,000 tons, the Israelis finally desisted. In all, 34 Americans were killed and 171 were wounded in the two-hour attack. In the attack's aftermath, the Liberty managed to limp to a safe port.

AS to the UN school.
Just watch the news.

 

[Ichinisan]

Near, at or close to resulted in the school/shelter being hit and 10 deaths of people in the UN school/shelter. So they bombed a UN school/shelter. End of Discussion.

Or are you saying they were not either aware there was a UN shelter there or not aware how much destruction one of their mortars does?

So all Hamas has to do is go near shelters and schools to fire their rockets at Israeli schools and cafés! BRILLIANT!

 

[irishScott]

Yeah, so we can all agree then that we as Americans hid weapons and fought out of homes and civilian areas. An understanding of history would easily make that point. I think that was the point even though you tried to go off on some remote tangent.

So, now maybe you can elaborate as to what the difference is between hiding weapons in civilian homes and using a civilian population as a human shield. Or you can elaborate as to why the American revolution was dissimilar to the Palestinian fight.

But, you probably won't be able to.

Actually it's extremely easy.

Did the American revolutionaries place women and children near their cannon emplacements on the battlefield, or otherwise intentionally place them directly in the sights of British guns? No. Does Hamas place women and children near their rocket and mortar sites with the sole intent of forcing Israel to kill them so their deaths can be used a propaganda? Yes.

And FYI the British also fought out of homes and civilian areas as part of the Quartering Act and the natural course of war (they needed to conquer and suppress rebel-held towns and cities).

And I already explained the 2nd point, but since you clearly lack a primary school education I'll repeat the point: Was the stated goal of the American Revolution a holy war to exterminate Britain? No. Is the stated goal of Hamas a holy war to exterminate Israel? Yes.

Were American Revolutionaries promised a place in heaven for killing British soldiers? No. Are Hamas fighters promised a place in heaven for killing Israelis? Yes.

For someone who claims an understanding of history, you would fail one of my 4th grade history quizzes.

 

[Ichinisan]

What are you arguing. They didn't try to destroy a US ship or destroy a UN school/shelter?

You're arguing that Israel deliberately attacked its strongest ally. You're arguing that it is less likely (or impossible) for such a thing to be an accident. You're deluding yourself.

What's more likely?

1. That Israel would deliberately attack its strongest ally...

2. That Israel would accidentally attack its strongest ally...

Think about your answer.

 

[emperus]

You're arguing that Israel deliberately attacked its strongest ally. You're arguing that it is less likely (or impossible) for such a thing to be an accident. You're deluding yourself.

What's more likely?

1. That Israel would deliberately attack its strongest ally...

2. That Israel would accidentally attack its strongest ally...

I am. Isreal cares only about Isreal. Look at how they tried to embarrass John Kerry and Obama last week.

Go google it and find out. Do some research yourself instead of believing what someone has obviously fed you.

Ask yourself how they attack by accident and obviously marked US ship or are you arguing the US ship wasn't marked? You believe their military is that incompetent? Then go read what some of the sailors on the ship wrote about the incident.

 

[Ichinisan]

Go google it and find out. Do some research yourself instead of believing what someone has obviously fed you.

Ask yourself how they can attack and obviously marked US ship. Are their military that incompetent. Then go read what some of the sailors on the ship wrote about the incident.

Ask yourself: Why?

Ask yourself: Is Israel stupid or smart? Can you simply argue "both" whenever it suits you?

Ask yourself: How would Israel benefit from sinking the US ship?

 

[irishScott]

You're arguing that Israel deliberately attacked its strongest ally. You're arguing that it is less likely (or impossible) for such a thing to be an accident. You're deluding yourself.

What's more likely?

1. That Israel would deliberately attack its strongest ally...

2. That Israel would accidentally attack its strongest ally...

I'm pretty sure he's delighting more in people responding to his inane posts than anything else, don't take him too seriously. He's not making any important decisions on the matter one way or another. People like him can be useful as debate training though. They'll give you inane challenges and continually ask you to elaborate obvious points, forcing you to form a more complete argument.

 

[Newell Steamer]

These forums generally dislike abusive and heavy handed government tactics,.. yet, when it comes to Israel - they get praised.

A cop sneezes on a suspect: multiple threads about how this country is going down the shitter. And, expectations that cops should somehow and magically disarm criminals. That the lightest of light tactics need to be used. Full and undoubtable restraint must be used,.. even if the suspect is firing off a bazooka and sub machine gun at the same time after killing a group of random innocent people.

The IDF kills thousands of Palestinians: the Palestinians had it coming,...