• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."

Tibetans are taking wrong actions in SF

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

orangat

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2004
1,579
0
0
Originally posted by: Drift3r
I don't think you'll ever see a US or European style democracy in China. Not even a Japanese style one. China has had a long history of wanting and craving strong central governments which even predates the current Communist government today. The only instances of Democratic or Republic style rule in China were fraught with corruption and ended up in utter failure.
........
You have to be more charitable when reading history or cultures because history is by definition contingent and happenstance. Taiwan and Korea had military dictatorships for decades after WW2 not because they had a history of strong rulers. Also take into account that much of history in China were probably written by some self-congratulatory Confucian scholar.

There is no gene or genetic propensity for chopsticks, democracy, corruption or stir fries.
 

Drift3r

Guest
Jun 3, 2003
3,572
0
0
Originally posted by: orangat
Originally posted by: Drift3r
I don't think you'll ever see a US or European style democracy in China. Not even a Japanese style one. China has had a long history of wanting and craving strong central governments which even predates the current Communist government today. The only instances of Democratic or Republic style rule in China were fraught with corruption and ended up in utter failure.
........
You have to be more charitable when reading history or cultures because history is by definition contingent and happenstance. Taiwan and Korea had military dictatorships for decades after WW2 not because they had a history of strong rulers. Also take into account that much of history in China were probably written by some self-congratulatory Confucian scholar.

There is no gene or genetic propensity for chopsticks, democracy, corruption or stir fries.
Yet there is such a thing as culture of which China's has been around for longer then the US and many European countries have existed. Chinese culture for a very, very long time has supported and slanted more toward law, order and prosperity for the many above the needs of the "individual" in China since it first came together a unified nation. We can put a American slant on Chinese history all we want but it won't change the nature of Chinese culture and China's history.
 

orangat

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2004
1,579
0
0
Won't change the nature of Chinese culture or the Chinese themselves?

While I agree there is such a thing as culture, the Chinese (or any other group) can also do just about anything with equal propensity. As I have said earlier history is by definition something of a contigency. China certainly has enough of unlawful disorderly famine ridden events after being unified in its long and bumpy history.

You mentioned law, order and putting the community above the individual smells suspiciously close to the so called 'Asian values' espoused by some Asian leaders.With such values, they reasoned individual rights, freedom of speech, press, assembly, normal checks and balances (that any good democracy should have) can be de-emphasised. In fact such 'values' only help to confer moral legitimacy for their hard line undemocratic authoritarian regimes.

Democracy, law and order, individual rights are universal values not cultural dictates. Korea and Taiwan didn't choose harsh military dictatorships after WW2 because of a cultural craving for strong ruler type.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
6
76
I was watching an interview with the Dalai Lama and Dan Rather.
The Dalai Lama has to be one of the coolest people I have ever watched.
You can tell by the way he speaks he is a very spiritual person, but not to the point of being overly so. He just seems like the kind of guy you could sit down and have a beer with.

He is denouncing the violence and asking people to stop interfering with the torch.

You can watch online the interview they did with him about tibet at :
http://www.hd.net/drr234.html
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,134
38
91
Chinese people don't care about democracy, so why force it down their throats? They want to make money and lead a quiet life. Democracy is too messy. Hell, look at Japan, we gave them democracy and they've only voted for one party the past 60 years:laugh:.
 

orangat

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2004
1,579
0
0
Originally posted by: Dari
Chinese people don't care about democracy, so why force it down their throats? They want to make money and lead a quiet life. Democracy is too messy. Hell, look at Japan, we gave them democracy and they've only voted for one party the past 60 years:laugh:.
You're just joking I assume, so my comment below isn't directed at you.
The US has gotten in alot of trouble all over the world by trying to 'give' democracy. In Japan's case, the US has undermined democracy by covertly supporting that one said party for several decades. Military dictators in Korea, Taiwan, Indonesia, Philippines were also supported for decades with arms and aid.

I'll repeat that history and culture is shaped by people (not races or ethnicity) and people can do anything. So called 'Asian values' espoused by authoritarian Asian leaders have more in common with German Kultur in early 20th century or elites anywhere who insist that democracy is somehow incompatible with the national psyche.


Originally posted by: Modelworks
I was watching an interview with the Dalai Lama and Dan Rather.
The Dalai Lama has to be one of the coolest people I have ever watched.
You can tell by the way he speaks he is a very spiritual person, but not to the point of being overly so. He just seems like the kind of guy you could sit down and have a beer with.

He is denouncing the violence and asking people to stop interfering with the torch.
.........
The Dalai Lama is so cool, he personally petitioned the British govt NOT to extradite Pinochet to Spain to stand trial for crimes against humanity.

Don't get me wrong, the Dalai Lama has his good sides but it is important to know the truth about his cold war background and also to judge him by what he actually does.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY