Three reasons why the House GOP isn’t going to win the payroll tax-cut fight

[woolfe9999]

^ Yeah except spidey was claiming they got the tax increases on GSE mortgages out of there. Which is false.

I was just marveling at the fact that something Spidey wrote was barely true. For once. Technically they didn't pass the exact Senate bill. It was only 99% identical.

 

[Paul98]

I think it's kind of funny that the democrats come out looking like they won this one. When other than the pay roll tax extension they got nothing else they wanted. While the republicans were able to put in the pipeline, and a bunch of other stuff they wanted, and did have any tax on people making money over a million a year. The only thing that the democrats got that they wanted was the extension, and at that they didn't get the full year that they wanted. While the republicans got everything they wanted minus the full year, and some of them also didn't want the extension.

 

[Fern]

You realize that the Bush tax cuts will go away without anyone passing any other bill, right?

If you look at the context of our discussion we're (or me anyway) discussing only the repeal of the cuts for the wealthy.

Obviously I'm aware of the expiration of the recent extension, not that it's relevant since it's expiration doesn't require any further legislation. Passing legislation and expiring legislation are such different things it's hard to imagine how you could be further off point, and harder still to imagine what your point could possibly be.

Fern

 

[senseamp]

I think it's kind of funny that the democrats come out looking like they won this one. When other than the pay roll tax extension they got nothing else they wanted. While the republicans were able to put in the pipeline, and a bunch of other stuff they wanted, and did have any tax on people making money over a million a year. The only thing that the democrats got that they wanted was the extension, and at that they didn't get the full year that they wanted. While the republicans got everything they wanted minus the full year, and some of them also didn't want the extension.

The question of how to pay for the full year is still on the table. Republicans desperately wanted to get it done this year, because they know that the Democrats will have more leverage in an election year. Not only that, but by making this big fuss over it, they gave Democrats even more leverage. Now the Republicans are going to have to pass an extension, and if they don't want to raise taxes on millionaires, they'll either have to add to deficits and look like hypocrites, or cut unemployment insurance or something else and piss off more people. And if there is another stalemate, it makes people say, what the hell is wrong with the GOP, they just can't govern.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

Every time the Republicans play this brinksmanship game they lose politically. The American public truly doesn't want to see it, which is why Congress's approval rating is sub 10%. This is not a tactic they can simply use whenever they feel like it, it comes with major political risk. My thoughts at the present moment are that the GOP is in for a world of hurt in '12 as almost none of their positions are particularly palatable and the one thing they've always had in their backpocket, taxes, is being used by the Democrats against them.

I foresee major Democratic victories in '12 and the resurgence of Obama when he wins reelection. Let's remember, Clinton himself did not come out the gate firing in his first term either. His was filled with several notable failures.

 

[LTC8K6]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog...ns-dollars-passed-through-congress-empty-cha/

Wonderful...what a joke...

 

[Darwin333]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog...ns-dollars-passed-through-congress-empty-cha/

Wonderful...what a joke...

Wait, how is that even legit? How can a law be passed that no one (at least in the House) voted on? Can they do stuff like that for any piece of legislation they want? Just wait for everyone to leave and pass it with a handful of members present?

 

[Darwin333]

That's not going to happen, the house, who won by a landslide in the historic election of 2010 have a mandate to not raise taxes and to cut spending. That's what The People sent them there to do.

Keep up the class warfare democrats, keep it up. It's a winning ticket for republicans - we kept taxes low, forced democrats to not raise your taxes, AND cut spending. win/win/win and winning.

What spending of any significance has been cut? And don't give me that "we aren't going to increase spending as much next year so that equals a cut" BS either.

 

[hal2kilo]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog...ns-dollars-passed-through-congress-empty-cha/

Wonderful...what a joke...

Absolutely agree. The Moony owned Washington Times is a joke.

 

[LTC8K6]

Wait, how is that even legit? How can a law be passed that no one (at least in the House) voted on? Can they do stuff like that for any piece of legislation they want? Just wait for everyone to leave and pass it with a handful of members present?

Who knows?

The whole thing is just one big circle jerk and nothing ever changes. The spending goes on and on, the waste continues unabated, and the debt piles up and up...and we all pretend we can't see...

When they can actually tell you they don't need to read the bills they vote on, and it doesn't bother them, you know we're in trouble.

 

[fskimospy]

Wait, how is that even legit? How can a law be passed that no one (at least in the House) voted on? Can they do stuff like that for any piece of legislation they want? Just wait for everyone to leave and pass it with a handful of members present?

It passed by unanimous consent. If someone in the House had actually objected to it being passed like that they most certainly could have stopped the procedure. No, the Speaker of the House can't just show up on the floor at midnight when nobody is around and pass the "John Boehner is King of America Act of 2011" or anything.

 

[the DRIZZLE]

It passed by unanimous consent. If someone in the House had actually objected to it being passed like that they most certainly could have stopped the procedure. No, the Speaker of the House can't just show up on the floor at midnight when nobody is around and pass the "John Boehner is King of America Act of 2011" or anything.

How can they object if they are already in their home districts? This is disturbing for a number of reasons. IMO the final version of every bill should be voted on by both chambers.

 

[LTC8K6]

It passed by unanimous consent. If someone in the House had actually objected to it being passed like that they most certainly could have stopped the procedure. No, the Speaker of the House can't just show up on the floor at midnight when nobody is around and pass the "John Boehner is King of America Act of 2011" or anything.

The article basically says otherwise. There was no time for any possible objectors to make it back to object.

If a single member of either chamber had objected, the deal would have been scuttled. But some members didn't even get that chance — given the time difference between the final agreement Thursday and Friday morning's action, it's unlikely West Coast lawmakers could have made it even if they'd wanted to object.

Tim Huelskamp, a Kansas Republican, told CNN he had considered objecting but said the timing of the deal left him no time to make it back to Washington.

"By the time we were notified that the unanimous consent agreement would be offered, where I come from in Kansas, I can't get to Washington quick enough on this short notice," he told the network on Friday.

He said the GOP's leaders broke their own pledge to give all members three days to read legislation before putting bills on the floor for action.

And again we see that they really had little to no time to read or study the legislation.

"Unanimous" is all people will hear, as if they all read, understood, and agreed to the bill, and voted for it.

Later, we will hear about the problems with it...like the mortgage fee, that will last forever, even though the tax cut is only for 2 months...

 

[Darwin333]

It passed by unanimous consent. If someone in the House had actually objected to it being passed like that they most certainly could have stopped the procedure. No, the Speaker of the House can't just show up on the floor at midnight when nobody is around and pass the "John Boehner is King of America Act of 2011" or anything.

The story I read said that a member would have objected but he couldn't make it back in time. That doesn't sound like "unanimous consent" when at least one person intended on not consenting.

 

[sm625]

lol, fucking idiot.

I cant expect you to comprehend this, but they are lying about how they're going to pay for it. $17 a month on a 200k mortgage is complete fantasy. Their meddling has just opened up a huge wound in the housing market. First of all that $17 is not an insignificant portion of a monthly mortgage payment. We're talking as much as 3%. Basically what it means is you can kiss goodbye 3% of housing values right off the bat. Ouch. And it kills off a whole bunch of investments that betted on a housing revovery in 2011/2012. Talk about losing much more than the $33 billion cost of the tax cut. No, the real cost of this tax cut is, as usual, well north of 100% more than they claim. It always is. I would estimate nearly $200 billion. (Yes $200 billion in total cost /economic damage done by a two month tax cut extension) It all comes back to the marginal cost of debt, which is currently around $6. ie it takes $6-$9 of debt to create one dollar of GDP. It never used to be this way, indeed in the past it was the opposite. 30 years ago it took $1 of debt to create 3 or 4 or 5 dollars of GDP. These people are very dangerous, they do not realize how much damage they do to the economy while playing their games.

 

[senseamp]

The story I read said that a member would have objected but he couldn't make it back in time. That doesn't sound like "unanimous consent" when at least one person intended on not consenting.

If it was important enough for him to object, he would not have skipped town in the first place.

In the space of 90 seconds Rep. Jo Ann Emerson, a Missouri Republican, asked that a bill be introduced, it be excused from going through the regular committee process, the required reading of the legislation be waived and the measure be considered to have passed.

GOP hates democracy

 

[First]

I cant expect you to comprehend this, but they are lying about how they're going to pay for it. $17 a month on a 200k mortgage is complete fantasy. Their meddling has just opened up a huge wound in the housing market. First of all that $17 is not an insignificant portion of a monthly mortgage payment. We're talking as much as 3%. Basically what it means is you can kiss goodbye 3% of housing values right off the bat. Ouch. And it kills off a whole bunch of investments that betted on a housing revovery in 2011/2012. Talk about losing much more than the $33 billion cost of the tax cut. No, the real cost of this tax cut is, as usual, well north of 100% more than they claim. It always is. I would estimate nearly $200 billion. (Yes $200 billion in total cost /economic damage done by a two month tax cut extension) It all comes back to the marginal cost of debt, which is currently around $6. ie it takes $6-$9 of debt to create one dollar of GDP. It never used to be this way, indeed in the past it was the opposite. 30 years ago it took $1 of debt to create 3 or 4 or 5 dollars of GDP. These people are very dangerous, they do not realize how much damage they do to the economy while playing their games.

I'm sorry but, like your other thread, you're going to have to make an attempt to cite your sources as it seems your grasp on reality is a bit on edge.

 

[JSt0rm]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog...ns-dollars-passed-through-congress-empty-cha/

Wonderful...what a joke...

From the comments:

A driver was stuck in a traffic jam on the highway outside Washington, DC. Nothing was moving. Suddenly, a man knocks on the window.
The driver rolls down the window and asks, “What’s going on?”

“Terrorists have kidnapped Congress, and they’re asking for a $100 million dollar ransom. Otherwise, they’re going to douse them all in gasoline and set them on fire. We’re going from car to car, collecting donations.”

“How much is everyone giving, on average?” the driver asks.

The man replies, “Roughly a gallon.”


:biggrin: